I told him "I don't love you anymore" and it's like I never said a word. This isn't normal.

[tobeheard]

Just want a bit of advice really.
Quick background - me and DP have a dd of 17 months. Our relationship had problems before I got pregnant, and since our dd came along we've barely had a relationship, separate beds for the last year, no sex since dd was conceived, he's a self-employed workaholic, we spend no time together, eat tea in different rooms now etc. Basically our relationship has totally broken down due to my resentment towards him.

Anyway, to cut a long story short, 2 weeks ago I told him I no longer love him, cannot love him as too many patronizing and belittling things have been said, I can't deal with the lack of support with dd and no help at home, no sex life, no social life, we just basically have no relationship at all, we are two flatmates with a dd. When I told him he wasn't surprised at all and told me I had to decide what to do, that he hadn't made the decision, it was up to me and to get back to him when I'd decided.

This is the bit I don't understand - since that evening 2 weeks ago he is acting like the conversation never happened, he's chirpy, being nicer to me, like he's not bothered at all. Perhaps he is relieved? I let things lie for a week and then asked him to talk a week ago - he got defensive and refused saying I'd said all I needed to say and we can talk another time. It has now been 2 weeks. He hasn't brought it up at all, he's not acting moodily or angrily or upset or anything. He is acting totally normal. I need to discuss things further, financial things, dd things, the practicalities. But if he won't acknowledge what needs to happen then what do I do?

Surely, if someone you were with told you they didn't love you anymore you wouldn't carry on as things were before would you?

I'm just bloody confused!! Can anyone shed any light? For the record, we have a huge communication problem - ie, he gets very defensive if I try to talk about relationship things, everything always gets swept under the carpet.

You told him you didn't love him and he isn't bothered. The only difference for a week is to be chirpy, and nicer to you.

He simply does not listen to you or take you seriously.

If you fast forward a decade, can you imagine living the way you are now? He wants you to decide what to do but is not helping by not talking about how he feels.

If the ball truly is in your court, and you truly do not love him, you need to tell him as he is unwilling to discuss things and wants you to choose, with one hand tied behind your back the choice is obvious. The way you live is so not normal. I wish you well and send you support but you need to take action and plan ahead.

I need to discuss things further, financial things, dd things, the practicalities. But if he won't acknowledge what needs to happen then what do I do?

You take action yourself.

He doesn't have to cooperate if he doesn't want to. Make the choice the you want, and then set it in motion. JUst like he is completely entitled not to cooperate in a split, you are completely entitled to go ahead with it without his cooperation.

There are courts and lawyers to deal with the practicalities that he doesn't want to discuss with you.

"rightchoice" - yes, exactly, he doesn't listen to me or take me seriously. I am guessing that he is thinking I was just having a blow out and it'll all blow over. Thing is, it won't. He is a decent guy but I know for sure now that we are incompatible. As you say, fast forward ten years and my feelings still won't count, we'll still have no life together, he'll still be a workaholic, still no sex or discussions to work to make that better, I'll still feel lonely.7
It's hard as he is a decent bloke (although he def has issues with communication and belitttling re money/jobs etc).

Other posters, I guess I was just hoping that as an adult he would sit down with me and talk about what was said. As you say HotDamn, he doesn't have to cooperate if he doesn't want to, but we have a child together, we need to work out the practicalities. I don't want courts and lawyers,it's not like we hate each other. I guess I wanted us to both realise that we are unhappy together and go from there. I know he's not happy with me, which is why I find it odd that he won't discuss things.

Until I know the practicalities of finances, where to live etc I can't really go forward. Maybe I just need to give him the options and see what he says, tell him I'm looking at flats or something. I know we have no future, not as a couple, I can't see a way back now. I can't stand the idea of my dd growing up without a normal childhood with both parents in the house as I had a wonderful childhood. Yet, if I stay in this "relationship", it'll just be unhappy all round. You can't have a relationship where you sleep in separate rooms, don't eat together, do nothing at all together, have no intimacy, can't communicate, have no common interests can you? I don't think so.

He flatly refuses to go to Relate.

I guess I wanted us to both realise that we are unhappy together and go from there. I know he's not happy with me, which is why I find it odd that he won't discuss things.

He won't discuss things because it suits him fine to stall things that way: it maintains the status quo, unless you are willing to break it.

Hi, sorry to hear about this. It really doesn't sound as though there's much of a relationship to salvage.

What is your finanancial situation?

You might find this useful:
www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/your_family/family_index_ew/ending_a_relationship_when_you_re_living_together.htm#financial_arrangements_at_the_end_of_a_relationship

You are not happy bring up your child in a home where there is no love. He obviously does not feel any incentive at all, despite what he has to lose. So sad. You must feel invisible and neglected. Good luck with your plans, if you need help or suggestions MN is the place to ask, there will be many who have experienced the same and have moved on.

I guess you now need help in what to do next and how to move forward?

yes, I guess he is trying to stall things, understandable really as if/when I go I will obviously be moving out with dd and of course that is going to rip him apart (even though I have assured him 100% that I want him to co-parent, of course I do).

I feel so guilty about it, he is a decent guy as in he doesn't cheat/beat me up/go out getting pissed/ blah blah blah. I read some of the stories on here and he is a saint compared to that, to what some poor women have to experience. But I don't see a future with him anymore, there is no relationship.

Financially I am a SAHM. He has said our dd will not go without so I know he will help with that. I would have to go on benefits until I can work until I can study (I am hoping to do a masters degree next year, retrain to provide for a better future etc). I hate the thought of going on benefits, especially when it's not like I am in deep trouble and have to leave due to abuse or something.

But what can you do when there is nothing of a relationship left? When you are just strangers?

I wanted to talk again so he knows I am serious, so we can move forward. What I don't want is 4 years to have suddenly passed stalling and dd is 5 and totally cut up when we split. At least this way she won't know any different yes? Am I being naive? She is 17 months old and she and I share a room and he has his own room. She needs her own room now and the thought of sharing with DP would be so weird after a year, it would be wrong.

Am I supposed to be just stay for dd's sake? Am I supposed to stay because of the financial issue? Surely life is too short.

You certainly do not have to become a martyr to this 'partnership'. You are not married. Just because he doesn't beat you or go out with other women it does not mean that what you have is 'healthy'. As you say he is a good man but this is about a relationship. You are 'good' he is 'good, but together it is 'not good'. You do need to extract yourself from this stagnant situation. If it can be done without tearing both your feelings to shreads then well done. He has already 'checked out' seemingly. I hope help comes along with some practical suggestions soon.

Thanks RightChoice - "you are good, he is good, but together is not good"....yes, that is it totally.

It's just bloody hard with a dd involved. If it was just me and him then I wouldn't feel so guilty. But her life is just starting. And god, he won't get to live with is dd, that's so so sad. Then again, on the flipside, if he cared enough he would've listened, supported more, wanted to communicate to make things better etc. Not just swept everything under the carpet.

The whole thing is just sad. The friend part of me wants to go and talk to him and say just that, however, as has been the case over the last few months, we have spent all evening in separate rooms,eaten in separate rooms then will sleep in separate rooms. I will go now and say goodnight to him as always and he'll breezily say goodnight back. Then I will go and cry for a few minutes before sleep!

It's madness really.

Thank you all for the replying.

Good night - I will be watching the thread tomorrow to see what comes up. xx

Are you married tbh? Is your name on on the mortgage? Are there other joint assets? If yes then you need to consult a solicitor.
If no then it is a bit more simple - I'd advise looking for a place to rent then getting a claim in for benefits. Part of that will entail applying to the CSA for child support.

Being nicer and chirpier might be because he too wants to end the intolerable situation you've both been living in but he cannot bring himself to act. Or can't be bothered. Are you still doing his washing, the shopping, cleaning etc? Is it very comfortable for him in terms of him not having to do all the house stuff?

Pickgo, no we are not married, my name isn't on the mortgage, there are no joint assets. The only tie we have is our dear beautiful girl.

Yes I think you may be right in what you say re why he is being nicer etc. Yes, I am still doing all the washing/cleaning/cooking/food shopping. Everything as it was before.

I wanted to talk to him last night but his mum is recovering from breast cancer op she had last year and isn't feeling too well and he mentioned it and seemed a bit worried about her so I thought it was best to leave the talk.

re Renting. Where I live is VERY expensive to rent, way more than housing benefit will pay....one of the things I need to discuss with DP, where to live as obviously he needs to be near dd and my friends/support are here.

What is the minimum child maintenance he will have to pay? I read it was 15% of net income, is that correct? Sounds a lot to me?

You can find out how much maintenance he would be expected to pay here:

www.csacalculator.dsdni.gov.uk/calc.asp

If you are splitting up then nice as it is to be close, you need to think about affordability, housing benefit etc. He will also need to be realistic about helping you financially with a move. Have you contributed to the mortgage?

Do take a look at the advice guide I linked to above.

Thanks for that Olgaga, very useful.
And no, I have not contributed to the mortgage as I've been a SAHM.

I have been thinking this through today after posting yesterday. Do you think it would be a good idea to get away for a few days just you and DD so that he knows what if feels like when you are not there, to 'force' him to communicate properly with you so that this does not end without you both really talking and listening to each other. Could you stay with your family for a short while without it being final. Like you say it is your DD who will be missed and will miss out if this ends because you cannot drag any sort of sense out of him.

I am sorry that his mum has been ill but I honestly doubt whether this is the reason he is not talking today, I really do. He has much more at stake than he thinks or realises. He is obviously leaving it to you to decide - a massive sign of weakness - but you deserve to know what is going on in his head. If he really is just trying to ease you out and stonewall you it is cruel. If he really is a good man he needs to act like one for you and DD. Why not ask him what it will take for him to talk honestly, even if he thinks you might not like what he says. Say it calmly and if he refuses to answer or communicate like an adult - frankly there is simply NO HOPE.

tobeheard I am in exactly the same situation (plus another child, married and a few years of me talking and him stuffing his head under the sand). He is good and I am good and the relationship was good before children. Since then, and since I have been a SAHM (not exactly my choice) we have been work collegues (DDs being our job) rather than a couple.
I now know that it is up to me to say it clearly: "you have to move out" or "I am moving out". But for the same reasons you have mentioned it is really hard.

I cannot give you any help, just join you in your request for help and advice and hold your hand whilst we go through this.

Dear expert mnetters please do offer your advice, it will be much apprechiated.

Rightchoice - thanks for your reply. Yes, we often get away as we visit my parents every few weeks for 3 days, dd and I have been doing this for the last year so he knows what it's like when we are not here. When we get home he usually says he's missed us (but at the same time I know it doesn't bother him when we are away as it means he can work all evening (which he does even when we are there) without me 'moaning' at him.

And I totally agree, he does have more at stake than he realises....you would think that if someone was basically saying they are going to have to leave along with dd you would try and do something to make things better, to really communicate etc. He doesn't.

All Quiet - I'm sorry you too are in the same situation (but more complicated). What have you tried to get the relationship back on track? You said you had a good relationship before you children so that is at least a good place to start from. Mine was on the rocks before I got pregnant.
Does you partner listen when you try and tell him how you feel? I am sensing from your message that you are not too happy being a SAHM? DO you think perhaps you need something more (understandably)? Are you missing the old you? What is it that has made you feel as you do now?Sorry, so many questions.

He thinks that if he continues to ignore you, normal domestic service will continue, and that's all that matters to him.

Your DD will be fine if you separate. If he's a basically OK man who just isn't interested in putting effort into a couple-relationship, it shouldn't be too difficult to separate as a couple and become amiable co-parents.

Well, on the bright side tbh, separating sounds like it would be very straightforward for you.

I'm afraid I don't think a determined non-communicator in a relationship provides much hope at all that the relationship can improve. Relationships take two committed partners as I'm sure you are all too aware, and if one person has in effect withdrawn from the relationship it can't continue.

My advice is not to give it too much time or make too many attempts at restoring communication, because living with the [selective] silent treatment is very draining and bad for your self-esteem. Make your plans, get as much money together as you can and make your exit on your own terms... but don't leave it too long and allow yourself to get really dragged down.

pickgo is right living with someone that sees communication as a bad/scary/threathening thing is a future killer. that's why for me therapy was a possible solution, eventhough not sure one can de-learn what your own parents has unfortunately spent years teaching you, Having said that me going to therapy is to do that too so....

in re to your questions : yes we had a good relationship before the dc but it was a very very brief time so not much to go by.Does he listen when you try and tell him how you feel? Not really, I would say. He'd prob say yes. Last year I cried and cried often telling him I was not happpy with my life (not accusing him), like not working not having time for me etc. what did he do? No he does not listen. He does not encourage me to be me because ultimately it is not convenient for him. I am not happy being a SAHM and never have been. I was happy when I worked p/t (unhappy that he did not help me so had double the work, but at least I had a life in which I featured as a separate human being that could breath without being of service to someone else - if nothing else in the time it too to get to work!). I definitely do need something more but now I do not think it will resolve anything. I have gone back to uni last year (or I'd have gone mad) and he did everything not to help and antagonise it. should I be with someone that rather than support me into a life I like pushes me into a life I openly loathe but that serves him well? I am more than missing my old you, yes. I have felt like this for a long time. This year however I finally had some time for myself (dc2 at nursery) and so time to think. Plus I thought that this will make me happier and nicer to dh. unfortunately he hates the fact that ater 6 years I have a minute to breathe and so he keeps making me feel bad for the time without the dc. (did not want to say this but my mum has been very ill recently, cancer, and that has not detered him in thinking that way. and in rel to your dh's mum I can tell you that I'd never use what has happened to my mum to justify my behaviour in the rel - and mine is super fresh. if they do is because they know they are losing grip and feel you are about to fly and want to keep uou down. from what you say you seem a very thoughtful, concerbed and caring person who also feels bad and guilty - like me. they know that and that's the weapon they use. they know that if they'd start being agressive etc we'd take no shit and go).

unless he goes mental I think we would make great exes. having said that someone rightly said you are after the rel how you were in so if we find it hard to communicate imagine after!!!! gosh!!!

Yup, you need rid of this man. He thinks you are a 'woman' which in his head is a cross between a pet and a domestic appliance. You exist to serve and obey hiim. Men like this refuse to accept that women are human beings with the same needs, wishes and rights as men, and he won't change.

hi. given he refuses to talk about things, even though the relationship is obviously in tatters, he is giving you only two options 1) continue as his live in au pair expecting no kind of intimacy or coupledom or 2) leave him.

as you don't enjoy being a sahm and like working part time i think that would be your first port of call, working out what if any part time work is available that you'd be a good candidate for and where you'd need to live in order to be able to get easily to work and childcare etc. you don't want to go on benefits totally so aim for a halfway house of part time work, ctc, wtc etc. maybe your 'partner' would be willing to give you the deposit and first months rent on a place if you discussed it with him having made your decision that you are leaving? otherwise you might need to get that job and save every penny to have a bit of a safety net.

try to imagine a little place of your own, a good nursery or cm place for your dd and a part time job - how does it feel when you imagine it?