I want to tell my toxic, insane, dysfunctional extraordinaire family I am sick of them

[springydaffs]

There you go: I want to let it all out once and for all. I want to list their m-a-n-y insane behaviours and wipe the floor with them. I want to call them names and generally shame them to their boots. I want to be rude and disgraceful.

I don't want to be decent or behave with dignity. I want to snort derision at them.

Which would be completely out of character

I don't think they know they're doing it Sophie! They truly and genuinely believe the scapegoat is all the awful things they think they are. It's called projection I think - they project all their shit onto a convenient vehicle.

As may be apparent in my rant: my family are rabid addicts and are dyed in the wool at not facing their shit.

I was a vessel into which, many a thing that was nothing to do with me was placed! The best thing I ever did was to walk away from scapegoaters! So I am still being blamed from afar, figures!

Yes we probably are. They may feel quite kindly towards us in a way, even sorry for us (you gotta LAFF) because they genuinely believe we are so awful there is no hope for us, and it's all such a sad story about Springy/Sophie.

Full of SHIT I tell you, full of shit.

for anyone who has had to deal with toxic relatives.

I think they still scapegoat from a distance. Well, in my type of family [of origin], anyway. They have to keep thinking you're all the things they say you are, that you are the problem, because the alternative is to realise just what horrible, horrendous, unjust and unjustifiable things they have been doing all these years - and of course they're good people so that couldn't possibly be the case.

My family are quite possibly waiting for me to "come to my senses" one of these days - they'll have a long wait! It will of course never, ever occur to them that they are the ones who need to "come to their senses".

Damn right about the projections, Springy. And well ranted, may I say!

Scapegoats of the world unite, we have nothing to lose but our ingrained self-loathing, compass set for self-destruct, lack of self-esteem, inability to form healthy relationships.... ooh, I seem to have lost a fair bit of that already, how very NICE life seems finally! Something to do with shedding the excess weight of three emotionally insane bullying scapegoating family members, perhaps.....

I have always taken some sort of comfort in the thought that Dhs family would have had to find another victim to suffer the burden of their behaviour.

Unfortunately then, this is often not the case??

Feeling quite disappointed that Dhs actions to cut them all off will be seen as yet another one of his failings instead of them looking at themselves and wondering what they did wrong

The realisation that he will always be the scapegoat is a very sad one.

How on earth does everyone come to terms with that, especially when raised within a pack mentality family?

How on earth does everyone come to terms with that, especially when raised within a pack mentality family?

With lots of grief, anger, time, hard work, and therapy.

Brilliantly written, good for you. You sound amazing and I am about to put a few people in the imaginary stocks myself, great idea!
Above all else take are of you, I sympathise completely with the tremor side, you sound like you have truth and dignity on your side, well done you on surviving your family and coming out the other side.

Thank you hippo.

I found out the hard way that you don't resign from the scapegoat role [in their eyes]. I was shocked that it carried on pumping as strong as ever - in fact, stronger when I was out of the picture.

I agree with lifeisgood re lots of grief, anger, time, hard work, and therapy

I have been following a thread on here (about a woman whose partner has suddenly buggared off) and the advice has been strangely applicable to separating from a toxic family. I'll post up the link.

Thank you for the flowers droves

Here it is

It's very long but worth a read.

I haven't read your link, is it like how you think of an acromious split from an ex, you remember the good bits, you have to remember what an arse they were overall to live with the situation?

Yes I suppose it is but in a bit more detail! Except the ex is toxic/has done the dirty. There really is some excellent advice on there which translates very well to dealing with toxic relatives.

I have received a loooong and detailed letter from my sister. tbh I read the first sentence, then scanned the rest... and closed it up and put it back in the envelope. I do not want to read it. Ever. I don't want to know. She's banging on that I have a MH problem (which I don't - unless you count despair, trauma, depression as a result of being on the end of these insane people all my life) and from the few snatches of sentences I caught it's all the same old same old same old same old same old : it's All Your Fault - and We Are Nice People, It Must Be You. and You're Upsetting Everybody. and How Could You. (and You Make Me Sad)

AS far as I'm concerned, the horse has bolted. I've been on hand for about a century to 'try to sort this out' and now I'm out. I don't want to know. Really. I feel like a donkey here, totally don't want to know, now or ever. It's truly over, there's no tug or guilt or sorrow - just immense relief that at. long. last. they're gone.

aka F-U-C-K O-F-F

(though I don't even feel aggressive, or angry. I don't wish them ill. I just don't want to know. Period. zilch. zip. over. out.)

it's All Your Fault - and We Are Nice People, It Must Be You. and You're Upsetting Everybody. and How Could You. (and You Make Me Sad)

Thats exactly the attitude of DHs family and as a bystander (myself) watching these people, its quite incredible to realise the depth of their belief that they truly are good people, when as an outsider i look at them as totally dysfunctional

What i find more strange is that the people that have married into the family are also so similar in personality to them all and have jumped onto the cause willingly and without question. The cause being that DH is the root of all badness and of course should take responsibility for every wrong done within this family even though he had very limited contact when we met which is now no contact.

He even took responsibility for his Brothers 5 year affair that we both new nothing about. Unbelievable for me but totally acceptable for DH
he didnt even attempt to fight his corner just quiet acceptance. I wanted to rage and confront and humiliate them all. Take them out verbally one by one

I'm amazed others on here are in the same position as i have never seen it played out before having had experience within several families over the years and obviously my old age (nearly 40!!)

I read the link and can see the similarities.

What i really dont understand is the lack of loyalty from your own family maybe i personally wouldnt expect the same level from someone i chose to share my life with but when its your own family the emotional pain must be unbareable.

DH rarely talks about his feelings but i watch him and feel the hurt and see the anger. It hurts me too. He is a good man who just doesnt believe it yet.

Have you found peace within yourself Springy? Does that ever happen?

Marvellous springydaffs, excellent and marvellous!

Fwiiw, I dumped my family, the whole lot of them.Years ago.

The sky did not fall on my head.
They are still toxic but at arms length.
I now enjoy Christmas and life feels good.

Another Wow from me. That was stunning.

Good for you girl

Well, I do feel a peace now mishy. The world feels quiet and just so peaceful. I could cry with it tbh, it is so blissful. That charabanc - all that noise! - was quite a realistic picture of them. Not that they make a lot of noise per se, just the noise they make iygwim? on and on and blood on. It's so blissful to have them gone, the door shut on them.

Your DH is going to need a lot of therapy to up-end all the conditioning y'know. I'm still at it decades later. He may not recognise that - and may think therapy is for ninnies - but perhaps you could get him some literature about scapegoating? I notice that there isn't much about these days on scapegoating though. I actually did cut my family off years ago - it's been on/off for quite a while - but stayed in touch with my parents. tbh I've been waiting for my parents to die so that I could do it but I can't wait any more! If, as she suggests, our mother will die from the grief of the family split, then she's going to have to die: that's kept me in the midst of them for I don't know how many years - no more. I sound hard but if anyone has any idea of the agony of being in this shit they'll get it.

thank you for understanding how painful it is - yes, it is extremely painful, kind of burrows right down into your soul. As you know from your DH

thanks for support, posters

erm, what happened to the paras?

and dad! You're alright ain't ya mate! You had a job to do, like, be a father, but well, you comes first, right? You didn't even notice that it was your job to be a father, to actually care about and see to your family. As long as you had your servant our mother to slave after you and massage your revoltingly endless ego then you was alright!

and mother, you didn't leave your selfish brute of a husband because you were frightened to. Let's call it what it is eh and stop sweeping that little nugget under the fucking carpet. Yes mother, I said fuck. No, no, now come on, don't have a heart attack/stroke

Could have written this myself! Another scapegoat here though others in the family did get a taste of it sometimes if they stepped out of line. There's an interesting article which argues that the scapegoat child is the (relatively) lucky one as he/she gets to be more independent whereas the favourite is engulfed by the toxic parent. Haven't done links before so hope this works:)

daughtersofnarcissisticmothers.com/golden-child-scapegoat.html

There's also an interesting link here on how the scapegoat identity is formed - usually the sensitive or empathetic child is hijacked leading to an inauthentic self and the resentment and bitterness experienced signposts the way back to the authentic self.

www.psychologytoday.com/blog/traversing-the-inner-terrain/201101/the-scapegoat-identity/comments

Food for thought.

Yep, that's it. Second one, anyway.

Great links North.

I must have posted a ghost post...its gone! Sure I had many words of wisdom in there.

I had plenty of letters from my mother and one or two from my sister...summed up

a) I am a nice person
b) you are a horrid person

And a load of sentimental crap ie memories of me when I was too young to fight back. Ah happy days.

You do right not to spend time reading the letter. Let peace reign. I just visulised my family having this hot potato being chucked between them...now I was gone who could they vent their rage on? ...now who would hold the hot potato when Miss Asbestos Gloves had gone??

Take care of yourself. Its a tough time despite the silence.

Allyx

"If, as she suggests, our mother will die from the grief of the family split, then she's going to have to die: that's kept me in the midst of them for I don't know how many years - no more. I sound hard but if anyone has any idea of the agony of being in this shit they'll get it."

Yes, springy, I get it totally. And I wish you all the peace in the world, you surely deserve it. You're right too about how it "burrows down into your soul" and for some of us being apart from them is the only way we can give ourselves space to find our real soul, the part that is really us and that they never managed to get to. A long road, when it's buried that deep.

what fabulous posts. I laughed out loud ally at your 1) and 2).

I had another go at that letter. i know, i know - stupid. But you know the old reasoning: "now come on, be reasonable". It really is a pile of shit, stinks to high heaven. I barely got any further than I did the last time.

this absurd MH dx - that threatens to stick in my craw a bit I must say.

I get the same from my gang of bullies, springy - the diagnosis that I must be mentally unstable, the suicide threats from mother when I dare to voice my feelings about her behaviour...

I have just, finally, accepted the notion that the fact that I resist their bullying does not mean I am insane: it means I am in fact very, very sane and healthy. I was unhealthy when I did not protest their unfair treatment.

HTH. As you know, the way not to let it stick in your craw is to realise that their wacky opinions are their problems, down to their own unresolved issues, and nowt to do with you.

Still loving that rant!

Step away from the letter. Now is not a good time to read it. Put it in loft (inaccessible place) and read it in 5 years...like I did n't. Time really does help perspective and makes you look at the whole issue again and realise, again, that you were right 5 years ago.

MH, well dsis did ask if I was seeing a psychotherapist...I didn't reply but I suspect she has been to one and could tell from the letter I wrote to my mother.

And that old chestnut 'i'm dying'. I can beat you on that one...my mother actually got herself hospitalised to get my attention. Her mother died young from heart condition so when she mentioned to dad that she had palpatations, he rang 999, they blue lighted her to hospital, kept her in for exhaustive tests for a week, and concluded she was as fit as a butchers dog . Then a month after that I double checked her heart was fine by eloping with bf, got married and announced I was pg. Told by phone.

Its hell to go through a break up. I could honestly say that I don't love my mother but I still grieved. Keep hoping a fairy godmother will appear and become my mum :(.

But its 6 years on and she's still around as is my dad and sis and they now have contact with dd (dh always there, he has mad family too so he knows about them). And part of the contact agreement is that they don't contact me. Works well.

Anyway, look at the first post on the stately homes thead with all the details. Your family could try harder and harder to get your attention...death threats, turning people you know against you, tantrumming (sp!?) on doorstep, ringing workplace etc etc. Keep strong, don't give in, ignore, ignore, ignore.

How are you today anyway?

Allyx