Foreplay or oral sex....is it important?

[Emmielu]

I think foreplay is important in a couples sex life. Its that intimacy before having sex & like a huge tease. I've always loved foreplay. But for some reason my boyfriend doesnt. I dont know if its a hygiene thing or hes just not that sort of person. I've brought up the subject of oral sex & hes been fine about me giving him oral sex but not really wanted me to. Once i mention him doing oral sex on me he admits he'd like to but cant. Is it that hes never done it before? Has he been told hes awful at it? Is he unsure if i'll like it? I'll be honest, our sex life is for me boring. He loves our sex life but it is literally either me on top or him on top. Even spicing things up like bringing new positions in doesnt do enough for me to say "WOW!" He doesnt think Lube should be used for anything other than women who struggle to be turned on but even then he doesnt think its useful, i've dressed up once for him & he liked that alot. Sex toys are a no. He has told me his previous relationships have been boring, so would i be wrong in bringing new things into the bedroom? If not, how do i go about it? I feel ashamed & slightly slutty knowing how much is out there & how to use it.

[Warlock]

I see a lot of "one side of the argument" Undoubtedly much of what is posted is true but when do we hear the other side of the story before people rush in to make judgements.

Some men are selfish bastards - true

Some women are selfish bastards - also true

Hasn`t life always been like that ???

[Sapphirefling]

Life is too short to spend it with a man who is selfish in bed. The fact that he makes you feel ashamed and 'slutty' are huge warning signals!

[HardCheese]

His lack of interest in foreplay and his dislike of lube are ringing alarm bells for me because they suggest a basic lack of interest in whether you are uncomfortable or even in pain or not. I agree about foreplay being integrally part of the sex (and it's pretty retrograde that many people still think of it as being a separate, minor issue to penetration), but the point for me is that being penetrated without being sufficiently excited by whatever has been going on before penetration is often uncomfortable or actually painful for the woman. It's not even just ('just'!) about a woman orgasming, it's the difference between penetration being enjoyable and it being potentially painful.

Of course he has a right not to like oral sex, but shoving himself up a woman's dry vagina without giving two hoots about what it feels like for her is another thing.

[Emmielu]

He has currently decided to loose weight as he thinks that's part of the problem for our sex life being boring. So is it that he's a little uneasy on his confidence? Do I take this chance to sort of say if you loose weight to your satisfaction I'll pull in all different things for us to try. Books, films etc. I don't want to get rid of him because aside from the sex he's really wonderful. I think sex is something we can change & if the chance is there I'd like to take it.

[BasilRathbone]

You know, there are thousands of other wonderful men out there, who already know how to have good sex with a woman.

In this very important area of a relationship, his behaviour is an indicator that actually, he isn't wonderful.

[Emmielu]

Is it me then? Does he not find me very sexually attractive? His past sexual relationships have been in his words "basic".

[MiladyGardenia]

It most emphatically is not you.

This is all on him, not you.

[BasilRathbone]

No, it so isn't you.

It sounds to me like you are used to spending a lot of wasted brain-space on men.

If it works, it works - you really don't need to agonise about it, think about how to make it work, plan how to make it better - if at this quite early stage of your relationship, the sex is rubbish, trust me, it's never going to get better and tbh it's probably a sign of a lot of other things wrong too.

You don't actually need to have him in your life you know. You can be single and that a) you are not wasting brain space and time on trying to solve something insoluble and b) you will have more time to do stuff you want to do and c) nice men who actually know how to make sex nice, will know that you are single and you might hook up with one of them instead of this guy.

[msrisotto]

It's not you, it's him.

How can he disapprove of lubricant? The only conceivable things I can think of involve him not giving a shit about your comfort, let alone enjoyment.

Sex is not all about him. Fair enough if he doesn't want to give oral sex, fine (I certainly wouldn't give it if I were you, it has to be reciprocal) but apart from that, other non penetrative sex is absolutely essential for your comfort, obviously not for his because if it was, you'd be doing it....

Selfish bastard is all I can think!

[LunarRose]

oh for pity sake can the pair of you not talk to each other???

He's busy losing weight cos he's worried you don't fancy him and your posting on the internet because your convinced his lack of interest in sex toys is because he doesn't care about you. Yes I would say the pair of you are feeling lacking confidence in this relationship

Have you actually told him how necessary foreplay and lube are for you? to be honest if he's only been with woman who don't need them: how the hell would he know it was necessary for you and it wasn't just that you didn't fancy him? Frankly the only time I needed lube it was after the birth of DS and it was because I didn't fancy XH enough.

He might be feeling totally inadequate which is putting the shutdown on things.

But frankly unless you have as frank a discussion with him as you've had with him how do you know if he's a dick or a totally self concious guy??

[LunarRose]

sorry should have been as frank a discussion with him as you've had with us how do you know if he's a dick or a totally self concious guy??

[SchrodingersMew]

LunarRose - Fair enough to no oral or toys as some people including women don't like them but lube!?
I mean, if you're not going to make an effort in the foreplay department, that's shit but why say no to lube?

He isn't compromising at all, all about him. I really wouldn't put up with it.

[BasilRathbone]

D'you know what, why bother?

Sex really shouldn't be this difficult.

At this stage of a relationship, where no-one has invested very much, why on earth should anyone go to so much trouble to get it right? There are literally millions of men who are perfectly capable of showing women a good time - why on earth waste brain space on one who can't be bothered to?

I'm really puzzled by this. If he's a nice guy in other respects, then be his friend. You don't need to go to bed with your friends. But in a lover, one of the pre-requisites is that you can please each other in bed. If you can't do that in the early stages of a relationship, seriously, it is really very unlikely that you'll be able to do it further down the line.

[Casmama]

I think you could carry on bringing more and more things into the bedroom but if he is not prepared to do the basics ie foreplay, oral sex and he has a problem with lube then I really don't think its going to get you anywhere. You need to ask him why your enjoyment of sex is of so little importance to him and if you don't get a better idea of what his hang ups are and are completely sure that you can work through them together then get rid. Sorry to be harsh but there are nice men out there who are good in bed to and don't make you feel like a slut for wanting a half decent shag.

[Casmama]

too

[LunarRose]

I think there are two sides to this story and at the moment you just can't see both.

No lube really isn't essential for all women. I would never have assumed it was essential until I needed after the birth of DC2 (and as i siad that really was because the love had gone by then). If you are already self concious (ie your losing weight because your convinced your partner doesn't fancy you enough, it's quite logical that he would have assumed the lube is necessary because the OP doesn't fancy him.

The foreplay is an issue but it does sounds more to me that the OP's DP is so convinced that it's simply because she doesn't fancy him, that he's just gone into shutdown on the issue.

I can quite imagine how a sexually "boring" man would feel somewhat inadequate and need some guidance when faced with a sexually adventurous female. Given time and patience on both partners part they might be able to meet in the middle.

OF course it could just be that he's a dick and they're too sexually incompatable for it to work.

[LunarRose]

sory that should read oF course it could just be that he's a dick or they're too sexually incompatable for it to work.

I just don't think that you can tell yet

[SchrodingersMew]

I can see where you are coming from LunarRose, it's a kind of catch 22 isn't it?
I know that in the past my DP has gotten a bit funny about my vibrator use, I think it made him feel a bit inadequite but I use them when we're having sex as I can't orgasm through penetration alone but I like the intimacy of having an orgasm then.
Never used to need lube either but do like it on occasion. :o

[LunarRose]

Yes it is exactly a catch 22.

At the moment he' never going to feel comfortable enough to experiment if he's convinced that sex aids are only necessary because she doesn't fancy him.

She's never going to show him how turned on she could get with him because he's not doing the things that turn her on.

Some people just don't like all the extra stuff in the bedroom, if there isn't a compromise they are just too sexually incompatible to work.

Of course none of this will become apparent unless they actually talk about the problem.

If he isn't prepared to actually talk about the issue then write him of as a dick.

But this is a man trying to lose weight to make the OP fancy him more. It really doesn't sound like the sex thing has gone wrong because he doesn't care.

[ElusiveCamel]

Some people just don't like all the extra stuff in the bedroom
But what is 'extra stuff'? People are so focused on sex = penis in vagina, that it makes everything else something different 'plain old' or 'proper' sex - either a) 'foreplay' OR b) 'extra' or 'other'

All of it is just sex. While everyone may have (and is entitled) acts they prefer or aren't so keen on, it's really not helpful for anyone to have such rigid distinctions between sex (putting a penis into vagina) and not-sex (everything else)

Even removing the toys aspect (as there is an argument for them being external objects), I think what OP wants shouldn't be considered 'extra' - just a) consideration of her sexual enjoyment and b) an expanded view that encompasses all aspects of sex, not just focussing on one bit of it and thinking that is sex and everything else is something different.

[ElusiveCamel]

Apologies for how badly written that is! Very slight hangover and doing other stuff at the same time :)

[LunarRose]

Elusive - for the most part I agree with you. I just see a different way they might have ended up in the situation they are now.

So I don't like giving a BJ but my DP does. I tell him, but during foreplay he keeps indicating that's what he wants me to do. I'm going to feel pretty withdrawn from the whole experience of foreplay and try and skip over it as quickly as possible. I'm also going to feel fairly withdrawn from the individual as I can't understand where they want me to do something I'm not comfortable with.

End result: two people neither of whom are happy with their sex life. Man thinks woman's not interested in him as a person, woman thinks man isn't interested in her needs.

Now talking honestly about needs wants and desire, what I do and don't like, might restore a bit of intimacy. If both parties are feeling more comfortable that they won't be asked to do something they don't enjoy, then they will feel much more comfortable. Perhaps oral sex is always a sticking point, but they might jointly find something else they like.

Of course there are some people that an expanded version of sex just doesn't work of them. I would hate to go back to sex toys in the bedroom and find the idea of videos utterly abhorrent. If I was a man I just wouldn't be compatible with the OP

Without talking honestly outside of the bedroom neither are going to be able to mould and alter their boundaries (whether they are deliberate or accidental) to make them work

[ElusiveCamel]

from the whole experience of foreplay and try and skip over it as quickly as possible
But this is my point! 'Skip over it' indicates there's a prelude and a main act - rather than it all just being one thing.

I didn't mean that an expanded view included sex toys or videos, I was just talking about the things people do just with each other. So when you first start kissing to whatever you do in the middle and however you finish is all 'having sex', not just the penetrative bit.

I used to be very much like that with my H and people before him, by the way, there was foreplay (which was clearly defined) and then we finished with the bit I liked i.e. the 'real sex' as I was very much focused on that as my goal (as it is how I prefer(red) to orgasm and that was my aim) and everything finished with that. With the person I was with next, the order of things got really mixed up and was far more fluid it was really great, although a little strange at first. What I meant by 'expanded' is to stop thinking of terms of foreplay being separate from 'sex' and all of the things people do as a continuum of the same thing. It helps men too, as well as women, to think like that.

[Leedsboy]

You poor thing - the bedroom is sacred and both should be equal there. Yep he is selfish and there are lots of men out there that don't feel like him. Foreplay is, like the other postings say, the main thing and speaking as a man there is nothing better than being tender and encouraging. Giving your female partner oral is fantastic and gets lots of brownie points and if any men are reading - it is not unpleasant!
Don't know your age but you are a long time 'retired' as they say. In other words a bad relationship should not be endured - get out and enjoy yourself. You may look back in a year (with a new partner perhaps) and be amazed at how you stuck it. Others evidently haven't.
He will not change - if he does it will be reluctantly and not from the heart. With a new partner that treats you how you want to be (ie respected) you may find doing things that hitherto weren't nice but now are if you see what I mean.
PS He is so lucky to have you - he should try going through a divorce and not having sex! Some men don't know they're born.

[Leedsboy]

BJ on an overweight BF? Not nice. Wish you lived in Cornwall so I could treat you right and show you how a GF is respected and listened to.