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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

is this normal?

86 replies

StrangeButTrue · 16/12/2011 20:49

I've just been laughed of chat & advised to come here.

My DH still insists on wiping DS bottom, DS is 8. Other problems but wanted to start with this first.

i'm genuine, not a troll. please tell me what you think. thanks.

OP posts:
SolidGoldStockingFilla · 16/12/2011 22:33

SO you already have DV professionals involved at some level? Involve them more. Get this man out of your home and your lives as much as possible. He is not remotely normal and potentially very dangerous. Because he doesn't see you or the DC as people. You are his possessions that he can treat as he sees fit.

ThatsNotSantasBabyBelly · 16/12/2011 22:38

How is he with the other dc you have together?

Agree this sounds very troubling behaviour

ThisRingsBellsBadBells · 16/12/2011 22:38

OP, your post has really shaken me. This rings bells with me, bad bells.

My father was exactly the same as you describe, always invading our (his kids) privacy. We weren't allowed locks on the toilet or bathroom door and he was constantly nude in the house even up until we were teenagers. Normal boundaries were all broken down and confused and he reacted the exact same way as your husband when challenged, he acted totally affronted and turned it back on us/my Mother as if WE were the weird ones. He also constantly followed us (the children) around the house, I mean stalked us obsessively and was constantly bursting in on us when we were undressing etc. We were not allowed any privacy. Just the same as your H is doing to his son.

He covered all this up with pretending to be all 'right on' and modern and bullshit about not being ashamed of our bodies but it was all wrong. All wrong. He like your husband picked my Mother a younger and more vulnerable woman and she was totally confused herself having being sexually abused as a child. He was sly and was able to cover and explain his behaviour away. He kept her in a state of extreme stress over other things, money etc in order to distract her from what he was doing.

And what he was doing was a lot more than grooming us, he was a raging pedophile who abused many of our cousins. It all came out years and years later.

OP, I don't know if your husband is the same but I can tell you reading your posts has given me cold chills of recognition. Please do not ignore your gut instincts. We all did for years and unknown to us he was abusing our youngest sibling.

NettleTea · 16/12/2011 22:45

Please please realise that this is definately not normal, and your little boy is telling you he doesnt want it. around 7 or 8 little kids start to become big kids and become body aware and need to be free to determine their own boundaries - the little boy who would be happy running around naked in the garden without a care in the world changes into a child who says 'dont look' and covers themselves when changing. it needs to be respected.
It sounds as if there is alot more going on if you have had a professional say that it is abuse - and please understand that 'abuse' is often non-violent - the new term is 'coercive control' if you google you will find alot currently about it. they were right to say not to mention it, as the abuser will use it to manipulate you further - and he is trying to sideline your son against you, and will try to make him collude on your abuse. You are confused. That is normal. thats not your fault, its because he has done that to you in the way that he has controlled the dynamics of your relationship.
Take the time to understand what is happening here - speak to people in real life, but understand that whatever he may say, you wont be able to change him. maybe speak to womens aid and tell them all the things you told the other person who identified the abuse, and what you have told us here. Get more outside perspective on it all, and some good advice as to what you can do.

3littlefrogs · 16/12/2011 22:53

I think you need to take very seriously the advice you have already been given. This man sounds dangerous.

You are vulnerable and, I think, naiive. I think he recognised that and targeted you.

I think there is a real risk of abuse, and I think his behaviour with your son is disturbing.

You must protect your children. Sad

NettleTea · 16/12/2011 22:54

i think the previous professional you spoke to confused matters b calling it domestic violence. she should have said domestic abuse.
Accepting that is what is happening, and it is about control rather than beating, is your first step. Its a big step but there are people here who can help you, believe you and support you and your children to be free from this. This is where MN has its greatest strength, and there are many regular posters on this forum who have been through what you are going through and each one has come out stronger and happier and with a great life ahead for themselves and for their children. Its not easy. Its not nice. It can be frightening and confusing, especially when the partners use all the tricks up their sleeves to try and pull you back into their control. But we know what they will say - we have the script, we can hold your hand and we can be here when you need to vent, or are frightened, or angry. or just offer practical advice and recommend books (Why does he do that, by Lundy Bancroft is the first port of call, but keep it hidden)
You can find strength in our experiences, and the knowledge that we were feeling just as confused and powerless as you, but we got through it.

bigbuttons · 16/12/2011 22:54

op if he doesn't respect your son's right to privacy then that is abuse.

NettleTea · 16/12/2011 23:03

Red flags
Doesnt respect boundaries of you or DS
Tells you that you are mad
Gaslighting 9saying elder kids say he is violent)
possibly trying to cause isolation with older DC see above
Persuading DS to side against you
Too quick declaration of love, involvement and baby
Tells you how to feel/think (not used to intimacy)
Turns criticism back to be your fault
Creates a homelife where you feel unsure and confused about your own instincts

If your instincts are telling you things are creepy and disturbing, believe them
Are you close to your family, or have you moved away to be with him/has he insisted on moving somewhere where you have no other friends? Do you have friends you can talk to?

Fabnewme2011 · 16/12/2011 23:04

I've read all the posts and it makes me feel uneasy about the whole thing. Your husband has issues that he needs to deal with and not put onto the rest of you.

Also, young children tend to be very open and honest and will tell their friends at school and teachers about these things.

Get yourself your own bank account and put money in if you can...as much as you can. Gather your personal documents, passports, birth certificates, insurance documents etc. and get out. You can get into a women's aid shelter. It isn't just domestic violence that qualifies you for a place and support...trust me I know!

Original poster
StrangeButTrue · 16/12/2011 23:04

I have a lot to think about.

Thank you.

There is one more thing (lots of things) that I want to put down in black & white as it were, I haven't told anyone else - I have 2 fab friends I can usually say anything to, not this -

when DH was DB, I woke up one morning & he was having sex with me & calling me his 'little girl' I pretended I was still asleep.

It's something that's always there in the back of my mind. It was a one off,but comes back. I don't know why it is happening now,loads of this stuff is coming into my head.

I'm going to sleep on it - DH away tonight.

OP posts:
NettleTea · 16/12/2011 23:05

and dont show him this thread to 'prove' the issue with his son. If you need help to change your life, you need MN as a safe place where he cannot get on and read your posts/see what advice is being given.
What happens on MN, stays on MN!!

3littlefrogs · 16/12/2011 23:10

Your last post doesn't surprise me one bit.

Please, get yourself organised, you need to get away.

NettleTea · 16/12/2011 23:10

We dont need to tell you what that was SBT, I think alot of 'stuff' is going to come into your head.
This is happening because of the uneasy feelings that you are getting about protecting your little boy. You have buried stuff, but now its important for you to remember because you need to protect your children as well.
when is he back? Can you start getting things together? Can you ring WA - they will offer you somewhere to go, and someone on a recent thread has just gone and says its really lovely, absolutely not what she thought it would be.
do you know how to delete your history on the computer? Would he know your username?

Fabnewme2011 · 16/12/2011 23:10

Hope you manage to get a good sleep after all this. Take care and if you can, check out this link

www.womensaid.org.uk/

They have a button you can press that covers your online tracks, just in case he checks which sites you've been on.

I phoned them in desperation and getting it all out to someone completely removed helped me enormously.

Take care :)

BertieBotts · 16/12/2011 23:11

OP, it might be worth looking at the Emotional Abuse thread which is on this Relationships section, normally somewhere on the first page. It sounds as though he most likely is abusive, but you need to recognise this yourself I think. Please go on there and see whether any of it is familiar. You don't need to read the whole thread - but often this kind of abuse follows patterns which are replicated, it's quite chilling to realise that this stuff is happening to others too.

You are not alone, there is help available. Things will be okay but keep reading and absorbing, and whatever you do, don't tell him.

babyhammock · 16/12/2011 23:12

I think because you are allowing yourself to think along these lines so your mind is allowing you to remember things to create the big picture and to make sense of things that you've felt uneasy about for a long time but could never really put your finger on.

I keep remembering things about my ex, it seems to happen stages and when you remember something you think why on earth didn't I think of that before x

BertieBotts · 16/12/2011 23:12

Ah okay x-posted :( Sorry you went through that. I agree with the others, you need to get your DS out of there ASAP.

babyhammock · 16/12/2011 23:16

or to put it another way I'm rambling you have lots of isolated events that when on their own don't really amount to that much. Your mind for whatever reason keeps them separate... then when you finally look at the whole picture its OMG how could I have not realised

NettleTea · 16/12/2011 23:18

I think the saddest thing is Ive just realised in OPs opening post is the fact that she got laughed off the chat forum.
This is just so NOT a laughing matter, and it clearly shows how most people just dont get it, dont see the signs.
THIS is why I started the thread about the MN campaign. THIS is why MN is such a lifeline for people who need help and people who believe and understand.

Sorry, not meaning to thread hi-jack with that.

I too, hope that you are able to get some sleep tonight.

DonkeyTeapot · 16/12/2011 23:54

OP, I don't have much to add, as others have given you some great advice, but everything you've posted about his behaviour makes me go cold. I would agree with those who have suggested getting out, as soon as you possibly can. Trust your instincts.

liverLadyLass · 17/12/2011 00:25

No it's not normal,
And wakening up to you DH having sex with you is rape isn't it? And the fact he called you his little girl made me sick op,, he obviously likes children, I'm worried that your poor son is scared to say what's actually happening and the only way for him to tell you is to say he does not like it, I can even bet your elder kids don't like him either?? I also worry that why your therapist has not picked up on this,have you told your therapist this?? Please op if he has to be in the same room as your son make the point of being there and protect your son, I'm sure your already doing so, please find the courage and get help best of luck op please keep us posted xxxx

andaPontyinaPearTreeeeee · 17/12/2011 00:43
Shock

Beyond creepy. Horrible horrible man

lisaro · 17/12/2011 00:44

Weird.

InstructionsToTheDouble · 17/12/2011 08:01

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ScarlettIsWalking · 17/12/2011 08:25

You poor thing.

I suspect you will struggle to leave him. He sounds like he has totally dominated you for years. This is so sad. And I am also so sad that you got laughed at in chat.

Please for the sake of your children get out of this situation. Take the advice from your counsillor seriously. They asked you not to tell him for a reason. You have to take this situation as high alert serious.

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