advice needed desperately regarding social services

[wannabestressfree]

I am desperate for some advice and wondered if anyone could help......

I have three sons. 14,10 and 7. My oldest is aspergers and ADHD, self harms daily and has had two stays in mental hospitals. On sunday he attacked me with a knife in front of my middle son. He didn't hurt me but obviously it was very scarey. He then absconded {he does this a lot} and eventually the police took him to hospital.

A house officer phoned me in the morning and said he would be requiring inpatient treatment but he is medicating at the moment [he is on a childrens ward} and so they have reversed the decision and say he is fit to return home. He self harms daily and his special education school has told social services they are refusing to have him back. I work full time as a teacher.

I told social services I wouldn't have him in the house......... this is after years of asking for help and they have phoned today and said they will give me respite for a week by placing him in foster care in our old home town. I cannot believe they would do this as this is where he absconds too and drinks and was basically told 'tough'......... no other foster carers would take him due to his mental condition. The social worker insisted I tell my school they were dealing with us {head was super supportive} and said they would be looking at the other children. I am so upset as I just want some help.

He will stop taking his medication when he comes home, attack the other children and roams in and out of the house. We are all exhausted.

So advice please............ do I take him back tomorrow or allow him into foster care that I know is not the right place. I honestly feel like they are emotionally blackmailing me..................

[wannabestressfree]

I am going to try and sleep now as I have school in the morning although I have emailed to say I will only teach to lunchtime then meet ss. I am lucky in that my head has been very supportive. I just don't want to push my luck by taking lots of time off. It was hard work today though to stop from bursting into tears........ Thank you all and I will come on tomorrow to say how it went

[trailofevidence]

I have a DS at residential school for ASD and the consistency and specialist teaching has made an enormous difference to him. All of the staff are trained in ASD, he is fully supervised and has access to therapies in-house which has really improved his violent meltdowns. wannabe - I think your DS sounds like he desperately needs this kind of intervention. Your story is so similar to the ones I've heard from other parents at the school, yet the school works incredibly hard to improve the students' behaviour and their lives are completely turned around, with most leavers going on to college.

It is not easy to get a placement like this as they are so expensive (DS' placement is £160k per year) - most LAs will turn all parents down initially and only really start to consider it when a parent appeals. In our case, our LA refused but they were ordered to fund it by the appeals panel. You will have to get advice on how to argue your case - contact charities like Ipsea, NAS or SOS SEN, who can give free advice and tribunal support. Always seek advice from an independent organisation, as SS or the LA will often state their own policies rather than the actual legal position, and they'll discourage your from even considering such a placement (as your SW has already done).

I'd suggest looking at a few companies which run these schools - Cambian and Priory have quite a few schools in the South East.

Also try posting on the SN board as you will get lots of useful advice there.

[fargate]

I hope that you are getting some well earned rest. You poor thing and yr poor family

And poor DS, too, who isn't getting the help he needs and deserves. Has a right to expect.

I'm curious as to what placement was recommended by the maudsley? [My guess would be a therapeutic boarding school] And if that came about or was never actioned because of 'lack of local resources'?

From my own professional experience I believe that you need to provoke a 'crisis in the system' in order to affect some positive changes for your son -and you and his sibling/s. At the moment, all the distress is in your home and family and you need to put that back with the professionals responsible for your son's treatment, education and care who have access to the resources he needs which are beyond the gift of any parent.

In order to provoke the crisis you will need to adamantly refuse to let DS return home [whether he goes to respite of not] and make his violence & self-harming someone elses 'problem' - as everyone who has experience of your son's kind of difficulties has said above.

In standing up for your son and other children in this way you will most likely experience considerable professional frustration and intense pressure which needs to be resolutely resisted - in order to succeed. Needless, to say you are going to require lots of personal and professional support to stand firm.

It's unlikely he will suddenly appear on your doorstep - there are alternatives to specialist respite, if needs be. And contigency plans were that to happen.

The funding for his longer term placement will have to be agreed by senior managers in mental health, education and social services so that it is jointly-funded. Not the clinicians, teachers and sw you are dealing with now tho' they potentially could give you invaluable support.

There

[fargate]

......are some lovely and truly remarkable boarding schools which you might wish to research on the internet if thats whats been recommended. No harm in saying this where I'd like my son to go and quite a constructive distraction.

Sorry this is a bit incoherent - I'm very angry on your behalf

Good luck

[wannabestressfree]

I can't face going in today so am going to spend the morning gathering information before the meeting from his schools and CAHMS. I do think residential is the best thing for him as he can't function in the family home to the detriment of everyone else. I have to think of them. Neither of them could get to sleep last night so I have left them tucked up for a bit longer.....

I am going to refuse to have him but I agree they put you under considerable pressure. I am being made to feel very bad and that my other children and job will be looked at carefully. I have decided that if this is necessary though so be it. 

I feel very very low.

[Snorbs]

It must be a heart-breaking and near-impossible decision to make. But given everything that's happened I think you're doing the right thing. You have a duty of care to all your children and that includes ensuring that DS1 gets the help he needs and that your other DCs get to grow up without the threat of violence.

You also have a duty of care towards yourself. If you fall apart you won't be able to be a parent to anyone.

Good luck wannabe. Keep strong.

[Tabliope]

Just wanted to say I'm thinking of you. Have you spoken to your MP? In a couple of your posts I've picked up that you're saying you're being made to feel bad by social services which isn't right. Exhausting as everything is I'd speak to your MP just to make him/her aware of the situation you're in. They might be able to advise you on things. Take care.

[PeachyWhoCannotType]

I am going to start by giving you the tightest hug ever; I have a ds1 who has AS and is violent and ahs been treated for eating disorders, this coudl easily be me one day.



If there is anyhting I can do please holler. I am a dissertation away from an MA in Autism and used to work for HomeSTart so some supprt exprience too. I am sat by PC most of day so a PM will flash up sharpish.

And YY to Sn Board.

[chickchickchicken]

I think its a good decision to go with accepting in your own mind that they may look like into your other children carefully (why would they look into your job? I know you are a teacher but dont understand what that has to do with any of this).  IMO this is just another scare tactic but if you can go into the meeting accepting the above it may help you to remain firm.

Also, if it were me I would say 'yes please, do look at my other children as I would like some additional help for them as they have experienced trauma.  I look forward to you offering some help for them in the near future'  In reality, as you know from struggling and fighting for help for your son, they will not have the time/resources to take more than a quick look at your other children.  

Would it help you to print off some of the replies made?  You could keep a few comments that you think will help and discreetly look at them during the meeting.  I particularly like fargate's comment about your son needing help 'that is beyond the gift of any parent'  

Would it help to think in your professional capacity as a teacher what you would advise another parent to do?  It does seem to me that you have explored all other possibilities and tried to help your son as much as you possibly can.

Would it help to keep going back to what is best for your son during the meeting?  Either in your mind or out loud.  

Good luck and take care.  Post as much as you want if that helps.  If I lived closer I would offer to come with you

[purplemurple]

Really feel for you, my ds has AS but is only seven so not facing any of the issues you are.































































































































I hope you manage to get a residential placement. Its all about the money, but its a little shortsighted, surely getting him sorted out now enabling him to lead an independent and productive life would cost less long term.


The worlds gone mad.

[PeachyWhoCannotType]

Oh and evie is on another thread being a bit odd don;t sweat it (one about housing)

[purplemurple]

don't know what happened there

[hester]

Other posters have given you much better advice than I could, but I just wanted to send my sympathies OP. What a horrendously difficult situation for you and all your dc. Best of luck.

[CeliaFate]

Wannabe what a heartbreaking situation. I do hope your son gets a residential school placement and you and your other children can relax in your own home again.

[radiohelen]

No words of wisdom other than you are a great mum. Do not let them make you feel bad. They can look into you all they want, they won't find anything they can use against you! You have made a decision to get him into residential care and you need to do whatever it takes to get that to happen. Good luck with it.

[VeryLittleGravitas]

Wannabe, I'm so sorry you're going through all of this.

I've found that SS are pretty useless until you force their hand (it's not Coastal Team is it?). Then all of the support that you needed to avoid your child going into care magically materialises.

I hope you can get a residential placement for your son. Good Luck and ((hugs)) for you and your family.

[lisad123]

I have 2 girls with Autism but alot younger than your lad, also used to work for SS and also worked in an EBD unit.
SS will put every block in place to save themselves money, they will try every service that isnt suitbale as its cheaper.
Make it clear he cant come home, its not safe for anyone in the house. I would also be temoted to ask other DC to do impact statements to stay on file, make it clear its about them too, otherwise ss will just see DS and not the others. Its their failure to help which has impacted on their failure to protect the younger children in the house
Have you got anyone to go to these meetings with you??
Could you ask school senco or supportive head to go with you.
I would also ask school to write down why they wont be taking him back? research some res schools and ask about places, costs and likely hood of being able to manage DS. Trust me SS have a space for him somewhere if you dont take him home, might mean he has to sit in hospital a bit longer and not likely to be close to home but that might not be a bad idea!

[PeachyWhoCannotType]

Given that have a fight likely for a resi aplcement- but a winnable one, absolutely- have you spoken to SOS!SEN? When I was trying to get a decent aplcement for my son they were the people with the fighting instinct who made me feel i could win, and I did.

[wannabestressfree]

To answer a few questions...........
Yes it is a coastal team that I am working with.
I have gone into primary school this morning and made them aware. They have suggested asking for a written statement that he is fit to come home and not a danger either to himself or the other children. They are supporting residential.
I have left messages for his special ed school and CAHMS.
I am going to research a few residential schools this morning before meeting with ss.
I know ss are trying to go their job and keep us together but I honestly feel its about money. I have begged and pleaded for help when he was firestarting in the house, toilet refusing until hospitalised, drinking, being excluded from school, attacking other children with knives. I just don't know what else to do. And if I honestly thought giving up work and staying at home with him would alter anything I would. But I don't think that's the case.
I have had lots of great advice and can't thank you enough but I am going to try and stay strong and see this through.
Oh and my head insists ss told me I would have to inform the school as a bullying tactic. She said 'well you told me now' and that was it. I am lucky

[fargate]

Hello again

Pleased to see you are marshalling your forces to do battle

I assume it's kent children's disability sw team who are being so awful? And that you have involved kent children and families sw team regarding your child protection concerns for DS's siblings?

Try not to take the disability team's dreadful behaviour too personally they are probably being bullied by their senior managers who hold the purse strings.

Intimidation can work both ways and you can be calmly 'threatening' too!

Agree that contacting your MP is a brilliant idea. You can also seek legal representation from specialist solicitors [?recommended by the NAS] for your son provided he is agreeable to that - it should be legally aided. Just mention that in passing, maybe??

Insist that you at as many meetings as you can attend or be represented by professionals. Or send his father? Another close relative? And take solicitors to meetings about funding.

Your local CAMHS and the maudsley should be good advocates for your son and you - the maudsley know how dire the services can be in kent.

You can, I think, self-refer DS's siblings to the childrens & families ssd child protection team. And you can ask CAMHS & the younger children's school to make referrals for them, too. They can't live in this peril.

REsidential placements can and have been joint funded by health, education and social care in Kent when pressured enough. So, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Enjoy cruising the internet for the excellent placements which are around where your DS would thrive. Lots of 14 year olds go to boarding school.

[trailofevidence]

It's great to see your fighting spirit. Do come over to the SN boards for more support, you are not alone in having to deal with this kind of behaviour.

fargate is right, residential placements can be jointly funded, so unfortunately you'd have to battle with not just SS but also the education dept and sometimes health (but it's more usual for ASD places to be just funded by education and SS). But that's also a good thing because you get stronger rights of appeal within education and then you can get your case heard by an independent panel. But that appeal is based around the legal duties of the LEA so it comes down to some quite complex law sometimes - so you should definitely seek help from a specialist solicitor (if you can afford it, legal aid is only available for very low incomes) or one of the charities I mentioned earlier.

Do you know when his statement is due for Annual Review? You can ask for an early review as it's clear that the current school named isn't suitable for him.

Most residential schools will allow parents to visit before the LEA approaches them about placement, so get in touch and start arranging visits. The LEA will often say that they won't consider the placement, but don't let that put you off investigating them. It's also important that the ones you look at are designated AS/ASD specialist schools, not BESD. The BESD approach is very different from an autism-friendly approach and many students with ASD are sadly let down because they have been pushed into cheaper BESD placements where the staff have no real understanding of ASD/sensory issues.

[fargate]

trailof won't the funding agencies be fighting one another over [avoiding] the funding? Rather than doing battle with the OP? And she shouldn't get embroiled in that except to keep putting it back to them and saying it's your responsibility, you have the money, etc please get on with it. I'm a bit out of date, maybe.

I agree that the OP probably won't get legal aid but can't DS be legally aided in his own right?

[fargate]

And totally agree about the urgent review of DS's statement.

[PeachyWhoCannotType]

Not necessarily Far, my friend has a cson with ASD who was upposed to go into resi (very different set of circs- he'd reached audlthood) and it was left to her to coordinate both sets of fudning, in the end each funder agreed to a different palce (!) and she told them to sod off. BUT she wasn't very sure about what she ahd wanted for him anyway.

There was a plan to stop legal aid from October for cases like this fulls top, then talk of backtrack- but if it did go through (not sure) get moving ASAP!