Scared my ex and his mother are trying to get residency of our son?

[sadandmoresad]

Hi I lurk a lot on these boards and did when I was going through my break-up with ex P. I have 2 children, the youngest is biologically his. I broke with him because of what I think was verbal and emotional abuse, although I realise I did escalate arguments a bit when I probably should have remained calm. But how calm can you remain when your P is calling you names and saying he will be "watching" you just for giving the children toast for breakfast (not a proper breakfast he said). there were many many incidences like this. He was lovely as long as no-one challenged him and everyone agreed with him on issues like childrearing etc, although he never tried to control me and did help in house etc and work ft he did try to control every aspect of childrearing and certain things and is very overbearing in general. His mum is hysterical at times (not just saying that) - she can be sickly sweet but hits out with things like "You care about money more than your children" "you are trying to steal money from my son" on no provocation once when I explained that childcare tax credits could not be halved and paid half to him as they are paid to the main carer that's just the way it works and what difference does it make as long as the childminder is being paid? also none of her business anyway.

Anyhow, I have left now.

On a few occasions since youngest was born (he is 2) ex-P (while we were together) during arguments threatened to take my son away, that I'm an unfit mother (not true), that "the boy would be better off with me, you can visit or see him when he is 16" and this terrifies me now that we have recently split that he may try to actually do this. He lives with his batty mother and between them they could have him full-time, as only he works f/t.

Here is the practicalities -

• DS 'officially' lives with me ie address, docs etc
• I get child benefit for him
• Initially I returned to work p/t when d/s 6 months and used childminder but when he was 9 months I went f/t and mother-in-law has him Monday to Friday 9-5 while I work.
• Both children go there every other Saturday lunchtime to Sunday night
• He has toys and clothes and personal items in both houses
• Both houses would be deemed suitable and are only 5 mins apart

What has been worrying me is that it used to be that DS would be dropped off at 5.30pm to me for dinner and play/bath etc and picked up the next morning at 8-ish before my work. But now mother-in-law has recently been DECIDING (with ex-P who is the only driver and probably can't be bothered stopping work to do drop off) on around 2 weeknights per week that she will just keep him overnight as she is too tired to collect him in morning. Sometimes they will give me the courtesy of asking, sometimes they will leave a text 'informing' me and sometimes they will just wait until I phone at 6 wondering where they are. Last Thursday this happened - I called because no-one had let me know (not confrontational) and MIL snapped "He's in bed now, if you want to come and take him out of bed you can. At least he will get a good breakfast". ex-P condoned it when I called him angry "she didn't mean it, I'm sick of you" etc.

I was livid, it seems they are trying to 'take over' in a way and because of his previous threats to get lawyers and take him, I am very wary of letting him stay but I strongly suspect all hell would break loose if I actually objected. I have said after Thursday that I can pick him up at 5.30pm if ex-P busy at work and also I will drop him off in morning if she is "too tired" so they don't have these excuses but I don't think they will listen at all.

Sorry that turned really long! If anyone has any advice or knowledge of what would be likely to happen if they did try it (there are no child protection issues either side) considering DS is there quite a lot? I am even willing to quit work or get other childcare if it comes to it, but don't want to unless necessary. Scared of the fallout from them as they can both be extremely nasty to me, although both kids love them. I'm still getting periodic snipes from ex-P about how bad as mother I am etc )-:

Thanks and any advice much appreciated. x x

As a lone parent with one child working in excess of 30 hours a week and a rent on a house of £625 a month, I am far better off working than I was on benefits.

Use an online calculator to see what you would be entitled to, if you would be better off give up work.

I know can't, I thought that. I'm actually worse off now that when I was on benefits before. It's the paying excess for childcare during school holidays and the loss of free meals etc which seems to make me slightly worse off. I have also got full rent and ct to pay now and that is a real worry if I'm off sick and cannot make the rent. Although I did unfortunately get a lot of stigma when I was claiming benefits before from all kinds of people.

fabby, i think you are correct when it's one child (as was the case with me) but I was on benefit for a short while when we split the first time and i was better off on benefit with 2 children than working. I do like my job though . some aspects of it. But I am fully prepared to do what it takes to ensure they don't take my DS. Think what I need is REALLY SOUND LEGAL ADVICE on all aspects.

Sorry, can't be bothered reading all the posts here but this is simple:
They will not get Residence. A switch of Residence/primary carer is a drastic measure of last resort for a court and you aren't even in the ball park for that.
There are no welfare concerns and you are going out of your way to facilitate contact.
You need to put your foot down about the handovers- they can't just keep the child o/n like that.
Are you entitled to Legal Aid? If so, you can get a solicitor to write the letter for you, outlining the contact and let them know that midweeks will cease if there is any reoccurrance. That scattergun approach is uncertain for the child. If that doesn't suit them, let him take you to court.
As regards the toast, words fail me. If he tries to raise that in court, the judge will tell him where to go.

Thanks NiceGuy. The advice I have been given here on this site is excellent and I am very thankful.

But Tyr, they could argue that they have been main carer since DS is there almost every day for childcare whilst I work. That's the main thing I need to stop I think. I will try to do it quietly without fuss first - just INFORM them that i have stopped working and therefore MIL does not need to collect him during week. But if they react viciously, I'll then have to fight.

I actually would welcome it going to court when I get their contact down. At least then I would know where I stand.

I think perhaps because my mother died when I was young, dad in different country, I don't really have knowledge of normal family dynamics, I just sort of thought they were just being over-protective and envied their 'close - knit' unit and wanted me and kids to be a part of that. But I trusted the wrong people, definitely. I can see there were signs right from the beginning. I know his mum tried to stop him moving in with me to our new house when I was pregnant with DS. She wanted him to stay with her so he wouldn't have to pay bills and then get a good job to support his child better. he told me months later when DS was a baby. makes me cringe now why I stayed. Just thought she was having an overbearing mother moment at the time!

MJ, I honestly wouldn't have any problem with shared residency order, or DD going with her brother. And the contact you detailed your DH has seems fine to me. I would go for that. The problem is that they (unlike your DH) ARE trying to cut me out of DS life either completely/mostly (I'm sure of that, over being over-dramatic and neutral aquiantances and friends have suggested that even when we were together telling me to "just me careful" etc).

I'd love a shared residency order.

A childminder cannot prevent the children leaving her premises with their father.

I also cannot believe sone if the advice here. And I've been through 2 years in family court also. The judge would rip this scenario to shreds. I see no actual welfare issues with regards to the children here? Have I missed them?

Op, how are your dc in danger here? You and your ex aren't really a consideration in all this....... It's about the children only.

sorry that should read not being overdramatic x

A trip to court will sort your DH out...... And mil won't be allowed in!

Tiffany, I never said I think the children are in danger. But my youngest is definitely in danger of being taken from me.

MJ I completely agree with what you say.

Scaremongering, suggesting you immediately stop contact ( you have NO right to do that) and worse, move house!!!

I don't want to stop contact. That is the last thing I want. Ditto moving away. But I promise you I am not dealing with reasonable people here, he has on numerous occasions when we were together threatened me with "Say goodbye to your son - you'll see him when he's 16!" and other similar comments.

I have not read all the posts so I'm not sure what bad advice is being referred to. I certainly didn't suggest stopping contact, nor would I.
What I suggested was that a consistent pattern be put in place. I would suggest the threat of suspending the midweeks if they will not agree to returning the child reliably.

two things

you are no longer together do NOT let him bully you and undermine you, well done for getting out of an unhappy relationship

get a mediator or a lawyer, NOW. and get to arrange something that is equitable

you MIL sounds like a an evil cunt too (scuse me) I am angry on your behalf

but before you fight for something thats clean and negotiated you must have comnfidence in yourself

there is no way anyone would give a Dad full custody so get yourself a good lawyer/mediator NOW

xx

fuck me thyere is some bad advice on here

firstly just cos he is a cxxt to you, does not mean a law court will see him as abusive

in fact, what we have is a situation where the access is very unfairly biased towards them, and they are using bullying tactics to intimidate you

GET A LAWYER, as basically you need something in writing that both can adhere too

franly get the fuck off MN, DONT stop work and use your pennies to get some proper legal advice

there is NO way they will give them custody 100% so buck up and get some proper legal help to have a written legal agreement and stop this shit about not giving him back come 6pm

ironically the bones of an equitable agreement are in place, sounds to me like you need to bias it a bit towards you

good luck, and get some legaladvice

'There is no way anyone would give a dad full custody'

Really? You are so, so wrong there. In court there is no dad or mum, just parents!

of course they would give a dad custody if mum has issues/abuse etc. But in this case I would eat my hat if they gave the Dad residency, he has more than 50% right now so I would imagine that if she goes via courts she will see son more, not less

Have to say I thought niceguy's post was excellent.
I'd agree with the latest posters too if it weren't for the fact that you're dealing with two very abusive manipulative people here. They are not going to be reasonable at all.

They are not going to play properly and anyone who has dealt with a very abusive person knows what you are going to be up against x

They have little idea of how the children's act works ( as do some posters here!!)

They will get a shock! Mil won't be allowed in to court, that will be a shock for her, that she's not involved or her input needed. So that will take the wind out of her sails

Then the ex will have to speak for himself without his mother to back him, and he will realise the full responsibility lies with him, another shock for them will be when he is told court orders are enforcable.

It's likely they are ignorant and 'think' they know best. It will all be a massive shock to them and will knock them for six

you know your shit ILT

OP GET A LAWYER!!!!

this section is dangerous as there are just opinions on here, more opnions than advice IFSWIM

Ok, Let me explain why I think that suspending contact is the right thing to do here. And let me start by saying usually I wouldn't suggest that since it's a terrible thing to do. I've been on the receiving end of it and so I know how it feels.

But right now there is no agreed contact. The way I've read it (unless i am mistaken) is that Ex is dictating it, increasing his days by stealth and in effect painting himself to be the primary carer. Those who think because OP is the mum and therefore is special because of this are deluded. The court look at who is the primary carer. Sex is irrelevant. If the child is staying with dad a lot more than mum then he is the defacto carer.

So in the absence of any agreement and where there is a risk he won't return the kid(s) when agreed, that's when I believe it should be suspended. Now an agreement can quickly be made via solicitors and then it's clearer to a court if he doesn't return the kids as promised. I'm not suggesting for a moment that contact is suspended for months. Just a few days, a week until things can be clarified properly and an agreement made in writing.

Moving is extreme and I wouldn't support that. Ditto with the lying.

The other thing is OP needs to stop announcing her intentions to the ex. Information is power and you cannot win if you keep telling your opponent what you will do next. And this is about winning.

MJ, the way I read it is that OP hasn't agreed to MIL having the child 5 days a week, that was her ex forcing that upon her. This isnt about curtailing his rights as a dad. I'm naturally very pro-dad. But this is about ensuring there's an agreement and both sides stick it.

Lastly, it's great that OP is prepared to agree to shared parenting but this requires a great deal of cooperation and communication to make it successful. As a strategy though I wouldn't open with offering that. I'd offer contact only as that gives you room to negotiate. If you start with shared care, you've nothing else to offer.

one aprent which ever sex wont gett full residency unless there are significant issues around welfare of DC. there arent those issues here - and the op is happy per se to ahve DS cared for by MIL.

the issue is the amount fo time and the unwillingness to hand child abck.

so by going to mediation (and probably later court as mediation may not work in this case) a proper schedule of contact can be drawn up.

it may eb that as niceguy says - op need to say look you arent having ds - because you dont bring him back - until we sit and talk with mediator and agree exactly who ahs him which days so it is clear to all.

it is highly likely court in the end will grant shared resiidency. there dont appear to be welfare issues regarding op so no reason why dad should get sole residency and no reason why op should be granted sole residency - default would be shared residency with actual time spent living with each parent to be determined and agreed (or imposed if they cant agree)