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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Am I 'morbid and sick' for contemplating being the NRP?

79 replies

foreverdirt · 03/08/2011 21:06

DH and I (happy together, no plans to seperate), were discussing what we'd do if we broke up, hypothetically. This comes from discussions about the child support a friend's ex should be but isn't paying.

DH earns 65k a year, I earn nothing (SAHM). We were talking about the proportion of DH's income which would come to me as child support were we to break up (have 2 DCs, 6 and 9). After talking some more we 'agreed' that it would make more sense if DH was the resident parent as he could easily afford an au pair or similar (it would be less than what he'd pay me in CS were I the resident parent), plus housing etc etc (we rent), and he's quite senior so works from home often. I would retrain (eventual plan anyway when DCs are a little older), and pay him child support out of whatever my income was - could afford to rent a 1-bed place but not the three beds the RP would need, etc etc. I know that maintenance would be payable(?), were we to seperate but we were talking about what would be in the DCs best longterm benefit.

I came out of the discussion feeling pretty positive - it was interesting to discuss it all (we've always been into hypotheticals), to know what DH's kneejerk reaction to the situation would be. It also galvinised me to step up my retraining plans and get some more solid earning power - I wasn't expecting DH to embrace the idea of an au pair so wholeheartedly really.

I was chatting with a friend and she was horrified. She called us 'sick and morbid' for even having the conversation and said she couldn't believe I'd contemplate being the NRP - "how could you leave your kids?", she said. I've seen that expressed a lot on various forums etc when a mother is not the primary carer for the children but I'm not sure why it's so horrific a concept?

Are we completely odd for thinking about this, talking about this and am I horrible for considering living apart from the DCs if we were to break up?

OP posts:
ImperialBlether · 03/08/2011 22:34

I've NEVER seen on the Relationships thread anyone say "Leave your children with the DP." Can you point towards any thread that says that?

It's ironic that you plan (in this hypothetical future) to look after other people's children whilst leaving your own behind.

I don't think you're being morbid. You might be morbid if you constantly dwelled on what would happen if you died. You have basically just told your husband that if you split up, he can have the kids. I wouldn't tell any man that, no matter how much I loved him.

Newbabynewmum · 03/08/2011 22:34

You know you can do a PGCE as a single parent? I'm doing mine in sept and my 1yo will be at nursery fulltime. I don't understand you tbh, but if you'd be happy that's fine. I'd spend every single penny I have and use every last bit of energy to have my DD remain living with me. It's in my blood. I couldn't not look after her.

Sassybeast · 03/08/2011 22:41

Your friend is right. You are an idiot. If/when your marriage breaks down, i suggest you name change before you post for the support that you will inevitably need to cope with one of the most traumatic things that you or your kids will ever experience.
Grim.

AnotherMumOnHere · 03/08/2011 22:48

I cant help wondering.

OP you say you have MH problems but you still want to do a 60 hour a week training programme (dont know the right word for it) for Teacher Training.

Nowadays i think most classes are between 20 and 40 children per class. Now that is not an easy job im sure. What I find it difficult to understand is - apart from the fantasy you and your DH have spoken about - if you find school holidays etc HARD (your own words) with your own 2 children how are you going to manage a 60 hours a week training course and fitting in seeing your DC/interacting with them at the same time. Also how would you manage to 'control' a full class if you find looking after your own '2' hard?

ImperialBlether · 03/08/2011 23:01

Good point, AnotherMum.

I'm a teacher and trained years ago. The PGCE year is the hardest year of your life! You're given a wide range of subjects/levels to teach. You are observed all the bloody time. You have to write a lesson plan for every breath you take.

If you find your own children difficult to deal with, what makes you think 30 will be easier?

ImperialBlether · 03/08/2011 23:02

And if you say 30 is easier because they are older (ie secondary age) you should think again very quickly!

GypsyMoth · 03/08/2011 23:04

and op,i have just seen you have posted this nonsense on 'relationships' board.....how bloody insensitive!!Shock

it should be in 'chat' or 'aibu'

MrsHicks · 03/08/2011 23:12

Actually my husband and I talked about what we'd do if we split up before we started TTC - we discussed every aspect of how we wanted to bring up our child, including splitting up or one of us dying and a whole range of thing. The thought of being a 'weekend dad' was something he found incredibly distressing and never wanted to be in the position of having a child and then finding out that if we did ever split, that I was someone who assumed that children automatically stayed with the mother. In the end, we did split and knowing that we both always had thought shared custody was the ideal situation made it a lot easier. Being the NRP can be as traumatic for a very attached father as it is for the mother.

ImperialBlether · 03/08/2011 23:17

Yes it can, MrsHicks and I admire you for your decision. I told my ex he could have the children whenever he wanted, but he didn't take me up on it as often as he could have.

However, the OP is actually telling her husband, "If we break up, you can have the kids as it will be cheaper" - that's dreadful in my opinion.

GypsyMoth · 03/08/2011 23:28

well it did sound all about money,hardly any mention of dc wellbeing

ensure · 03/08/2011 23:33

What a bizarre thread.

shocked2 · 03/08/2011 23:47

Hi all - the thought of being nrp is truly horrible, however I think it would be equally awful for dh... Dh and I do not really get on, however I don't see how we could ever split given how attached we both are to the children. The resident parents misses out on weekends and holidays spent with the nrp and that's frightening enough, it must be truly awful for the nrp Sad.

GnomeDePlume · 03/08/2011 23:56

DH & I are 'discussers'. We are currently working through how we will spend our EuroMillions lottery win.

IMO this sort of thing is healthy in a relationship. You discuss something abstract and as a result identify values which might otherwise be hidden.

This is not morbid or sick.

CheesyQuaverBaby · 03/08/2011 23:56

i would like to bring the focus back to the reason you were having this conversation.

You are BOTH concerned for your children & want whats best not whats best for point scoring if u split up.

My parents did the same when they split. they sat down & agreed the best scenario for them & us children. They put us 1st & if that means being with their dad then so be it.

I believe DADS have just as much rights as mothers therefore are more than capable of caring for their children too.

do what u feel is right for them not you & ultimately no one can judge you for that

DrPolidori · 04/08/2011 00:13

Look. people make decisions for all sorts of reasons. I allowed my ds to live with my exp for 2 years during the week, as it was the best thing for him. I had found a fantastic school which would reverse the harm his previous school had done, but it was two streets away from my Exp's house. what should I have done? Insisted Ds did a two hour journey each way to fufil my my needs? Or agree to him being with ExP during the week?

Ds loves me and ExP equally. We did the best thing for him. even when he got new girlfriends etc.

Did it kill me? yes. was it great for ds? yes. There ya go.

TheFarSide · 04/08/2011 00:18

Agree with GnomeDePlume - it sounds like you have a pretty healthy relationship with your DH to be able to openly discuss these issues. It's certainly not morbid or sick.

Some people don't like to think about "bad" things and get very emotional, which is not a good basis for making plans or dealing with life's problems.

I think you might have touched a sore point with some posters as they are implying you have problems with your DH and would give up your children without a second thought. Don't let them get to you.

Proudnscary · 04/08/2011 13:48

Actually FarSide I think the reason OP is getting a hard time is because some posters find it insensitive and offensive to breezily post about neat little separation hypotheticals - and (bizarrely) ask opinions about it when some people on here are actually going through very painful and very real separations.

And I would never live without my dc, and I would never tell my dh that. Very stupid thing to do - even as part of your 'fun little game'.

ShoutyHamster · 04/08/2011 14:34

How odd.

So you are cheerfully planning that in the event of a split, your DH would actually take every single aspect of your lives together, and you would be left as an entirely disposable accessory to your own family?

He has the money
the house
the children
employs a mum-substitute for all that everyday stuff that he's not there to do

...and you live in a one-bed flat on your own.

How on earth is this a prospect which fills you with anything but horror? It's just so - nothing. It's just a case of removing you from the family and replacing your spot with an employee. Chilling.

I don't imagine you'd feel positive about that kind of arrangement in the slightest if it actually came to a split. I think the reality of you living down the street in a bedsit while your children, husband and the au-pair had a jolly, busy family life just up the road, would destroy you: with you having to ask your children when they saw this film and how long have those socks needed mending and oh what school project was that? - 'oh it was weeks ago, did it with me Mum'.

That's without even starting on the financial setup here. I really do hope you don't split up, at least not until you have done some serious reading about your rights with regard to finances:

'DH earns 65k a year, I earn nothing (SAHM). We were talking about the proportion of DH's income which would come to me as child support were we to break up (have 2 DCs, 6 and 9). After talking some more we 'agreed' that it would make more sense if DH was the resident parent as he could easily afford an au pair or similar (it would be less than what he'd pay me in CS were I the resident parent), plus housing etc etc (we rent), and he's quite senior so works from home often. I would retrain (eventual plan anyway when DCs are a little older), and pay him child support out of whatever my income was - could afford to rent a 1-bed place but not the three beds the RP would need, etc etc. I know that maintenance would be payable(?), were we to seperate but we were talking about what would be in the DCs best longterm benefit.'

Stop RIGHT THERE.

He doesn't 'earn 65K and you earn nothing' - you are married, the FAMILY INCOME is 65K, for which he works outside the home and you work within it and provide childcare. In order to do this you have made serious financial sacrifices in terms of training, income now, and pension. The 65K belongs to BOTH of you.

If you were to split up, it would be more usual for YOU to stay as the resident parent, him paying not only maintenance but also spousal maintenance - essentially, paying for you to remain as the children's carer for the appropriate length of time, usually also in order to support you while you retrain. This arrangement is usually put into operation as it is recognised that the SAHP has sacrificed his/her job prospects in order to stay at home, so if the marriage ends they are left in the weaker financial position. Why the HELL should you live in a one-bed flat while your DH sits in the big house with your family around him? Why? Has he contributed more? No. Does he already have more advantages in place? Yes - he has earning power.

In the event of a split, more of the assets of the marriage generally go to the parent with care, and because this is usually the stay-at-home parent, the balance of earning power and advantage is thus more fairly distributed. Your thinking seems entirely naive - that somehow you are worth less than him, so you will cheerfully trot off and make no trouble, while he continues to enjoy the lifestyle THAT YOUR CAREER SACRIFICES HAVE PARTIALLY PAID FOR. If your DH were the slightest bit of a dodgy one, he would be smirking with delight at your suggestion here - that you basically leave the marriage with nothing and give him the children too.

Do some reading and thinking on this!

Cocoflower · 04/08/2011 14:35

Its the emotionless, cold and clinical nature of your post that I cannot bide.

Cocoflower · 04/08/2011 14:40

I also hope you have not told your children this plan. I urge you not to.

MegBusset · 04/08/2011 14:51

Crikey, I think some way OTT posts on here. Including some who obviously don't see dads as equal parents, and who claim that living 'in a cardboard box' would be putting the DC's needs first?

OP yanbu for having had the conversation, in fact DH and I have had similar (not with the same outcome, but to reassure us both that we agreed what would be best for the DC in such a case).

Dozer · 04/08/2011 17:56

Agree with shoutyhamster.

Dozer · 04/08/2011 17:58

The thinking behind this seems like what happened when marriages broke up in the 19th century.

HerHissyness · 04/08/2011 18:09

Waves Chugsy banner.

ADORES Shouty...

Exactly, to the full stop what the pair of em said. Talk about setting yourself u for at best an inequal relationship, at worst an abusive one. How deppressingly defeatist!

FGS OP, we have the VOTE now, have you heard? Grin

TheFarSide · 04/08/2011 18:30

I object to the OP being attacked by some over-emotional posters. It's OK to be rational sometimes.

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