Plucking up the courage to tell DH I want to separate. Any advice?

[minxthemanx]

Deep breath. Have made the decision that I cannot go on being unhappy in this marriage, and it is affecting the children. Have posted on here lots of times so many of you know the details, but in a nutshell, DH buggers off doing his 'hobby' for days, weekends and, at the moment, 8 days in Milan (nice). His behaviour over the years has been totally selfish and unreasonable, and most people on here have said he's a selfish arse. He's not a bad person, and v good with the DC who love him to bits, but has not listened, learned or considered my feelings in anything. In December DS1 was very poorly, in and out of hospital, and on the day I came home from hospital with him, following scans that drew a blank, DS buggered off to Barcelona for a hockey tournament. At that point I decided I wanted to separate, and was all geared up to tell him. Then DS1 deteriorated badly - turned out it was a burst brain aneurysm and he was critical in Gt Ormond St for 3 days. Has made an astounding recovery, tho we were told he may not survive at the time. Anyway, that was so traumatic that I couldn't then start the process of separation - emotionally exhausted.

However, DH has now been in Milan for 7 days and missed 2 weekends with the boys, all end of term activities, sports day, and DS1's final cricket match of the season tomorrow and celebratory bbq. Considering DS1 nearly died 6 months ago, this is a big deal to me. DS1 is very upset that his Dad won't be there. DH gets back Sunday evening, then work all week. Next Saturday, first day here for a fortnight, he is going to Lords. I have asked him to reconsider this, as unfair on the DC, he says no, it's been organised a year, anyway I'll see them on the Sunday.

BTW DS1 and I were back in Gt Ormond St for another operation only a fortnight ago.

I've had enough and I want a separation. I know, deep down, this is the right thing for DC and me - I am so unhappy, and at times lose patience with the boys when it's DH I'm so bloody angry with. I dread telling the boys as they adore him and will be devastated.

Advice, please, for damage limitation for the children. Also, we have a holiday in Cornwall booked for August - am tempted to cancel it and hope I can get some money back (I'll have to look at my travel insurance), or do you think have the holiday, grit my teeth (again) and start proceedings when we get back? Sorry so long. I am so tired and emotionally drained.

[ameliagrey]

Mouse- of course I am trying to help. And if you read Minx's last post you will see she is having doubts.

On the one hand this is to be expected over such a huge decision, but on the other hand you cannot surely deny that the overall tone of all the posts here is to encourage her ( egg her on) to follow through with a divorce.

There's a difference between someone saying "Help me do this" which is how the thread began and "I'm not sure if I want this at all...." which is what her latest post says.

What's wrong in your opinion with my suggesting she takes time out and thinks about talking to friends, and a professional like a counsellor, in RL?

[Katisha]

Ironically, I think there's a distinct possbility the DCs will see MORE of him if they separate as he will have to have his own time with them which he will be fully responsible for, rather than letting them be in the background all the time.

[TheCrackFox]

I agree Katisha - a lot of crap Dads suddenly remember they have children once the marriage has ended.

Minx - I think you actually seeing the solicitor on Wednesday could well signal to your DH that your marriage has ended.

[ameliagrey]

But I am only reflecting on what Minx said herself here:

Feel equally crap today, of course, wondering if I'm doing the right thing, etc etc. Is he really bad, am I really that unhappy, no more nice family holidays and days out, but then again no more of his crappy decisions either.

There are doubts- you can't deny that.


There have been many threads here where posters have been encouraged to leave, then said it was the wrong thing for them to do, but they were swayed by other people's posts.

I was not taking either side- I was saying why did she not talk to a counsellor?

Minx- sorry to talk about you as if you are not here or not reading. maybe you would consider counselling alone? You can still see the solicitor and find out what the finances and timescales would be.

[Chandon]

Op, how horrible for you.

I hope you will spend a bit of time doing your "homework" before you separate.

A friend of mine "jumped" into separation, for same reasons as you. She had not sorted finances, figured anything out. She thought her life would continue as it was (big house, SAHM, 2 cars, private school), minus him.

However, when she told him she wanted to divorce, he quit his job as he was not prepared to be the breadwinner and keep her and kids in the big house and go and live in a shoebox himself. He also is fighting for custody over the kids. He is looking for a new job nearby, ironically, to see his kids more.

So now she is dealing with the divorce, as well as having to sell the house, as well as having to pull the children out of their (private) school, as well as having to find a job herself so she actually sees less of the kids now.

I am just mentioning this as often women think they'll have the same life, minus the husband, but often the house has to be sold and other changes made too. I just want you to be prepared for this sort of thing, and make good arrangements (maybe the house is in your name, in which case it's safe(r)). Sorry, don't mean to be bleak about things, just hope you'll plan it all with lots of forethought.

Also, the way I read your post, you still love him and if he were to change and give in a bit, and change his attitude, that would be the happiest solution for you all (tell me if I'm wrong). Is there ANY way that could be achieved??? is he really totally unreasonable?

[Anniegetyourgun]

"There have been many threads here where posters have been encouraged to leave, then said it was the wrong thing for them to do, but they were swayed by other people's posts."

Link one please.

[nadmeg]

If you feel that the marriage is over and there is no way of making it work, then seperation may be the right thing. Nobody knows what will happen, if you have to sell the house, Finances, contact arrangements with DC etc but IF it is the right thing everything will come good You just need to be strong.

[Smum99]

I really do feel for you - you desperately want the marriage to work but you can't make the changes solo and he doesn't seem able/willing to change. My marriage was similar, I really hoped that my ex would change, I gave him every chance and finally I reached the end. To me the pain of being in the marriage was worst than the pain of leaving. Only you know your limit and how unhappy you are, however I'm sure most women wouldn't cope with your marriage. I'm saying that to you so you know you are not being unreasonable.

It feels as if you and the DCs are extras to his life, rather than being the centre of his life.It's this attitude which would be the issue for me rather than the actual hobby or time away from home.

[minxthemanx]

Thanks everyone, yes it's not just the issue of him not spending enough time with us, it's the fact that he CHOOSES to spend quite a bit of his very rare spare time on his hobby. Not just an hour or two round the golf course, but whole days, or a weekend, or 8 days in Milan!!! And this has gone on for years, and he has had every warning that I'm unhappy.

When he went to Barcleona the day I came out of hospital with poorly DS1, his justification was that DS1 must be ok, the Drs wouldn't have sent him out. So 5 day jolly in Barcelona was quite justified. NO thought whatsoever to what his wife needed/wanted. The same again now, with Milan, and then Lords on Saturday - no consideration of how anyone else feels. This isn;t something new, this isn't knee jerk. It's gone on for years and ground me down.

Amelia, I really appreciate your comments and you've been very helpful. I've had a long chat with RL friend this evening, whose response was that he's lucky I've stuck it out this long. I am seeing a solicitor for advice on Wednesday, and my GP, and counsellor on Thursday. God knows I'm not doing anything lightly.

HIs response so far tonight is to rush out and cut the grass (!) to show that he is useful. (I do it nearly every time, he does it about twice a year). And to tell me that we should still go on holiday, he does not want to separate, and that we just need to work at it.

[ameliagrey]

You are doing the best you can, I know.

It really is worth considering he has an Aspergers type problem- not that it helps even with a diagnosis.

I uspect that once you start on the divorce path he will see the light. My best friend had got as far as a petition when her DH suddenly realised she meant it.

She withdrew it- but she had by then got everything lined up- finances , best divorce lawyer in London etc etc- to fight her corner if required.

That gives you a lot of power.

I think you will have to go right to the wire on this and I suspect he will then promise to change.

If by then you are still having second thoughts, you could give him 6 months probation and see if he changes.

[RandomMess]

Even the act of living seperately in the same house may jolt him into reality but if it doesn't then you know you have done EVERYTHING possible.

I am so sad that you have given everything you have for 11 years and he just can't see his behaviour is selfish

[Saffysmum]

minx: well done on having the dreaded chat, and good luck for the next few days. Nothing is set in stone, you and only you two know the dynamics of your relationship. But as an outsider, someone who is seeing a GP and counsellor to help you cope with this marriage, is someone in an unhappy marriage. So I think you've done what is needed. No one is saying rush into divorce, just take it a step at a time. See the solicitor, and like I said before, you will then be ready to take another step as and when you feel right to do so.

Things had to change - he didn't respond to your unhappiness, and you have no reason at all to justify his behaviour to us or anyone. He prioritised his hobbies, his "fun" over his family. And that's wrong. End of.

Good luck, and keep posting. What ever you decide, we will help.

[Mouseface]

minx - he is displaying classic 'too little too late' syndrome.

ONLY YOU can decide what to do and if this is the kick up the ass he needed after years of neglecting you and his children, then fantastic. I will be happy for you whatever you decide, really I will.

And we'll all be here for you, no matter what you do because that's the kind of people you'll find here. Supportive.

Yes, some may question your reasons for staying in this if you do, but NONE OF US KNOW YOU IN RL do we? So we can't judge fairly or even assume to know how you truly feel.

YOU are in control of this, DH is panicking because he can see a change in you. He knows that you mean it. This time.

But, what happens next, over the coming week is ALL UP TO YOU. Not us, not your family and friends. You.

Which comes with enormous pressure in itself I guess. Are you right or wrong to do this or that.

But you'll know. You will feel that it's right.

Personally, I think he's had his chances over the years and put you and your boys last. Second at best. And now that he FINALLY sees that you mean business, he's shitting himself.

It's taken 11/12 years to get to this point and now he risks losing it all. Of course he is cutting the grass, he's out there thinking how best to make this all go away.

A holiday, another baby, moving house, NEVER fixes the wholes long term. You can only paper over the cracks for so long before the walls start to crumble.

Be strong and trust your own judgement. Follow you head and your heart. xx

[Saffysmum]

Ditto everything Mousie says.

The crux of this, from my point of view, is that it's very wearying to have to cause an upset, and bring things to a head, to make somebody see what they should see without prompting. He should instinctively put you and the kids first. I would walk over hot coals barefoot to get to my kids if they needed me, night or day. That he makes a calculated decision to put his hobby first, is really sad. That you need to cause such a fuss, to make him see how wrong this is, is soul destroying.

Bottom line: his priorities are different to yours. In an equal, respectful marriage, he shouldn't have to be told how to be, he should just "be".

[Mouseface]

*holes! Sorry, I am really TheQueenOfTypos

[nadmeg]

I agree with Mouseface there is a massive amount of pressure on you, but in your heart you will know what is right for you and DC, you are the important ones in all of this. What you need to think about is where do you want to be in another 11/12 years? How many times can you forgive him for his actions without totally wrecking your head?

[minxthemanx]

Thanks girls, the conversation last night was the "I'm not moving out of the house" variety. So I went and phoned his mother and told her the situation. Very emotional and I got reallu upset talking to her, but he came in and listened while I was on the phone - I think he could see I meant it. MIL asked whether we could try counselling - I told her we've been there, done that and he doesn't listen. She's insisiting on coming over this evening so we can go out and talk. DS1 very tearful and upset all evening - he 'couldn't think why he felt like that' but I bloody could.

[ameliagrey]

well it's great that his mother is supportive!

Do your kids know what is going on? sounds as if they do. Do you talk to them about what's happening or do they just pick it up?

I think for their sakes you really do need to keep the whole thing as low key and unemotional as you possibly can. They will have a huge sense of divided loyalty.

Out of interest, was the counselling any good? My friend- who I referred to before, who issued the divorce petition then took it back- they had joint counselling at the Tavistock Clinic in London. Their counsellor suggested a set of behaviours to work towards in between sessions. They were then accountable each week when they went back. I just wonder if your H has ever had to account for his behaviour in this way? If your counselling was just a case of talking and not implementing any behaviour changes, then maybe that is why it didn't work.

I suppose if I were you, I'd be wanting to see buckets of remorse from him, with the promise to be different. I find it hard to believe that he is so self-centred and unable to see what you want and need, unless he has some kind of personality disorder- even if that amounts to self-delusion!

I think you are going to have to press ahead with your plans, but ultimately, you do have to weigh up if this life you have, with all its faults, is better or worse than a life on your own.

[Tortoiseonthehalfshell]

Minx, you're doing brilliantly keeping on with this, and calling his mother. He's probably starting to believe you, by now.

[ameliagrey]

swallowed I think you are making a mountain out of a phrase, TBH!

When I posted "on your own" then that is the immediate future. I am sure that Minx's thoughts are far removed from even thinking about another relationship when she is not even 100% sure she wants out of this one!

Who knows what the future may hold for her or anyone? Just wanting someone else doesn't mean it will happen, but I never for a minute implied she would be onher own for the next 50 years if that is not what she wants.

[Boshankles]

Isn't it a bit worrying that a 50 something year old man still has his mother involved in his relationships?

I think it is a bit bizarre.