He has given his mother all our savings

[westernshores]

Hi everyone. I wasn't sure if I should add to my previous thread here or make a new one. It's a new issue (or is it?) so here goes.

We've had one conselling session, which wasn't especially productive but I was glad we did it. We had a nice night out together - he arranged it, got a babysitter etc - where we did a lot of chatting and had a good time as a couple. This weekend just gone we did lovely things as a family - again, his idea (daytrip etc). He didn't touch alcohol, get snarky, do/say anything snide. I was really hopeful that I'd shocked him into assessing his behaviour.

This morning he told me he'd given his mother his inheritance from his grandmother (£60,000), instead of paying it into the mortgage as he'd told me. His mother said that grandmother would've left it to her anyway had she known about MIL's financial situation and H thought that was reasonable. MIL used the money to repay business debts and a huge tax bil of FILs.

This was 'some months ago' (must be a year plus). He did not consult me at any point and although he says he was intending to tell me and looking for the right time, I just can't believe that. I suspect something has happened which means it would be obvious that the money was not used as he said - perhaps the mortgage deal has run out? H is the only name on the mortgage and is in finance so I - stupidly - haven't done anything other than take his word for it over the years.

He said "essentially it was my money and I felt this was the best use for it".

We'll never get it back as MIL is remortgaged to the hilt and retiring and BIL has disabilities which will need supporting once MIL and FIL pass away. Not that them repaying us was ever mentioned.

MIL and FIL have clearly colluded in this as nothing has ever been said to me.

Is this why he was so keen to live abroad and sell the house/rent it out?

I was almost speechless as he was telling me - and then he fucked off to work and said we'd talk later. I can't stop thinking about what a difference that money was supposed to make to the DCs.

I am literally torn - is this why he's been so aggressive and horrible? The stress of covering up this situation? Does he deserve compassion here? Or is it proof that he doesn't think me worth considering at all?

I feel like... actually I don't feel like anything, I just feel sick.

I have a deed in trust from when I put £15k in towards doing the kitchen and bathroom (pre-marriage). Generally though before the marriage I contributed by paying a couple of bills (still pay water and TV license), and getting the food in and he coped with the mortgage. I was always on a much lower income (student, then low-grade academia).

Of course this is all assuming he hasn't done something stupid and there's any value in the house. This is just ringing such huge alarm bells as his mother's MO was to buy properties then remortgage to buy more (all crashed around her ears when credit crunch happened), as her pension.

Now H and I have often, often spoken about how stupid that was (the remortaging really), and rolled our eyes at her financial missteps - yet he'd do this, knowing that. So god knows what else he's done.

In a way I can cope with the £60k because it was money we never really 'saw'. But the house, the DC's uni fees (or whatever), that's tangible. Obviously if we split I'd end up in very different circumstances anyway, but whatever he's done means there's less in the pot for the kids and I just can't square that with his hands-on, dedicated-dad stuff.

It's just beneath contempt really. Which is ironic since the original issue was him treating me like that while drunk.

"I can cope with the £60k" - god, no I can't. That's more than a year's salary for H. And he's just thrown it away, and that's the best case.

no tax is due on the 60k as inheritance tax only kicks in around 325k, in most cases assets houses pensions savings are split 50/50 but the resident parent may get to stay in house and give up some other asset often share of pension

op it does not sound good but i would recommend even in marriage both parties understanding and knowing the balances of finances partly so you know in event of anything going wrong , you often hear of widows( more so than widowers) being in a financial mess and confused as OH always did it not that OH did it badky just that they dont know what is what and how to control it

I hate your husband westernshores

I wish he was nicer to you.

OP, I think you need to take serious steps to protect your interests. Agree with the previous poster regarding registering your interest in the house. If I were you I would make sure you set up your own accounts which he has no access to (and don't fall for the give me your password routine etc.). Have you got an up to date will? I think you both need to draft a will detailing all your assets and liabilities. But the first thing I would do if take copies of everything you can get your hands on about his affairs and put them somewhere safe (and needless to say don't tell him). I don't believe the money has ended up with your MIL, she may be looking after it for him but I think he is attempting to put it out of your reach in case of separation / divorce. Also, check your children's accounts, people like your husband tend to take money from any source they can.

Please get legal advice on the quiet. Forewarned is forearmed. I don't want to worry you but plans are afoot by the sound of it. Good luck.

Well I am back from seeing my friend. Had a big glass of wine so not in a fit state to discuss anything.

Thankyou all so much for the advice and for just being here with/for me. It is so lonely being in this weird situation.

I am seeing a solicitor tomorrow and thanks to you all have a lot to ask. I am educating myself about my potential rights etc.

I, personally, believe he gave MIL this money 18 months-2 years ago. It just fits with a lot of things which seemed minor but clearly weren't. A real 'ahhh' moment, you know? But I will be getting proof of exactly what happened with the money, I don't want one day unaccounted for.

MIL has contracted out to the government in the past (one of the reasons she didn't want FIL to go br), and the threat that I'll do something about that (can I call the police or the IR?), will hopefully make them show me what they spent it on. I am as sure as I can be that at least 32k went on FIL's tax bill - there is no other way it can have been resolved - and I know MIL had to pay off her employees before she wound up the business, so I suspect the rest has gone there. But I will find out for sure.

Problem is, I couldn't in good conscience do anything which would deprive BIL of his home or what he needs to be happy, and the ILs are trying to consolidate their main property by paying off/selling the others.

But this is the end for me and H, I am 99% sure. I just know it's the end of the line.

If he'd been honest from the start, things would be different. That's what's killing me. If he'd come to me instead of lying and treating me like shit for 2 years, things would be different. That hurts so much.

How did you get on with the solicitor? I think you should ask them to store the Deed of Trust for you, it's a very important document, as it proves your interest in the house

Western, sorry I wasn't around for your last message; I'm in Australia and the time difference often means I duck out of threads at inconvenient moments. But I didn't mean to pry, I promise, I was just trying to think of ways you could engage in a bit of forensic accounting yourself.

How did the solicitor go?

Hi Guys.

it's been an intense day or two. I told H and his mother I was going to call the police and the inland revenue and they co-operated with what I wanted to know (while making a fuss about how unreasonable I am - MIL says she is expecting an apology!!!)

He gave his mother the money. He changed the mortgage to an interest-only mortgage so the repayments would fall. His mother used the money to pay off the inland revenue and wind up her business (paying employees etc).

I have an appointment with MIL (and H's), accountant to see all of the documents and MIL has agreed to give me access to her bank accounts for the period. But this accountant is the one who did some 'creative accounting' for MIL in the past re mortages so I'm not sure - surely he wouldn't lie?

The solicitor said to do what I've done. It looks like there is very little recourse should we seperate, especially as the money is unrecoverable. MIL has no savings or anything and there's some discussion about BIL and his best interests.

H says he has no other bank accounts, and no other debts. He has ordered his credit history from experian.

He says there is no particular reason he told me about this 'all of a sudden' other than wanting to be honest as a result of our counselling sessions.

He has NOT said anything like 'please don't leave', or 'I am so sorry for lying' or 'I'll never forgive myself'.

He is very deceptive isn't he He gave his mother the money and arranged for the mortgage to go interest only so it looked like lower payments.

So basically he hasn't paid any capital off the mortgage for the last year/eighteen months.

He deceived you about all of this and they are considering you unreasonable trying to get to the bottom of his lies

An apology from me would be a long time in coming!!!

I would be wondering just what else he could lie and deceive about as this appears to have been very easy for him and there has been no consideration for you at all.

I would find it very very hard to trust him and maintain a relationship with him especially as it was his money and you and your DC were not considered important in this at all.

Good luck for what you decide to do.

Any money left to him specifically and not to you as a couple is his to spend as he wishes, even in the eyes of the law were you to divorce an inheritance left to him cannot be split with you.

What he done with it is his business not yours.

So he changed the mortgage to interest only so you would see the payments fall and think he had paid off the mortgage...he purposely set out to deceive you then - in a very calculated way.

No apology means he see's nothing wrong with what he's done IMO.

Honesty is great...but should be accompanied by taking responsibility for your misdemeanour's surely?!

Good grief what a very selfish and entitled man he seems to be.

Western I fail to see to be honest what you are doing chasing money that was left to your husband? It was never yours and never left to you both as a couple just to him.

My friend just divorced her husband, he was left 100k by his mother in her will, when the divorce was being finalised and all their finances being sorted she was told that she is not entitled to any percentage/part of an inheritance left to him.

So you were never entitled to any of the 60k.

It's not about being entitled, it is about being lied to about what he planned to do with it and then what he actually did with it for over a year.

If the grandparent wanted his mother to have it she would have been left it.

Not skipped and had the money for her vulnerable child locked up in a trust safe away from her as well.

Fabby, it's not really about the money, though I do think given his mother's history with cashflow (and the fact his grandmother was careful NOT to leave it to MIL), he should've taken advice before making the decision, including my advice.

He and his parents hid what they did, lied, covered it up. Let me go around thinking there was 60k less on the mortgage, switched to interest-only, let me think the DCs uni funds were taken care of. That is ALL stuff which concerns me. Especially DH and I will be responsible for the lifetime care of BIL when MIL passes on herself.

If (probably when), we seperate/divorce it will be because of his drunken behaviour and this absolute catalogue of lies. Not because of the money. If he'd come to me wanting to do this, I would probably have agreed.

But he lied and lied and lied and treated me like shit. And for almost two years I've thought our financial situation was dramatically different from the truth. It has affected us in so many ways.

To be honest I am not sure how you could possibly stay with someone who has for the past two years lied as much as he has.

How long will the 'interest only' period last? Will this revert back to interest plus principal at any time in the near future?

Good point math I hadn't thought of that!

Did he get a fixed period interest only that is now ending so had to tell you before you realised yourself when the payments go back up rather than wanted to tell you because he decided honesty was now the best policy?

math and xales good point - could be that whatever he signed up to is ending or he's anticipating the rate changing. Or there could've been some limit based on his age if he's to pay it off by retirement.

I am slightly past caring to be honest, beyond wondering how it affects the DCs. Even if he did tell me purely out of wanting to make things 'right' between us, discovering what he's been covering up (and not for good enough reasons IMO), for so long has pretty much killed any desire I had to fix things.

I'll ask to see the mortgage paperwork.

Yes, you need to see all the paperwork and all the accounts from now on in. Never let yourself be financially ignorant, love - I'm really sad for you that you're going through this, but I hope any relationship in the future, you'll insist on financial transparency from the beginning.

The bottom line is that this man decided at some point that you don't matter. He gave himself permission to lie to you and treat you with contempt - to speak to you rudely, criticize your behaviour, put you down all the time while he was lying to you about your mortgage ie your HOME.
Get your own solicitor and go to the CAB and don't tell him what you are doing. You need all the legal shit in place, all the information you can possibly get, before you tell him his sorry arse is dumped and (depending on what your legal advisers say) that either he is moving out or you are. Don't waste any time or energy on marriage counselling or wondering why he did it. It doesn't matter. There's no coming back for someone who has treated you with such contempt.

Yes, get hold of the mortgage paperwork.

And make sure you get your hands on, and get copies of, absolutely everything that you can. Lie and make noises about 'knowing everything so that we can work on it as a couple' if you must - if there are debts/accounts etc. to come crawling out of the woodwork, you need to know. Employ any tactic you can to get him to open up now, while he and MIL are at least compliant.

Then get thee to a solicitor and take the scumbag for everything he's got.

It is exactly as SGB says above - the level of contempt this inadequate little shit has the cheek to have for you is unforgiveable. Why the hell would you want to waste the best of yourself on rebuilding a partnership with a nothing? You probably have half a life ahead of you - why waste it? Why rebuild a house of crap just so that the children can see years of resentment played out in front of them? It's easy for a stranger to say I know, but your posts show that you are already there in your head, I think. You sound too intelligent not to be. You can do so, so much better with your life than live it saddled with this drain of a man and his financial chickenbrain of a mother.

Get shot, get as much as you can for your children - what this shitty pair haven't already stolen from them, that is - then get on with living and earning and making them secure. He won't - not ever.

Personally I'd still be looking at ways to go after the money - fraud? - in your children's interests - but that may not help re. settlement, I know.

Oh and once it's all rolling along nicely I'd be telling MIL exactly what I thought - that her OWN MOTHER had the right idea in trying to keep money out of her grasping wasteful hands, that I hpe she's proud of the fact that she's stolen a good chunk of her grandchildren's future security from them, as well as helped to finally put the nail in the coffin of their parents' relationship. That the chances are that in the future she'll see less of them. Expecting an apology? Oh, my sides!

Oh, and the following:
'Especially DH and I will be responsible for the lifetime care of BIL when MIL passes on herself.'

No - he will. You and your children seem to have given quite enough to the drain that is that side of the family, don't you think? You'll be light years away, earning decently, knowing what's in the bank, and pitying him for the fuckup he is.

Re-reading some of this, I think I would be making another suggestion.

If MIL is always going on about the DC and is such a devoted grandmother, how about she agrees in the wake of this to put off those nice comfy retirement plans and GET A BLOODY JOB in order to at least put some cash away for those DCs' university funds? You know, the ones she effectively liquidated to pay off her creditors? Put that one to her...

I am so angry for you, and also - for you DH's poor grandmother. There's no doubt she wanted to avoid something like this happening. Your MIL's actions are scummy. What mother goes to her son and wheedles her own mother's last wishes away, to pay off her own stupidity, encouraging lies and deceit, knowing she's taking what her mother wanted protected for her grandchildren. What a rotten one.