Support for those in Emotionally Abusive Relationships

[ViVee]

I thought it would be a good idea to start a thread, a place to vent, offer support, advice.

I'm in an emotionally abusive relationship but I'm trying to find the tools to fight back - I've recently started counselling & the Lundy Bancroft book (Why Does He Do That? Inside The Minds of Angry and Controlling Men) (recommended by mumsnetters) has become my bible.

Anyone else feel the same?

[Anniegetyourgun]

Glad to hear of your happy ending, jellyvodka, and your Bill of Rights should be put on posters around the country!

So true about the script, HH. My excellent friend sent me a link to the Mumsnet relationship board when I was part-way through my divorce and flagging a bit, and it was so totally amazing to find how many men (and, to be fair, a few women) behave exactly like XH. I had thought our problems were unique, but actually they are extremely common. I'd look at one thread and, "OMG, that's exactly what STBXH said last night, word for word"; "STBXH does that all the time... did that shortly after we married... said that when we first went out..." It was quite spooky, but also empowering. I've been hooked on the site ever since

[HerHissyness]

And THAT would be the reason Abusers isolate their victims.....

[humptydidit]

Ladies, if you don't read Lundy Bancroft, get "Living with the dominator" which accompanies the freedom programme, it is much smaller and shorter than Lundy Bancroft and very light hearted with little cartoons etc. It covers much of the same stuff but isn't as heavy, might be a good starting point. The other plus point is that it is written by a British author so a slightly different perspective...
For example:

The Fairy Story. by Pat Craven author of the Freedom Programme

Once upon a time there was an unmarried princess who ruled her land wisely and well. She made the laws, collected the taxes and was loved by all her subjects. One day when she was sitting by her lake a frog hopped out of the water. ?Hello Princess? said the frog. ?I am not really a frog at all,? he continued. ? I am in fact, a handsome prince. I was turned in to a frog by a wicked witch. However, if you kiss me I will regain my handsome human form. I will then marry you. You can have my children and care for them. You can wash my clothes, cook my meals and clean up after me. I will take over as ruler and keep all the money. I will of course give a generous allowance for household expenses.?

Later that night when the princess was dining on sautéed frogs legs in a tarragon, cream and brandy sauce, she said to herself, ?I don?t f think so!?

On the freedom programme there is a lot of laughter as well as sadness, anger, frustration and about every other emotion you can think of... It really is suitable for everybody, you shouldn't worry that you don't deserve a place cos there is somebody worse off than you. The feeling of sitting in a room with a load of other people who know exactly what you are talking about is very liberating!!

www.amazon.co.uk/Living-Dominator-About-Freedom-Programme/dp/0955882702/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1306400628&sr=8-1&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

That is the link to it on amazon, it follows the freedom programme. The other thing that I like about it is that it talks about "the friend" who is a non abusive man, who we can all aspire to meet one day, so you come out feeling positive not that all men are bastards!!!

[humptydidit]

sorry link didn't work

www.amazon.co.uk/Living-Dominator-About-Freedom-Programme/dp/0955882702/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1306400628&sr=8-1&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

[humptydidit]

HH you are so right, if you got together 100 women who were victims of abuse and asked them to list the tactics the abuser used, I think everybody's list would contain most of the same words....
That is why barbie it kind of qualifies us a bit to predict what might happen... Pat craven author of the freedom programme says "I joke that I believe that all abusive men are abducted when they are six months old ad taken to a school in the mountains wehre they all learn to do and same exactly the same thing!"
That's why the part about staying safe is so important, even if you partner has never been violent, he might now start to be if you try to leave , or at the very least he will become much more abusive than he already was.

That bill of rights is fab!

[HerHissyness]

He he he, that school in the mountains!

You go past Commitment-phobes, turn left at Cheating Bastards, and it's there on your right!

[humptydidit]

[nicecupatea]

wizbit well done for talking about something that frightens you, getting it out in the open takes a lot of the fear away.

hissy at your directions to school for abusers. I used to congratulate myself that I had found a man who wasnt a commitment phobe or a womaniser

The Freedom program sounds really interesting, I am jealous of you UK ladies with these resources available to you.

I have just changed my status on facebook from "married" to "separated" and it just made my heart race!

[HerHissyness]

wizbit: oh good god, lord above... that is so EW! in retrospect! ((HUGS))

Take your time, you'll get there, all of you. just refuse to get sucked in to the bullshit and keep your eyes on the goal. Freedom, peace,tranquility respect

[Anniegetyourgun]

There you go, Wizbit, they wrote the book specially for you. It would be rude not to read it.

[ribbonsandlace]

P.S. Sorry for asking the bleedin obvious but what does STBXH stand for?

[nicecupatea]

hi ribbons and welcome

It had me puzzled for a while too but I think it means "soon to be-ex husband" Is that right?

By the way, couples counselling made things a lot worse for me. Please read what Lundy says in the book I mentioned, in summary it is not advisable at all, and frequently makes the abuse worse. Here is what happened to me

[barbiegrows]

Hi ribbonsandlace,
I think STBXH means soon to be ex husband? Just a guess. It may be a term used frequently on this thread...
I'm no expert but I mentioned before that if OH is being nasty, be careful on MN and cover your tracks on the computer. Horrible to be furtive but what he's doing is no holds barred abusive. We have been talking recently how abuse can switch from emotional to something more risky. I don't want to make you nervous, just being careful.
My question of the day (and yesterday) is how likely is it for a man to make the switch from being an emotional abuser to a violent one?

[HerHissyness]

OK, interesting question, here are some thoughts I have.

Aside from the immediate danger i.e risk of death - which is at the rare and extreme end of DV, the only difference is that you have to do what you have to do FASTER. LEAVE.

Removing the actual murderous types, the more casual, lower level smackers, kickers, punchers and what not are inflicting wounds upon us that will heal with little or no input from us, our body takes care of the actual bruises.

The mental effects, the mental damage cannot be fixed. Not without an awful lot of work by us, and usually in concert with some outside help, therapy, book, friends, family. We don't just heal all by ourselves.

So my question back is Does it matter if he graduates from one kind of abuse to another? EA is still abuse, but a secret, insidious one, one that is invisible to pretty much everyone, sometimes including the actual victim herself. DV is the abuse where if you call the police, they may have something tangible to charge him with. You can get faster help if you are strong enough and brave enough to make the break and accept it.

Did I read correctly somewhere that you have a 1:4 chance of being abused? Did anyone else hear this?

[HerHissyness]

Does that make sense?

[humptydidit]

HH I have heard that statistic as well... pretty frightening odds I think

I personally agree with you, it is actually the mental and emotional abuse which is ultimately severely damaging... I think even women who have been physically battered would agree that the emotional effects are just as bad if not worse that go along side it.

So HH I would agree with you, it doesn't really matter if he switches from one type of abuse to another, it is still abuse and will still hurt you and cause you long term harm weather it's verbal, physical, sexual whatever .

I'm sorry to be blunt, but I really think we would be better spent trying to sort our own heads and lives out than worrying about what he will do next.

[bigbuttons]

hi ribbons you know stbexp always says that to me about MN and the internet. His latest was " we lost you the computer 4 years ago, your children are desperate for their mother's love and attention" This is from a man who does nothing with his children.

I read 'living with the dominator' but couldn't relate it to my situation at all. That's odd because reading Lundy was like a slap round the chops.

barbie I don't know aout the violence following the EA. STB (soon to be) has been violent on occasions. The last time he did it I was 5 months pg with dc6 and holding a 11 month old baby, dc5, whilst balanced on the edge of a cot. My poor baby had terrible impetigo and acute diahorrea. I had just got her back off to sleep ( again) in my arms. STB came in her room, he was drunk and angry. It was about 11pm. We was being noisy, he was angry with me for some reason. I asked him please to be quiet or he'd wake dd. So he got louder and louder, coming closer and closer to me, I pleaded with him to quieten down. he put his face up against mine and then head-butted me. Blood poured out of my nose. It was horrible. he stood there watching and told me to stop making things up ( the injury) There was blood all over dd's babygrow. I remember so clearly because the babygrow was white.
He left the room and carried on drinking downstairs.
I called my mother and her partner and they came over. My mother talked with him, it was clear he did not think he had done anything wrong. She stayed the night,I remember taking dd to the emergency doctor the next day with my mother. STB acted as if nothing had happened, well that's not quite true he acknowledged hat he did was wrong, but there was no apology. I so wanted to end it there, hy on earth didn't I press charges??????
he claims he never meant to physically hurt me, obviously a bit of menacing of a pregnant woman, holding a baby whilst perched on the edge of the cot was ok then
If I bring it up he's cross that I'm still harping on about it. His attitude is we should all move on, he's not proud of what he did but it's in the past . If I move on he'll let go of the things I have done to him. WTF?

So sorry barbie that just all came out He has not been physically abusive since and that was over 4 years ago because I told him if he ever did that again I'd call the police. He complained that I was taking away his avenues of behaviour in arguments, constricting him

[humptydidit]

big buttons I hear you and I can totally relate to what you're saying.
Maybe you couldn't relate to living with the dominator becaues it's quite plain talking and I could see that it might not strike a cord if your ex is nicely spoken and well educated, I guess I mean quite posh?

All the talk of "prick gagues", "shagging you is like throwing a sausage up the dartford tunnel", "Pork swords" etc all related very much to me and my exH.

I think that even if the dominator book didn't strike a chord with you, you should still consider the freedom programme because it is exactly about what you're describing, the other women on my course have related incidents exactly like each of the ones I have read on this thread. The other good thing about it is that it runs during school time, term time only and also there will be creche facilities so there are no child care issues to worry about.

My exH had a go at me last week saying "haven't you got over it yet?" referring to 9 years of abuse... I didn't bother to reply, just hung up the phone. He doesn't get it and he probably never will

[bigbuttons]

Yes I think that's right humpty. I remember thinking the examples in the book weren't what was happening to me. It seemed to concentrate on more overt forms of abuse. STB is a water torturer of the highest degree.He is clever with words indeed.
I feel more exhausted now than I did when I had a newborn dc6 and 5 other kids under 8. I couldn't work it out. I bought self help books, hypnosois stuff, natural sleep aids, spent loads of money, trying to find ways to feel more relaxed and happy. I reckon I'm simply depressed. I don't feel depressed in they way I understand from times I had PND.
I feel full of joy when away from the house and him. I have loads I want to do. I see a bright future. It's being here with him , in this horrible situation that is depressing. I don't need ad's because away from the house I feel great, like I used to.

I wish he WOULD give me a slap or kick though, then it would be cut and dried, out he goes.

I will check out the freedom prog for my area though

[humptydidit]

sweetheart you aren't depressed you are being abused.... I promise you that once you get out of that situation that cloud will lift and you will be you again
x

[nicecupatea]

re: the violence/EA thing. I totally agree that the EA is WORSE. I have had 5 years of that but "only" 2 violent episodes, one a push to the floor when pregnant and the other pushing me up against a wall with his hands round my throat shouting that he would kill me. I am really struggling with how to "out" myself to friends and family as a victim of abuse at the moment, and I know that these stories would elicit the most shock/sympathy but actually, these incidents were NOTHING compared to all the daily sulks, tantrums, rowing in an utterly exhausting fashion, blaming me for everything, which just left me feeling so unloved and hurt all the time. I dont know how to tell people that THIS is why I cant be with him anymore without them thinking I am probably making a big deal out of nothing.

I think most women find out if their abuser is capable of violence when they successfully manage to thwart the usual tactics. If you always modify your behaviour when he sulks/shouts whatever, then violence isnt necessary, but when a favoured technique doesnt work for them anymore thats when you are most at danger of finding out how far they will go.

I also agree that working out if abuse is going to get worse/change is just another example of how the victim ends up spending all her energy trying to "manage" things and misses out on actually having a fulfilling life in the process.

bigbuttons if you are depressed it can be cured with ad's but you cant cure an EA relationship that easily.

[bigbuttons]

humpty I think you're right I don't feel depressed. I'm ok. It's just being here with him.

[bigbuttons]

nicecuppa "NOTHING compared to all the daily sulks, tantrums, rowing in an utterly exhausting fashion,"
Would you mind giving more details of the exhausting rowing. That rings some bells here. Anything that you would be happy to share I'd like to hear
thanks x