Is my marriage over or am I being a fishwife?

[myotherusername]

Regular MNer here, but namechanged for this. I'm at my wits end with my marriage and need some help getting some perspective on the situation. I'm not sure whether it's over and I'm in denial or whether this is normal and I need to get a grip.

We have been married 6yrs, have one DC and I'm 33 weeks PG.

The bad stuff:

• DH never pulls his weight around the house, despite us having numerous talks. e.g. I am currently ill with flu, massively PG, working full time and because I've felt so rotten this week the housework has slipped. Instead of doing more to keep the house going, DH has done far less than the v little he usually does and now the place is almost unlivable. When I ever mention housework he acts like a bratty teenager.
• I have asked him to read the Ina May book before we have our second DC. We are both keen to avoid the nightmare scenario of DD's birth and he said he would read it. Months later it remains unread and he now tells me he doesn't need to read it.
• He doesn't respect my views on parenting DD. I am constantly having to remind him to be consistent with her. He isn't, so she throws tantrums all the time then gets stressed and impatient with her and with me. It's horrible.
• I feel ignored a lot of the time. But then so does he I reckon. He watches TV while I hide behind my computer and work.
• We have no sex life to speak of. How we managed to conceive two children I will never know. Once a month is our average. Has been for years. I don't feel like sex because I spend so much time annoyed with him, but then he doesn't initiate either.
• I am working my arse off, up until my due date, and not planning to take much mat leave so we can afford to pay our bills and live comfortably. Meanwhile he spends £180 on a case of wine for his parents, £250 on a new suitcase for a two day work trip, and has declared that he is getting a new bespoke suit for Christmas. I'm counting the pennies and panicking about how quickly I can get back to work after having DC2.
• About twice a year he goes completely off the rails while out with mates/work colleagues, gets hugely drunk and becomes incommunicado. He last did this when I was 20 weeks PG and had no idea he had plans to go out. He did apologise afterwards, but then a week later disappeared again mid-afternoon drinking with a 'client' and got all arsey when I was worried about his whereabouts.
• I feel like a burden and an imposition in our relationship always having to ask him to do stuff or ask for a lift to the station when he's working from home and it would really be no bother. Not sure why. I just feel like I'm a pain in his arse a lot of the time.

The good stuff:

• He is an equal parent to DD. It's genuinely 50:50. And he is the one who gets up with her at 6am every day so I can get another 1/2 hr in bed.
• He tells me he loves me all the time and it feels genuine (even if it doesn't feel like it)
• We are very affectionate to each other, despite lack of sex.
• He cooks most of our meals and takes sole care of our pets.
• When asked, he will do jobs around the house, but it's so exhausting always being the one to point out the house needs vacuuming or a lightbulb needs changing.

I've run out of patience, again, with our relationship. I feel like we're going round in circles. Is this normal relationship gripes or something more serious?

Grace that's an interesting question. Gut instinct is that it would be worse. I don't know how to cope alone. I enjoy his companionship. But then he completely stresses me out too and leaves me feeling desperate...

I used to think I couldn't cope alone but after being a lone parent to two toddlers now for a year, in fact I love it. It's hard at times but rewarding and my home is very peaceful and tidy without my husband someone messing it up I can do what I like, watch what I want on tv, go to bed without worrying where he is or when he'll be home, my bank balance is a lot healthier too, the place is my little haven of peace with my two fab children now.

I do believe marriage counseling is always worth trying though.

I think what I am trying to say badly, is never make a decision based on fear, those are our worst decisions iyswim?

Counselling is not the end at all. It's helped me work out why I'm doing stuff anfd then I've made productive changes. That's what you and your dh need to do surely. He probably doesn't know why he does stuff-counselling can tease it out of him in a neutral environment. Put yourself on the relate list now or get him to take the wine/suitcase back(and buy one bottle and a £20 one in the sales like the rest of us do) and pay for some now.

having just read your OP I don't understand 1. why the hell you are with this man or 2. why the hell you are having a second child with him.

I sympathise here. I think I'm an odd mix of both you and your dh, and so is my ex. I'm going to list a few thoughts based on my experience only, so please feel free to disregard as I don't know either of you (obviously)

Xh was just naturally a lot tidier than me. It really didn't matter to me whether house was a bit of a tip as long as we enjoyed the time we had together. This meant that even though I did more than I needed, it was never enough for him. He would huff and puff about doing stuff I didn't think mattered that much.
The bit about when you stepped down a bit so did he is probably just that he was able to relax a bit, bet he wasn't complaining about stuff not done was he?
When I did do stuff, it was constantly subtly ( in the end not subtly) undermined. Eg Xh always restacked the dishwasher after I'd done it. In the end I just thought 'f* it do it yourself', giving him more excuse to get grumpy
Re: children, is his patenting style consistent 'to himself' and just not consistent with yours? If this is the case, it's not inconsistency per se, but it is different styles. You do need to address this and agree because it does confuse the kids otherwise.
The lack of communication is the deal breaker tbh. My Xh just acted like I constantly disappointed him. I felt unloved, under valued and my self esteem was rock bottom. In a way I wish he had said 'you don't do x, y, z' because at least I would have known how to adress it, instead he tried to ignore it but was very passive/aggressive.
Look at how your dh expresses his love ( google the 'five rules of love ' test). I think maybe you both express love very differently. The natural tendency is to express our love the way we would like to receive it, not how our loved one would like to receive it.
As I said, a lot of this may be not relevant. A lot of this I didn't figure out until it had got to the stage where our love was gone so I really hope you don't get to that point.

tea, you are perfectly articulate !

where to start ?

OP, you are not being a fishwife

your husband is acting like an arse and then stonewalling you when you try to discuss how bad you are feeling

that is not someone who respects you as an equal partner

you are watching the pennies and he is acting the "big man" with silly, show-off spending when you have a 2nd child to be born soon...who is he trying to impress ?

I share some of tea's little niggles wrt is there someone else in your marriage ? Possibly not gone too far just yet, but I am picking up on a little "distancing" from him. Is he secretive about his phone, FB, email etc ? The "blowout" nights (and days...) and going incommunicado are not the actions of a family man, sorry. His defensiveness about it when you challenge him is designed to shut you up and speaks volumes about where you figure on his "importance" scale.

His laziness around the house is also out of order, when you are heavily pg and still working. Is doing a bit of housework beneath him then ? I don't call a man who doesn't look after the environment you are living in, but leaves it for his knackered wife, an "equal parent"

Now I feel like I could actually go on and on saying stuff you really didn't want to hear. I think it telling that you very quickly, and with great evident relief, latched onto the "well perhaps I am BU and fishwife after all < phew >"

So, bottom line, if you want things to change, you have to be 100% sure that what you are feeling is valid or he will just dismiss your bad feelings as a minor inconvenience to him forever.

I think they are valid.

What do you think ?

Really feel for you. I was unhappy for a long time with exdh. For a lot of years I didn't even know. Also was amazed to conceive 2 dss.

Maybe you should wait until after dc2 is born before making any big decisions? He sounds very like my exdh, making empty promises and ignoring me, taking me for granted.

I'm with a very supportive dp now and have learnt not to put up with being ignored.

I hope you can get some clarity soon it can't be healthy for you.

I meant I didn't even realise how unhappy, think I wore blinkers.

I don't know how to cope alone

if you always preface any of your thoughts with this statement, are you willing to accept anything as long as you stay together ?

that is very concerning and puts you in an extremely weak position

please get some counselling help to untangle why you don't feel you could stand on your on two feet

Your post rang alarm bells with me too. I have now been separated from my H for over a year. I still can't really explain what was fundamentally wrong with our relationship. It was as if everything shifted slightly and nothing was quite right any more.

I could detail the way in which he gradually did less and less, the huge range of different strategies I tried to get him to understand how the situation was making me feel and the 18 months we did with Relate, none of which made any difference.

But now with the benefit of a little hindsight, I think that you can start to feel crazy very quickly if someone says that they care about how you feel but acts in a way that suggests the exact opposite. It feels like a very miserable version of groundhog day where your place is constantly in the wrong. We definitely got to a place where he thought we'd be happy if I could just quit moaning.

It has taken me over 40 years to learn that actions do truly speak louder than words and that if someone acts lazy, irresponsible or whatever then that is what s/he is regardless of what s/he says. This is the only way out of the madness. That and truly acknowledging your own feelings.

On a lighter note, the thing that shocked me most after he left was how much less housework there was without him there (even with 3 DCs).

Thanks AF

Sorry my little quote wasn't quite right earlier, what I meant was "never make a decision based on fear, those are our worst choices".

Secrets what a lovely post, I hope you're happy now

OP - I can't really offer much advice as such - but I think you are very right to be pissed off with a lot of his behaviour - especially the money. But maybe a good vent on here will help a bit?

I agree with someone else - get a cleaner in, even if it's temporarily whilst you're PG.

You're def not being a fishwife about it. You may as well give up on him reading that book by the way - men will always say they'll do something and won't. DH does it all the time.

Hope it all gets a bit easier for you, and try not to get too stressed and upset.

OP...you have gone very quiet

Thanks for your reply, OP :)

Along with your other respondents, I felt uneasy when you said "I don't know how to cope alone." This puts you on the back foot, and means you're placing the value of companionship above everything else. Given the quality of the companionship you've described this evening, that's a pretty dire state of affairs!

It seems to me that this is what leads to your feeling "desperate". It's almost as though you've decided you must put up with any amount of inconvenience/disorder/insecurity for the sake of companionship. Then, when the companionship falls short, you're still paying the price and wondering what went wrong ... As if you made a deal with yourself, the deal turned out to be a bad one, and now you feel robbed?

I may have misunderstood how you're feeling, of course, but I have to say your updates tonight painted such a sad, desolate picture, I'd feel pretty damn short-changed too! I am very wary about tackling big issues during a period of great change but I have the feeling there's something going on with your H. I don't know what, and it's up to you whether you decide to let it run its course while you deliver DC2 or to start prompting changes now.

The pair of you sound pretty miserable, tbh. If you were to suggest his moving out for a while - and I'm not saying you should - you might surprise each other and yourselves.

What an absolute pain that you're having to go through all this, now! If mumsnet did hugs, I'd send you one

Maybe she's gone to bed?

Teaandchristmascakeplease you're articulate and lovely. Had a peek at your profile and must say you're well shot of your twat of an ex. He's a fool. I can totally relate to feeling very free when they've gone, no matter how it arises.

Thanks Curiousmama - it's been horribly painful and I am still very much a 'work in progress' but having a good couple of days

Good that you're having a good couple of days and here's hoping hoping they multiply

OP, that sounds exactly like my H, and he was having an affair :( I'm not saying that yours is, plenty of marriages go through crap times without people taking that route, but the distance between the two of you is sending danger signals that should the opportunity arise, either you or he would be less inclined to resist temptation than you would if you were both 100% into your marriage.

Anyway, that's worse case scenario and hopefully your H isn't there yet. Berries hit the nail on the head for me when she talked about lack of communication - your H needs to be able to express what is stopping him being able to meet your needs in those ways. Why doesn't he feel like doing housework? Why is it hard for him to agree with you on parenting strategies? Maybe counselling would help get to the bottom of what's making him do selfish prattish things.

I don't want to get flamed for this, but maybe he needs something different from you in order to respond in a more positive way to things you want from him. IE I thought I was showing H I loved him by doing practical things, whereas what he would have responded to was more attention, "dates" and physical intimacy. I'm definitely NOT saying you should do anything too hard or unreasonable, or that your H's crappy behaviour is your fault. But if you talk about what he wants, and it's something you could do, it might help.

I hope that came across ok, and that you manage to find a way to be open with each other about all this.

I sympathise with you, my DP thinks its ok to spend money as and when and worry about bills when they come, this is why we have seperate accounts! I'd sit him down and say if you want to carry on spending like this fine, but use your own account and save some for babys arrival and childcare as I am having to go back to work early as we can't afford for me not to.
In genral though I think he is being a lazy typical man! We all know they don't think sensibly like us, he probably thinks its ok to have one drink, then another, then another! I suggest saying you are going for one, then stay out all night and leave him with the kids and have a bloody good time (after baby of course)!
For all of you suggesting hes having an affair, OP did say the last time this happened was 3 months ago! Obvs not acceptable but really there is no evidence to say he is at all (I know there isn't always).
As for shutting down when you try to talk, alot of men do this, they don't want an argument and they can't all talk about how they are feeling. Maybe write it as a letter and suggest he writes one back, you can word things much better when you can take your time to write it down.
Plus being v pregnant hormones are abusing your emotions at the moment! I know you said you've felt like this before and if you didn't have kids and weren't married you'd have probably left, but think back to the reason you love him and wanted to marry him, we all know no marriage is easy all the time! at Fab!!
This turned into a bit of an essay but I really wouldn't contimplate divorce, his Pro list sounds lovely!!

Thank you everyone, lots to think about here from all your very helpful posts. DH and I have spent the last few hours talking. He finds it so hard to have these kinds of conversations as he is the unconfrontational sort and just wants problems to go away of their own accord.

And I tend to bottle everything up and not want to question or talk about the difficult issues. I also tend to panic and lose perspective so all your thoughts and comments have really helped get things clear in my mind and work out what the real issues are that need addressing.

I feel like we have made some progress and have agreed to talk again properly when the working week is done. I will read the most recent posts in more detail in the morning.

DH isn't the secretive sort. V open about his phone, FB and email accounts to the point that we both regularly leave them open on each others PCs. I'm not worried about an affair at this stage but if we don't put some real effort into our relationship now then I fear this is where we would end up.

Off to bed now, feeling like we have made a connection at least and have started to talk about issues.

:) Lovely update. Hope you both carry things forward successfully :)

All the best

However, please don't make excuses for him based on the fact that he has a penis

It does no-one any favours

A lazy man is a lazy person, an uncommunicative person often has something they don't want to communicate, a spendthrift show-off is a dickhead no matter what the gender..

I could go on

Thank you Curiousmama

myotherusername - that sounds hopeful. Keep posting