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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Secret e-mail address and OW

111 replies

Louise2Louise · 08/12/2010 21:05

I really need some perspective please. Some 18 months ago I caught my DH sending an amorous text to OW. He denied and minimised before admitting to an inappropriate relationship with his colleague. I feared worse. He refused to discuss it other than to say he would end it. He deleted the messages he had posted on the address box he had created for her under an alias. He refused to give me any passwords but I discovered the password and adopted the address when he thought he had closed it down. Both he and she used aliases. He promised to close down the 7 or so e-mail addresses he had and keep only 2, one for work and one for personal. I discovered the passwords for both. He had refused to give them. I was dignified about my discovery but lost some 6 months of my life in grief. He appeared to get closer to me. I still checked his e-mails from time to time as he had told me how easily he had deceived his former wife because he understood computers and had a secret phone. His first marriage ended as a result of one of his girlfriends threatening to inform his wife. I read on MN that bad behaviour such as his often reoccurs after 6 months and so it was. I discovered compromising e-mails to a different colleague some six months after the original discovery. He denied anything other than flirtation. This time I went balistic. I offered him a divorce. He recoiled as he says he lost everything in his previous divorce. He admitted he was wrong and that his behaviour would cease. Last week whilst I was checking his e-mails a secret address list appeared showing a previously not known e-mail address for him. I wrote it down but failed to note the names on the address list which I have never seen before. He has an address list other than this. In order to check whether the e-mail address was an old one closed down like he had promised, I e-mailed it a message" Hello xxx'. I expected it to bounce back as unavailable. just in case it did not, I emailed it from the e-mail address of the OW, to which only I have access. It didn't bounce back. H works away often and he phoned me eventually asking me details about my whereabouts at the time of the message, and whether I had found any thing on the net. I was vague, but later thought it must relate to my e-mail. Still no reply 2 days later on the e-mail address of the OW. Late last night I googled the alias of the OW and up came a Twitter page listing contact between her and my DH. There had been contact her to him about one year ago, he had replied. DH had had depression at the time. Then again about 6 weeks ago, and then my HelloXXx message and his reply some minutes later saying Wonderful to receive your e-mail, but showing only the first few words of those e-mails. I am very upset about the existence of the secret e-mail address, and about him replying to her e-mails. Am I overreacting?
I feel dirty and ashamed that I snooped.

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Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 00:47

I am not trying to be difficult here, booyhohoho, but he assures me he has not been physically unfaithful. I do think he likes to tease, the male equivalent of a pr-ck teaser if you will forgive me. I may be totally wrong. I rather thought most men wanted to have sex outside marriage, but would not act on that desire. Am I completely messed up?

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melezka · 09/12/2010 00:50

Some men really like secrets.

And you sound like somebody who really likes the truth.

This is where things get really really difficult.

booyhohoho · 09/12/2010 00:54

sorry, i really didn't mean to imply you were, i was just trying to point out something that maybe wasn't as obvious to you. i know when you are faced with something like this you try and find all the reasons you can to stay and make it work.

he may be telling trh truth about not being physically unfaithful. taht poses two questions, again.

  1. is that purely because he cant? if he was physically able to, do you think he would have done?
  2. if he hasn't, his behaviour has led you to believe he has, he needs to work on that behaviour so as never to have you in this situation. it is not ok for him to behave in a way that makes you insecure or suspicious. and it is his behaviour here, and not as sometimes is the case, your trust issues.
Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 00:56

Melezka, his lack of capacity has only been for about 3 years. I read in The Times that some men are unfaithful when they have or have had health problems. I am not sure what you mean by "back up positions" .

I have learned to live with his secretiveness, provided I am fairly certain he is not hiding anything that might harm me, or humiliate me. I have had to learn to change. Maybe every spouse does.

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melezka · 09/12/2010 00:56

Physically unfaithful. Consequences in the realm of STIs and maintenance payments, among other things.

Emotionally unfaithful. Much more subtle and potentially longer lasting and damaging in that the blame is never adequately apportioned or admitted.

So you feel a failure and mad as well.

I'm not sure all men want sex outside of marriage: I know we as women are encouraged to feel a failure if they do, whether they act on it or not.

Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 01:01

booyhohoho, thank you for saying it is not me having trust issues. In the beginning I ignored behaviour that I now see as inappropriate, because I really believed that he would be faithful. He must have thought I was a blind fool. I tolerated so much flirting even though I felt humiliated.

Strangely, I do not feel too insecure, as it is most unlikely that he will leave me as he would hate another divorce.

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melezka · 09/12/2010 01:05

"back up positions" - sometimes men, especially if they are having physical problems, seem to like to 'collect' encouraging women to make themselves feel better about things. Not necessarily physical affairs: just that you feel you want to be the one who is the emotional lynchpin.

booyhohoho · 09/12/2010 01:06

i think men and women at one time or another consider sex outside their commited relationship. some people will never act on it (i am one of those) and some will. the issue is whether their partner will be hurt by them doing so. i know for a fact that my ex thought of sex with other women. it didn't bother me in the slightest, i think it is only natural to fantasise and imagine. however it would never be acceptable to me for him to act upon it. that is where the line is.

you need to decide where your line is.

Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 01:11

That's interesting Melezka. DH suffers from unmedicated bouts of depression and although he acts pompous, I sense he has low self esteem. Many of the women he collects are themselves needy, and it seems, grateful for any male attention, and prepared to flatter him to keep the attention he gives them. Women who have just been dumped, seem to gravitate to him too. When I asked him "Why", he could only reply that he wanted to be "popular".

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Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 01:18

Booyhohoho, I know where I draw the line and he has crossed it long ago. I rather think I am conservative on these matters. However, when I asked DH if it would be okay for me to behave like he does, he was absolutely clear that it would not be okay. Maybe that is why he is so secretive.

Its how to live with it, or without him. I didn't meet anyone else in the years we were a couple but not married. I am not afraid of being alone, but I would miss the friendship, the shared interests and the practical input. We used to have a lot of fun. He will no doubt say that I have spoiled that by snooping and making mountains out of molehills.

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Mumi · 09/12/2010 01:20

He refused to discuss it with you when he thought he had nothing to lose.
Tellingly, he then started paying you lip service not because he doesn't want to lose you, but because he doesn't want to lose anything else.

The only thing which will make him realise what he has lost is you following through with a divorce. I'm sorry :(

Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 01:23

Heavens Mumi, that is brutal.

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melezka · 09/12/2010 01:24

Depression (for a partner) is shitty (I KNOW it's shitty for the partner, yes) because your partner is self-obsessed almost by definition and you can't, it seems, do anything about it and that includes calling them on behaviour such as collecting needy people to make themselves feel better.

Sometimes when the depression lifts the behaviour changes. In other words, it's like a symptom of the depression. But you would have to be fairly secure in this knowledge, and secure that the end was in sight/possible.

booyhohoho · 09/12/2010 01:28

I'm afraid i agree with mumi. i think he will continue to do this to you. he has no reason to stop. he isn't losing anything by doing it and he isn't gaining anything by stopping. if youhave drawn your line and he has crossed it and you are still there, then he knows you will always tolerate it, despite you saying that you wont. it's up to you whether you actually will tolerate it or whether you will leave and no longer be cheated on because either way, he will see other women and he will lie.

Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 01:33

Melezka, I think that is why there are periods when nothing inappropriate happens. When he is depressed, he seems to need other women's flattery/attention most. But I'm not his nurse, his Mother, his therapist or a detective. I have feelings too. He is very negative and cynical at times, which is wearing. I could forgive him the depression, its clearly not his fault, but I need help understanding/making sense of the communications with other women.

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Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 01:39

I think booyhohoho that is why I posted. If I admit what I have just discovered, and I stay, I have no weapons left. He can then do as he wishes without consequences. I'm not at all sure I can conceal what I know. I am quite likely to make unpleasant quips, which is unpleasant for both. I don't want to be that sort of person. I still love him unfortunately. Leaving him, at this time would punish me too.

I can't sleep for obvious reasons, I'm so grateful that you are awake. Why can't you sleep?

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Mumi · 09/12/2010 01:43

As I said, I'm sorry you're in this situation, but you asked for perspective and I'm afraid that is mine...

booyhohoho · 09/12/2010 01:48

because MN is just sooo addictive!! i can't post and go to bed, i have to stay up to see if anyone responds Grin i am my own worst enemy.

have you any lavender oil? it can help to relax you.

i don't want to upset you but i know from experience it is easy after a night's sleep to rationalise everything to make it seem not such a big deal and try and forget what you know. I can't tell you whether to tell him what you know, but i will be here whatever you decide. i don't envy you this at all. it is heartbreaking to know you are shouldering this tonight. try and get some sleep, you won't do yourself any favours by becoming over tired.

Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 01:52

Mumi, I'm grateful for your posts, I sort of knew I would get that sort of advice.

Booyhohoho and Melezka, thank you for spending so much of your time . I just want to curl up into a ball and cry, so I think I will go to bed now.

Thank you all. Maybe some more thoughts tomorrow?

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booyhohoho · 09/12/2010 01:56

yes, do come back tomorrow and let us know how you are feeling and what you are thinking. there is always someone here to talk, even if we aren't.

and BTW if anyfucker or chippingin were here, you would have alot stronger response than mumi's, but they really know what they are talking about. another poster who i think would be very helpful for you to talk to is whenwillifeelnormal.

AnyFuckerForAMincePie · 09/12/2010 07:34

hello Louise

I think unless you are prepared to be a "surrendered" wife who turns a blind eye to the sexual peccadilloes of her husband there is no future for your marriage

Perhaps you could negotiate an open relationship, where you also get adoration and sexual flattery with other men. Would he go for that ? Or is only he allowed to pursue cheap thrills on the internet ?

Some women can live like that. Many women lived like that, in the 1950's Xmas Hmm

He is a compulsive liar and rather a pathetic specimen, tbh. My respect for him would have evaporated a long time ago.

Bottom line. You know he will never be someone who doesn't get some sort of thrill out of deceiving women.

So, either take the deceit out of it completely (by telling him you know, and now you can both get your jollies however the fuck you like) or dumping his sorry arse and finding someone who isn't suffering from such pathetically low self-esteem he has to make a fool of you to big himself up.

I am very sorry x

spidookly · 09/12/2010 07:53

Well if you love him too much to "punish yourself" by leaving then you just have to accept a shitty marriage with a lying misogynist who barely conceals his contempt for you. You aren't even a full part of his life if he has been keeping you a secret from his children and you have never met them.

It sounds like he abused his ex-wife as badly as he's abiding you. Luckily for her he left her. She got money and children out of it.

What have you got?

A man who washes the dishes (big woop) and tries to buy your compliance.

Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 08:39

ouch spidookly.

I am shocked at the strength of most of the reactions.

My immediate problem is what do I do tomorrow? He must know that the e-mail from her old address to his secret address is not from her. He knows I know of the existence of her old address. He questioned me about my whereabouts at the time of sending it, and as to what I had found on the web. H sounded agitated, and has never so questioned me before. She may have confirmed that she was not using that old address. He must know it's me. He kept telling me he loved me (b--tard) in his phone call to me last night. I can see that I have to think very hard about the future. But what do I do tomorrow. I am sick of being a victim, is there any way I can handle this with dignity. Is silence, and keeping him guessing as to what I know, and what I am going to do, better than confrontation. He argues better than I do. I always lose, even when I am right.

Does anyone know why my e-mail to him and his response to her ( not to the old e-mail address) appeared on her Twitter list, and how I access the whole message?

Surprisingly I did manage some sleep. I feel a bit less hurt and a bit more angry than last night. Thank you MN

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Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 08:59

Louise again. I know his secret e-mail address and his usual address, both are gmail addresses. I am considering using his usual address to sign in and change the password on his secret address, and then read anything he has not deleted. If I did it at night when he is not surgically attached to his screen, could I then not just delete the message informing him that a request had been made to change his password? Is that possible? Would his i pad also have the message deleted?

I need a lot of evidence before I confront him if I do. He will only admit what I know. `He will say she contacted him and he only replied very briefly, just to be polite.

Does any one have a better or different idea?

He is at home tomorrow and most of next week. I need to get this right.

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Louise2Louise · 09/12/2010 09:06

Thank you AF. He hated his Mother and rebelled against her. Do you think he is now putting me in her place?

I have thought about making my own life, but don't really want to have secret lovers. It's just not me. I would hate the stress. However, I clearly have to think all the unthinkable.

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