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Original poster

Single Women and Married Men Friendships - What are the rules??

130 replies

SurreyAstronaut · 28/09/2010 01:30

Hello - first post here so please be gentle, I need some advice on a friendship...

I am the single woman (27), until recently I worked with a guy who I get on well with. It was innocent enough and was just chats over coffee, friendly emails and occasional lunches. He is in his mid forties and married. I have always considered us to be mates and nothing more, I am not attracted to him and he has never said or done anything that implies he is attracted to me.

He has recently left our company and we have stayed in touch, although less frequently than when we worked in the same office - we email maybe once or twice a week, very standard/friendly catch up emails on what the others are up to. I had never questioned it or felt that we were doing anything wrong until recently when I mentioned to a friend that we had discussed meeting up for lunch and she told me that it was a bit weird "going out with other peoples husbands" and now I am worried that I am inadvertently breaking some unwritten rule.

Is it a big no no to meet a married friend for lunch if it's just the two of you? Am I being naive in thinking that we can carry on being friends now that we don't work together?

OP posts:

Malificence · 28/09/2010 11:10

Hmm, I'm on the fence a bit with this one, DH has lots of women friends (all old work colleagues) that he keeps in fairly regular contact with and if we see one of them in town etc. they will often fling themselves at him and give him a hug, which amuses me rather than sees my hackles rise, however, there is one particular (younger) woman who is recently divorced and she is a bit too keen at keeping contact for my liking, he tells me everything so I know how often she texts him (and makes simpering comments on his facebook) , it got to the stage where I had it out with him and said I thought she had a bit of a crush on him ( we'd both helped her out when she left her husband and she was quite aloof with me) I said to him to not be surprised if she invited him out and started telling him how wonderful he is and how she wished she had a man just like him and how lucky I was - I just got carried away with a scenario of this attractive 30 year old making cow-eyes at him and asking him for a hug . Of course he thinks I'm bonkers but hopefully if she ever does start chasing him, he'll recognise what I said and cut her off. I'm not the jealous type, but she riles me.

gorionine · 28/09/2010 11:15

tough one. I am married and not jalous but if DH had time/money to go out to lunch with someone elase than me it would me. As well, the constant proximity (emails, phone contact, lunches...) would make it easier for feeligs to grow and move on even if friendship is really the only thing both of you have in mind now.

I think Loves2walk is very wise.

motherinferior · 28/09/2010 11:20

I totally agree with Larry.

And I don't particularly want DP's female friends to invite me along, be a Friend Of My Marriage (not that I'm married) etc. I would much rather see my own friends.

loves2walk · 28/09/2010 11:22

I think the danger is in these friendships is that a level of intimacy becomes normalised so that each little progression to the stage of intimacy feels OK and a small step. But actually over time a huge boundary can be crossed. That's why I'd say to find out if the wife is aware and question why not, if she isn't.

The flattery of a younger women seems to represent a huge challenge to the principles of some men - like my H! I always thought he was strong, moral and adoring of me - seems his ego wasn't that principled.

bbtfm · 28/09/2010 11:22

Hy meet as many people as you can in life be honest and dont hurt anyone thems the rules I find work in life.
Ask him to invite the wife then you will have two friends and every one will know exactly whats what.
If he makes an excuse why she cant come I think thatwill give you a clear answer to your problem.

loves2walk · 28/09/2010 11:25

Thanks gori! :)

Turns out I wasn't that wise when I was playing at being a cool, relaxed wife and allowing my H to conduct an emotional affair right under my nose.

No more cool wife, me. I am now a rottweiler with my H. He now knows my boundaries clearly and having lunch/texts whatever with a single woman is way outside of them. But I learnt the hard way.

larrygrylls · 28/09/2010 11:27

Loves2walk and bbtffm,

Some people have friends from different spheres of life. It would be really strange to invite one's partner to a reunion with an ex colleague of either sex. My wife would hate it; it would all be reminiscences about work and laughs over people she does not know and will never know.

If the OP wants a friendship which is what she has said, and I see no reason to disbelieve her, then why not have a friendship? Even if he has other designs, she can always make very clear that is not what she wants.

BitOfFun · 28/09/2010 11:28

I am clearly an unsociable git too then

I get that people might swap the odd "hi" on facebook etc, but I don't think I have ever had lunch with a casual friend more than once in a blue moon. And as for an ex-colleague- jeez, what do you even have to talk about to see them every week?

loves2walk · 28/09/2010 11:31

OK larry but surely the offer should be there for the wife or husband in this type of situation so they know they are welcome, and can decide for themselves if they want to go along.

If there is secrecy involved, there is a reason for that secrecy and that's what I'd be on my guard against.

JuJusDad · 28/09/2010 11:35

Shiney, how could you? Communicating with other people? And even worse, men?

You're dumped.

What Gay40 said.

SA - your friend has told you about herself and her world view / insecurities, as opposed to imparting wisdom about what you should or shouldn't do.

motherinferior · 28/09/2010 11:37

But maybe they're not particularly welcome not because the OP and her friend are holding back their Torrid Passion but because they are friends? I don't expect to sit in on my partner's friendships. I'd feel a twit and get very, very bored.

bbtfm · 28/09/2010 11:37

Thanks loves2walk You have explained it better than me.

WhenwillIfeelnormal · 28/09/2010 11:37

I agree with Loves and I think there needs to be some clarity about what is meant by the term "Friend of the Marriage". This doesn't mean a friendship with the wife, in this instance.

Opposite sex friendships have really enhanced my life, from school, from university, in the workplace and through my DCs. I wouldn't be without them, but there are some boundaries I'm aware of, together with a fairly good antennae about intention.

Surrey, in your shoes I would be fairly light-hearted about this at first, but try to establish whether your friend's wife knows about your contact and meetings. That's one of my boundaries you see - never to collude in someone else's secret.

And if he starts confiding that he is unhappy, or that his wife has her faults, visualise another red flag.

The friend of the marriage in this instance would suggest he talks to his wife and looks inwards at his own faults, while mentally wondering why he is telling you all this.

The person who isn't a friend of his marriage would say: "Oh poor you, your wife sounds dreadful - I'm not like her at all, you know..."

larrygrylls · 28/09/2010 11:39

Lovestowalk,

I am not sure about that. I would not keep it a secret from my wife but I would not invite her. And vice versa, I would not expect her to invite me.

I don't think it is secretive to have one's own friends. I think it is healthy. Clearly male/female friendships do have the potential to become more. However, the two parties both have to want it to happen.

I think it is important to have some autonomy within a marriage. You do not own one another other than sexually.

bbtfm · 28/09/2010 11:45

larry are you a mum?
And your wife might also enjoy seeing you with your friends at a reunion have you ever taken her.

motherinferior · 28/09/2010 11:46

I am a mum. I have no wish to go to my partner's reunions. Why on earth would I?

bbtfm · 28/09/2010 11:49

Thats called having a choice have you ever been asked?

larrygrylls · 28/09/2010 11:49

bbtfm,

Weird question. I am a father, for what it is worth.

I have taken her to every do where partners have been invited and not taken her when they were not.

If I don't go out on my own for a long time, my wife asks me what is up and virtually boots me out. She also believes it is healthy occasionally going out on our own. And from time to time, I look after our 15 month old, and she goes to meet an old colleague. I am not really sure where you are coming from here??

BitOfFun · 28/09/2010 11:53

Oh god no. I don't want to police my partner's social life.

I am simply making the point that a) I don't have the time or inclination to have lunch with anyone regularly every week, b) if I did, it would be a friend i considered "close", and c) if I happened to be able to shoehorn an ex-colleague that I wasn't too arsed about in on that regular a basis, then I would be having dinners with my more valued friends and presumably snorting cocaine off the naked bodies of the ones I fancied just a little bit...

How does one fit it all in?

I am not surprised the OP hasn't had time to come back to the thread

WhenwillIfeelnormal · 28/09/2010 11:53

I think this is getting derailed with implications that couples must be joined at the hip.

The red flag is about secrecy either about the existence of the friend an/or the quantity and content of the interactions. It's not about couples seeing their separate friends together, which I agree would be stultifyingly boring and unhealthy.

bbtfm · 28/09/2010 11:56

Sorry Larry I just meant there is no harm in asking I understand where you are coming from but to surrey she dosnt want to in this case give the wrong impression this is an innocent meeting.
Also wife may want to come its not your wife is it?
Sorry cheap joke.

larrygrylls · 28/09/2010 11:57

When,

Why are you looking for "red flags". The OP says that she is not attracted to him and he has never shown himself to be attracted to her.

Do you disbelieve her? And, if you do not, what is the problem with them meeting up?

talleyrand · 28/09/2010 11:58

over years I have had many female friends.
it is perfectly possible to maintain a platonic friendship, but I would say that - if i am honest - any one of those friendships them might have progressed to more, under different circs.

yes it is possible to stay just friends - whatever you do the sex thing is always out there.

Harry : no man can be friends with a woman that he finds attractive. He always wants to have sex with her.
Sally : So, you're saying that a man can be friends with a woman he finds unattractive?
Harry : No. After a while you pretty much want to nail 'em too.

Sally : What if THEY don't want to have sex with YOU?
Harry : Doesn't matter because the sex thing is already out there so the friendship is ultimately doomed and that is the end of the story.

loves2walk · 28/09/2010 12:02

I would say that attraction isn't the only guide to use when judging is something suspect or not.

You can start of not being attracted, or pretend to yourself that you are not, but still start feeling a growing intimacy with someone.

I totally agree about the friends thing. I would hate my H to police my friendships, but I tell him everything, so there is no need. I told him recently about a schooldad being slightly flirty with me - not to wind him up or play games, or make him jealous but so my H knows why I am a bit wary of this dad. He can then support me in keeping my distance.

expatinscotland · 28/09/2010 12:06

With the exception of a completely right-wing guy I've known since I was 14 who's married with 3 kids and a grandfather, all my male friends are gay.

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