NPD / Abusive partner - Recovery thread

[IseeGraceAhead]

These threads were started last year by therealme though I gather there were excellent predecessors.

Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) is a diagnosable condition on the continuum of Personality Disorders. Few Narcissists are diagnosed, however: a person must either present themselves for treatment or be sectioned to ensure diagnosis. Narcissists are very clever, they generally avoid compulsory referral. Narcissists believe They Are Right & Everybody Else Is Wrong; they will never seek treatment as they find themselves perfectly fine!

Common misconceptions:

[1] You can't call someone NPD if they haven't a diagnosis. Diagnosis is unlikely for the reasons above. Even Narcissists agree it's reasonable to determine a personality type as NPD (see links in first post). If you are in a relationship with a Narc, you don't need to be a clinician to know.

[2] He's got Aspergers or BPD, or is just a bit shit at dealing with people. Really? The obvious question is: why would you want to devote your life to someone like this? On a more technical note: emerging evidence, via biopsychology, suggests that Asperger and NPD brains exhibit similar differences from the average brain. And BPD is the baseline for all other Personality Disorders.

[3] S/He isn't "bad", they're just very hurt. Yes, they are very hurt. The more insight you gain into this spectrum, the more pain you feel for the sufferer. If you have a Narc parent, it's almost a given that you've gained tremendous insight - it was a necessity for your survival. The important thing is, YOU are not the same or you wouldn't be reading this. And understanding does NOT mean you can fix it.

[4] S/He just needs loving care. Yes, they do. They need it like a junkie needs heroin. You can keep on giving, they'll keep on taking and it will never be enough to satisfy them. Never. They'll suck you dry (emotional 'vampire') and then they'll rip you to shreds, just because you 'ran dry'.

[5] I get that s/he's abusive, but why say they've got a Personality Disorder? There's a spectrum of disorders: some are more 'needy'; some more 'domineering'; some are just fucking strange. At bottom, they're no more or less than deviations from the average. Nobody would choose a disordered realtionship unless they suffer from a need to be their partner's therapist. If this is you, try reading some of the links below.

Thank you ,Grace. I also recognised myself in your post.
I don't miss the anxiety that went with the drama,or the embarrassment at public scenes.But I do find life seems to be lacking something when it is calm and routine.Although I crave calmness and routine.

SmashingNM ,I am concerned for you.If your partner is punching the wall,calling you names and shouting,that is NOT OK. I believe relationships do exist in which there are never arguments like this,although I have not experienced one.
"More respectful" is not enough. Especially when you are aware yourself of having no boundaries.
You are not "lucky" that your partner is not any worse,or not as bad as your ex.

You deserve everything a "normal" person should,and would.

Of course you - and all of us are normal.But we have been trained by "nutters",as Grace said.At least,I know I have.

I too,want to find peace ,calmness and.....gulp...love before I die.

Of course there is also the theory that my self image was compromised before I met him...

The stunts he has pulled, he has dismissed, and it has to have been in my best interests (i.e not rocking the boat and being without a partner) to overlook such acts of betrayal and cruelty.

It's this that makes me kick myself for being so bloody idiotic.. and to have a DC with him.. DS has a shit dad, because I didn't value myself better.

Have no idea how to overcome that one, but early days eh?... main thing I supposed is to stick to some kind of routine and see how we can make a decent life for ourselves.

Being trained by nutters, yes I get that now. Didn't see it for years, I thought he knew everything...

pirhanamorgana - thanks for your concern. the wall punching etc is not ongoing. but i've promised myself that if it ever happens again i will be straight on here to get an impartial view. i don't want to have that sort of behaviour in my life anymore. i do want to find the strength in myself to put down boundaries and stick to them.

however i think there probably is a fine line where people can lose their cool / have a bicker and it's not a deal breaker in the relationship. i just need some help deciding where that line is.

my dad has been emotionally abused by my mum for many many years and just allows it to continue and so i don't have experience of seeing a healthy relationship and its dynamic. in my house it was normal to go to sleep with my mum shrieking at my dad like a deranged harpie / calling him all the names under the sun / belittling him infront of us or others etc.

i'd also say i've done some things i'm not too proud of in relationships before (including current one). punching myself, name calling, saying i wanted to die, locking myself in rooms etc.

in hindsight i wish i had dealt with this stuff BEFORE getting into another relationship instead of rushing into yet another one.

SNM, how much time did you have between relationships? Did you go and have therapy after your ex before your dh? It doesn't sound good the punching walls.

Little Miss, I remember your posts about how you were treated abroad and how that culture brought out the worst in your dh, how long is he gone for?

MH, that is IT... he has a return, but as he told me, he can move that for another 18m...

Ding dong, he is gone...

SNM, think we are all guilty of not dealing with things before moving on, it takes time, age and a whole lot of emotional intelligence to get that we need to be happy for us, and not as a result of someone loving us (or not)

If you grew up with people shouting, you are going to think it's normal.

My parents never argued, they also clearly never discussed anything either, cos he cheated, she wouldn't forgive him, (don't blame her, totally right thing to do) and they split up.

Then of course any disagreement with a P, I thought was the end, so did anything to get things back on an even keel again. Never let it just be, needed the reassurance that we were OK... and that I think is where an abuser can let himself in to your psyche and exploit it for his own means.

FWIW, 'H' doesn't think he's an abuser, he thinks I abused him.. and then goes on to talk about his culture and how his dad treated women (lest said the better) so he couldn't help it...

To all of the above, once home and re-grouped in the UK, I said bollocks, and wouldn't have it.

there was just under a year between ex N split and meeting current OH. although i didn't spend proper time being single. instead i went for a sort of drunken promiscuity that included all sorts of dodgy and dangerous situations - but i didn't care because it was almost a passive form of suicide. i would literally go into a club on my own, drink shots of vodka, dance and throw myself at anyone with a heartbeat (male or female or combinations). i sort of didn't care if i ended up dead. i was in this state when i met OH.

Did you meet your oh SNM, in a club alone when drunk then?

at the time i wouldn't have said this was what i was doing. in my mind i was spreading my wings and having a good time. yeah great time...ending up with my head cut open from falling over drunk and a knife held to my throat by some dodgy geezer who i'd gone home with.....

You know you asked me how I'm abusing myself, SNM? Well, like you I've been through periods of having "too much fun" . Although I haven't resorted to punching myself I do isolate myself, criticise & call myself names, fail to take proper care of myself, fail to take care of business, etc, etc ... (and then slag myself off for it, natch).

I'm working on it.

You are not those people now, you can leave them behind.

that's true. however i think i need an awareness and honesty of my past self in order to make sure i don't repeat the behaviours.

the more i learn about abusers / abused the more i realise they are two sides of the same coin. it brings a rather sinister sense to the phrase "other half".

it's time to take a long hard look and say i've been abused and i've also been abusive. then say that i am not my behaviour and i can be different and choose different responses and ways of being now and in the future.

:) very positive final paragraph there, SNM :)

True SNM, but use the honesty as a tool, not a crow bar to beat yourself with.

What's done is done, for very valid reasons that made sense at the time, they do not make sense anymore. You know better, you are doing better.

Be kind to yourself at every opportunity.

i also think the appeal of the narcissist to someone like me is the appeal of being a mirror. there is no more effective mask than being a mirror. and no more appealing ego boost than seeing the grandiose reflection of the narcissist presented as if it is you.

this is why their idealisation hook at the beginning of the relationship is so addictive. they tell you you are perfect / "the one" etc. it gives you a sense of the splendour they feel as a god-like narcissist but it is actually themselves, not you they are talking about. i equally think when they devalue you it is because they have had a glimpse of their true self and they don't like what they see.

it's so good not to be a mirror. but a little scary to lose the mask. i think perhaps that is what my social isolation is about. i'm scared of letting people in to see the real me. i'm scared of spontaneous acts of friendship incase i haven't had time to prepare the protective mask. so i've ignored the out of the blue calls for chats incase i say something revealing until those calls just stop coming. i limit invitations incase the house isn't tidy enough. i feel i always have to present a good face to the outside world.

is NPD the same as the self aggrandising personality some out gay men adopt in public?

Heroine that sounds homophobic. i'm sure some gay men are narcissists but so are some straight men. the fact you have honed in on gay men speaks more about your own prejudice.

No its not homophobia, its just that some of this reminded me of that very high camp, 'i'm brilliant' persona that a lot of gay men adopt (quite artifically as they often don't have it at home) when they are on nights out, and/or when they are near men they are attracted to. I don't hate it, I am just curious

i think you would have to make that judgement on an individual basis. i don't think you can just lump people together on the grounds of sexuality. i don't see what that serves tbh.

Not all narcissists have a personality disorder. A lot of male gay scenes promote high levels of narcissism, which is basically showing off and unrelated to any psychiatric conditions.

Several posters to these threads have commented that they suspected covert homosexuality in NPD partners - but that's a whole different thing.

Mind you, Heroine, your post made me chuckle as it instantly reminded me of my very personality-disordered ex-GBF!

That Carl Moat, was apparently bisexual secretly, and he seemed a narc/psychopath/sociopath type to me.

Grace, can you expand more on Russel Brand please, I had no idea he was a diagnosed narc?!

i'm not sure i like all this implication that non heterosexual sexuality = personality disorder. it's rather prejudiced if you ask me.

do you mean raoul moat?

SNM, yes Raoul Moat, not Carl Moat! I watched a programme about him a while back, he knew that there was something not right with him mentally and he unfortunatly did not carry through with therapy. There was something on mailonline about him hiding his sexuality, he was apprently in a long term relationship with a man, as well as his relationships with various women.

Are any of you watching EastEnders? Jeanine is gaslighting and playing mind games with Whitney! I remember thinking before my eye's were opened, that people like that don't realy exist!

Not implying that gay = personality disorder in the least, SNM! In fact, I stated that clearly. Narcissism is a healthy human quality. Dressing up, showing off and joining cliques (for want of a better word) is narcissistic, not disordered.

Not only did I share the intuition, fairly common amongst posters to these threads, that my XHs had repressed homosexual leanings, but my nother recently told me she always felt that way about Dad! Going back to your 'mirror' observations, it seems pretty natural to me that a Narc man would seek his reflection in attractive men.

Not every remark about gayness is homophobic

MH - I'm going to watch it online! Thanks!

Lets not also forget that many people see any middle class, creative, imaginative emotional, intelligent, good looking, well dressed, non-abusive, caring trait in a man as 'gay'...