statley homes thread - dysfunctional families

[Mummiehunnie]

I had a look back and could not find the old thread, for adult children who grew up in unhealthy dysfunctional families, and were abused as a result!

Hi Grace??!! Like yours too. Thanks for replying, thought my epic post would put everyone off.

You are right and I actually feel totally comfortable with it and almost happy and relieved at getting myself and dc back out. Have been noticing more and more, especially since I broke up with ex, like I am not under anyones protection anymore iyswim and then can just start stepping up the old rubbish?

My sister just ignores, makes duty phone calls, Mothers Day, Christmas etc, unfortunately our relationship has been damaged by my Mum's game playing over the years and we are not immensely close. We are beginning to build something though, was with her just last weekend. We do talk a lot about our the parents but it has pretty much all been said so many times.

It is so hard to know what to say when you cut them off, what I would really like to say is "No I am not responding to your calls at the moment because I don't like the things that Dad is saying about my housekeeping and DS and I knowing you as I do I know that the reason you sit in silence when he is coming out with all that crap is that you have discussed it at home in your usual toxic way, got him all wound up and then set him off, I can feel things are regressing between us and I hated seeing the look of confusion and hurt on my dc's face when you moaned about the curtains in the bedroom falling down when they are not even put up PROPERLY IN THE FIRST PLACE...OK!?".

So probably be my usual yellow belly self and say nothing, just not take their calls .

Oh, but it would be so worth SAYING that, complete with capital letters
It's a strange situation with siblings, isn't it? I'm feeling very remote from mine atm - conversation is minimal and matter-of-fact, then somebody will make a small remark about the parents and there'll be a brief moment of closeness & understanding. Then the doors slam shut again. It'll be nice if your increased distance from P&M ends up bringing you closer to sis ... one thing at a time, though, eh.

Shimmery - your situation sounds a bit similar to mine.

I think a bit of parental irritation is to be expected, but there is a line that can be crossed and it sounds like yours are crossing it. I think if they are continually disrespecting you and winding you up and making you feel uncomfortable then you have a stark choice: either set boundaries or withdraw.

I had to set boundaries. My mother eventually got the point and 'behaves' because she wants to see my dc, although we don't see her very often. My father, angry at me for saying he and my mother were abusive, does not want a relationship with me. So me and my DH and dc would only see him once or twice a year at family functions, where he would blow hot and cold. Sometimes he wouldn't be talking to me, sometimes not to DH. There was no rhyme or reason. I don't care that he doesn't speak to me but the attitude he gave DH or me sometimes was not on, especially as it was in front of my children. The last time I saw him was so bad: he refused to talk to me even when I was asking him if he was alright continuing to hold my baby or if he wanted to give him back! My father then made a dig about me to a person we'd just met. So after then, I decided I wouldn't go to any family gathering if my father would be there. This meant missing my niece's first birthday party, but so be it. It hurts a bit to miss out on things like that, but I'm not going to put up with his moody crap any more.

shimmery Agree with others that you should absolutely take a step back. You dont need to put up with that crap. Not anymore. As for telling them there is nothing wrong with just simply avoiding their calls. I mean if you laid out everything behind your decision would they listen anyway? Or, would it just end up in a row. Hold on to your sanity and just avoid them instead perhaps.

itsGagain Is that the same as inner child work? I havent really done any if that is what it is because I do feel I need a counsellor to go through it with. I had an online counsellor and we did touch on it but I found it gurt wrenchingly painful and ran away . Im hoping face to face (when it finally happens) will be easier, better in that I will feel more supported.
But how are you anyway? How are you feeling now as I know you have had some difficult times lately.

mashitup Those family gatherings are teeth and butt clenchingly awful aren't they. The last I went to was a year or so ago and was the first time Id seen my own mother in a year and I had to sit there whilst she flounced about. My dad hadnt spoken to me either for some time and took dd off of me and went into the other room to give her to my mum
Your dad sounds incredibly controlling and very childish. It sounds like a wise choice to stay away from such game playing.

erm that should read gut- not gurt

Hello
I don't know where to start, but it has taken me twenty odd years to realise that it is not my fault.

After reading through the posts it has made me realise that I am not alone. (I was also left on a train platform all night as my parents couldn't be bothered to wait for me).

But what I don't understand is, why? I would never treat my kids with the sly, bitchy digs my parents gave me. Sometimes I felt that I was in a parallel world. My father saying that I said this and that, when I know that I didn't. They would buy me things and then go on how wonderful they are and when I would question their behaviour they would say 'look at all the things we have bought you' as if I had no right to question their behaviour as they have spent money on me.

Sorry for sounding a bit disjointed but I am a bit disjointed at the moment. Second visit with the therapist at 12.

snowden sorry you have had to go through this. At least you have recognised now your not to blame. Ive not had much therpay but many on here have and I dont know any of those who haven't found it incredibly useful.
Glad you found the strength to post here.

Feeling incrdibly low this morning and I am trying to work out why? Couple of things triggered me. Mainly to do with reactions from people which I read into and build in my head as evidence I am disliked.
One mum in particular I feel very awkward around and I thought I would make an effort to go speak to her pushing myself out of my comfort zone but it felt very awkward and she excused herself. Then comes feelings of shame at even having tried.
I know it stems from something others have mentioned on here. Feeling responsible for others moods.
There was a couple of other silly things that happened too, I then feel overwhelmed coming home by feelings off loneliness.
I think perhaps underneath all of these feelings is the fact I am just a week away now from my birthday. Birthdays always make me feel very sad. An almost crushing sadness of being alone in the world, unloved and unlikeable. Exactly how I felt as a small child I am sure. Constantly angering and irritating my mother and never sure why except that it must have been my fault.
Perhaps because of that I am sensitive to any evidence in my present world of that being true.
Sorry to offload here but nowehere else to work through these feelings right now. This feels all very painful and raw today.

TRS, I'm sending you some good thoughts.

Can you go and swim laps or have a walk? It might shake you out of thinking so much.

For next week - Can you plan something simple and enjoyable for your birthday? I can't bear holding parties for myself or organising a group but I like visiting a zoo or a butterfly enclosure - just something simple and fun and kiddy-ish. If your mum is intruding into your thoughts its important that you be good to yourself. Treat yourself kindly.

Thankyou rel Your words have helped. I also had a cry which helped too. I have to remind myslef that it is progress that Im even able to identify, acknowledge, recognise these shifts in mood. I have lived for the most part like a talking head .
The step I forget about which doesnt even occur to me is after acknowledging the pain to be kind or nurturing to myself in response.
Its funny how like thisis said in a recent post how just a cuple of words or looks can send you reeling. An eclispe between the present and past. No, more of a rude intrusion of the past on the present.

trs I'm sorry you're having a bad time. Birthdays are minefields aren't they, any kind of anniversary really.

This is where I have found the inner child therapy to have been the most useful. I realise that it is my inner child, bluebell, who is feeling these things, in the way a child does. "it's not fair" Nobody likes me" etc. The feelings are as raw as they ever were.

I can comfort bluebell, by talking out loud to her. It sounds ridiculous, but it really works. To be as soothing to bluebell as I would any other distressed child. Just because she lives within me doesn't really make any difference.

I am struggling with terrible nightmares. I realise that having extracated myself from their system and removed them from my life, I am left almost in a state of shock, of trauma. I am coming to terms with just how terrible it was for me, and just how bizzarre their world is. Yes the gaslighting, once it has stopped, and you can see it for what it really is, is THE most extraordinary thing ever. I just can't get my head aroud just how barking mad they really are.

Hello Snowden

Your comments about living in a parallel world strike a huge chord. I hope you find posting and reading here as useful as I have done.

Thanks for all your replies. I have read most of the thread now. I think I will be taking a lot more than I am giving for a while though. You all seem so insightful and I know I am totally disconnected from my feelings.

Grace you say you are counselling yourself. How do you even begin to do this. I was especially inspired where you say your panic attacks have stopped. I have had horrific panic attacks for years, last year I had a nervous breakdown and while it was directly caused by my horrible (possibly NPD) ex I think there was an awful lost under the surface from my childhood waiting to come out. My parents were supportive during this time but my Mum sometimes tells me that they were so worried about me that they expected a knock on the door any minute to tell them I had done something stupid. Why would she say this to me? I feel panicky just typing that. I said to her a couple of times "please don't say that to me as it takes me back to that time" but she still does. Like she gets something out of it herself, I sense sometimes that she was almost enjoying the drama, although I know she was genuinely concerned also.

snowden I was actually too scared to ring my parents to come back and pick me up and take me back to theirs when the train was delayed because I knew what the reaction would be. They just left me at the station, didn't even see me onto the train so didn't know it had been delayed. I was stood on a freezing, deserted platfrom for over two hours. It was not a one off either.

mashitup My Mum has been behaving but I can feel it slippping now. She knows I won't put up with it for dc but I think she is subconciously pushing boundaries to see if she can get things back to how she feels comfortable, ie being able to say the mean, critical things she wants to, dish out the "tellings off" and live out her big old dramas at my expense. Never happier than when she is causing a big kerfuffle and her right in the centre of it. Unfortunately after me and dsis took ourselves out of the picture she started on other family members and is now pretty much estranged from all of them. Always she has to have an "enemy" iyswim? Always looking for the negatives in every situation and relationship and really seeming to enjoy it. Currently it is her friends mother who is being mean, nasty and critical of my poor dear old well meaning Mum. I listen to her going on and just think "don't you know that I see through you and what you are doing?".

When I told her I was pregnant with dd she said "And is this good news?" in a really concerned and knowing tone (do you get what I mean by that?) considering that a few weeks previously I had been telling her how worried I was that we been ttc for a year and nothing was happening, yes it was exceptionally fantastic news! She said "well I never like to show happiness about pregnancies because you never know if it is good news or not".

Gah, I am just ranting now, there is so much to write about and think about. Too much I think, which is why I am so disconnected from my emotions.

Hi, still going through a tough time, thread moving quickly, am on mob at mo! Had horrible wend and on it goes! Fell out with kids as i asked 4 2 things peace and tidyness 4 bday they couldnt give me either just earfulls of anger at me! Mother lied 2 me, used my predicament 2 raise herself at my expense 2 others, i despair at moment!

Hello :) I'm not posting so much just now, as some of my stuff is floating near the surface requesting attention! I've just been sitting in the last patch of sun on my back garden, watching my flowers in the breeze & reading my compassion book :) I came to a passage that seems to summarise what it's about - it's a very long book! - so I'm typing it out here. With errors, no doubt ...

Our "old brains" can throw up some very odd or unpleasant feelings, fantasies and thoughts. People with obsessional disorders can become very frightened of those experiences. On the other hand, writers of horror novels are only too delighted to have these fantasies so that they can sell books based on them.

It is common for us to have negative thoughts about our emotions. We might think that certain ones,such as anger towards people we love or wanting to run away from our families, indicate that there's something wrong with us or that we're bad in some way. We may think to ourselves "I shouldn't have felt that" or "I shouldn't desire that", and then we try to block out those emotions or desires. Of course, they're emanating from our "old brain/mind" and simply telling ourselves to stop isn't going to work. We approach them compassionately, recognising that our brains provide us with a whole array of complex feelings, fantasies and desires that we never created and may not want.

The thoughts and feelings may be just odd things in the mind or they may be telling us to pay attention to things in new ways. When we feel angry with those we love, it could be because we're tired and in an irritable mood and therefore need to be more mindful of our feelings. However, it might also be because our anger is genuine and it might be helpful to address key issues with them. Therefore to help ourselves, we need to work <span class="italic">with</span> these feelings and understand them rather than simply trying to get rid of them.

Compassion work is a combination of CBT, mindfulness, meditation, neuropsychology and Buddhism. The book I'm wedded to is "The Compassionate Mind" by Paul Gilbert. It goes into detail about evolutionary psychology and the neurological reasons behind the compassionate approach - it suits me because I like to know "Why" and "How" but there are other, less challenging, books. Some include CDs for guided mindfulness meditations.

Shimmery, thank you for asking - I've already done nearly ten years of therapy, so have a fair clue as to what I need to do! For someone who's new to it, I think I'd recommend the following:
"Recovery of Your Inner Child" by Lucia Capacchione, a creative workbook for people from dysfunctional families
"Games People Play" and "What Do You Say After You Say Hello?", both by Eric Berne, an introduction to understanding human relationships & behaviours with Transactional Analysis
"Cognitive Behavioural Therapy For Dummies" so you get the hang of 'interrogating' your own thoughts & feelings
"The Mindful Path to Self-compassion" by Christopher K. Germer or one of the other mindfulness + compassion books, to help you live comfortably in the present :)

Hope this helps! x

Hi, snowden. I hope today's session went okay. It can be very disconcerting, especially at the beginning, can't it? I find the "real work" of healing much less upsetting than discovering the vortex of weirdness I've been living in. Every now and again, I find yet another aspect of it and it throws me. I think it's quite natural that so many posters on these threads - and the NPD ones - relate passionately to films like the Matrix! Please remember to treat yourself kindly :)

smithfield, you do such a wonderful job of being in touch with your feelings and understanding your reactions. I feel sad for you, that you aren't yet able to face the memories that provoke them. Am I right in thinking that you are on a waiting list with your CMH? I very much hope you land the right therapist for you. After agonising for so long about my dearth of memories, I'm okay now with the few I have - they are enough to work with, undertsanding and changing myself. Finding the first few was painful, though; as you know, I had support. Did you ever look at Capacchione's recovery workbook? It is intended to raise memories, but in a gentler way than "Homecoming".

I hope you're feeling better since your earlier post. I'm sending you nice, warm, safe thoughts :)

Shimmery, my mum enjoys dramatising my problems, too! Mind you, she's just driven over with a package of really NICE groceries - and buggered off again straight away [grins]

Grace? Name change? Liked compassion extract, sometimes ur posts r like ur mind reading? Sitting sounded nice! Am posting 2 say, i have some beautiful things in my life and some ugly things and right now i am feeling fear due 2 circumstances! I want 2 control things like gossip about me that is damaging me 2 make others look good, i cant! I acknowledge the pain, vounerability, anger and resentment! I need 2 accept people r fake and b..tchy as was i at times! Pandora put back that lid!

Aww, bless, mh :)

Okay, does this gossip have the power to do you real, practical harm? If not - then, yes, it's uncomfortable but you are wise enough to know it's nothing more than a symptom of other people's inner misery (and feel a bit of pity for them). Not saying it doesn't hurt you: it does. It's mean and pathetic of them. Do you want to post more about it?

Glad you're appreciating the beauty in your life as well as the heartache. x

Hi - I hope u don't mind me posting on here - technically I don't have toxic parents, but I do have toxic in-laws, who DH & I haven't spoken to for a few years now. Without going into details now, we had no choice but to cut them off, as they were beginning to inflict their horrible attitudes and rants on our children.

Anyway, DH & I are now facing a problem which I'm imagining lots of you must have had to face - there is a wedding coming up with a member of DH's family which we are invited to. His 'toxic' relatives are going to the wedding. The person getting married has 'kept out of it', and wants us all at the wedding (although after a few drinks with DH he freely admits he hates DH's parents too).

So how do you get through these kinds of occasions without going crazy/having a huge argument and ruining the big day/or something equally horrible. TBH I would rather just not go but it's not my call, it's DH's really, and he doesn't know what to do. We don't want to end up losing touch with the relative who's wedding it is, and I can see this happening if we don't even go to his wedding....

Sorry for the long post - BTW - there is alot of very bad feeling on all sides; it's not as simple as us all just burying the hatchet for the day, as some friends of ours suggest we should do (easy for them to say, although I know it's all well-meant).

Hi moo, if u could choose not dh, what would u do about innocent partys wedding invite?
Thanks grace, yes making me look not ok and 2 be pitied and bad, it is mother! I am touchy anyway as ex his wife, sister and cousins wife told lies 2 aquantances and family, and family court! Also i was so traumatised i told people who were loosed tounged and revelled in my pain and the drama to raise themselves at my expense! I want 2 run away, kids dont!

You've been so badly treated, mh I remember your first posts, I think. You've come an incredibly long way in a short time ... it's no wonder they don't want to leave you be, they'll have to start straining a new 'victim' (or face their own demons, and that's never going to happen!) Give yourself due credit for what you've done, sweetheart, you're AMAZING! I'm sure it doesn't feel like a 'short time' to your DCs - a year is an age in child terms, isn't it? But it's very short in comparison to the decades of abuse you've suffered. You've broken free, that's brilliant. And also quite disruptive. Are still getting help? I can't remember if you're still in therapy: if not, perhaps you can get yourself back in the loop. You need & deserve as much help as you can get.

I may be getting this wrong, but I sometimes feel you're giving others a little too much permission to be mean to you. Letting other people be OK doesn't have to mean making them OK (unless you want to!) It means allowing them to be OK in their own weirdy way, but you don't have to agree with them! The most important thing for each of us is feeling OK about ourselves - for Stately Homers, that's a big enough job in itself Please don't sacrifice your own well-being - not even your personal OK-ness - for anyone else's. Except your DCs sometimes. For all the people who need to put someone down to feel OK, their transactions are crossed. There's fuck all you can do about that for them, so step out of the game. I know you do keep that in mind, and it can be exhausting sometimes, but don't feel like you have to be "perfect" or even that you must help other people.
Promise?

MMF, thanks for posting. How big is the wedding? I imagine that, if it's middle-sized to large, your friends will be able to seat you well away from the others and you should be able to get away with a quick handshake and no further contact. Roseability braved a family wedding a few months ago, so perhaps she'll be able to share her tips :)

Hi Mummie - I wouldn't go! The thought of walking into a room with people who have treated DH (and me, more recently) so badly, and other people who have backed them up and refused to acknowledge things that have happened, brings me out in a cold sweat TBH.

But it's DH's family and if he decides he should go, I want to be there to support him, because he will obviously find it very hard too.

I just really struggle with this fact - we are the only members of DH's family who have taken a stand against his parents and said we won't accept their behaviour any more. Therefore we are the ones who are now the outsiders. Other relatives and friends know what they are like, and tell us they can absolutely see our point and don't blame us at all - but they say it very quietly, IYKWIM.

Do we just accept that if we make a decision not to put up with his parents anymore, then we will also have to exclude ourselves from any family occasions or risk causing upset to other people? It just doesn't seem fair to me - why don't they get excluded from things when they are the ones who have been total b*stards????

Sorry about the rant

ItsGhoulAgain - sorry I overlapped with your post - thanks for your reply. I will try to find Roseability's older posts about it....

shimmery As you asked for advice about your mother - in your situation, I would tell her bluntly that you don't want her to say (a), (b) and (c) and that if she continues to do so, then you won't see her. I had to do that with my mother.

She doesn't make comments now, or digs about my weight, which she used to do all the time, even when I didn't have a weight problem (guess what? I do now!) But then I don't give her much rope with which to hang herself. She comes to see my kids once a month, I make sure it doesn't get more regular than that even though she would happily come every week if not more. If it wasn't for my kids then I wouldn't see her, because personally I have no need or desire, she isn't a mother to me, I don't let her be a mother to me even though she would like to try to be. But she has a decent relationship with my kids, who she treats very well and who adore her, and I don't want to take that away from them unless it's in their best interest to. And at the moment, it's in their best interest to see her.

I don't tell her anything personal, have no desire to. She has let me down so much that I just have no emotional attachment to her any more. I can have a perfectly civil and pleasant conversation with her but that is it. She has tried to create more of a bond, but I can't do it. I don't give of myself to her. I feel physically incapable of doing that. I have a lot of big goings on right now, both personally and professionally, and she knows nothing about them.If she asks me a question then I will answer truthfully if evasively, but otherwise I don't offer her anything personal. I don't share cute anecdotes about my children with her even though (well, precisely because ) she would love this.

That is what works for me. The trick is to find what works for you, that balance between having someone in your life but on your terms. I have cut my father out because I couldn't achieve this balance with him.

snowden and TRS I relate to completely to what you both wrote.

moo I've had a similiar situation with my parents. I have empathy with you but no advice really. I guess you can only control your behaviour. You can make a promise to yourself that you will go and be civil if you come into contact with the inlaws, and refuse to get drawn into any conflict or discussion. But if you think they will push and push until you react, then you may what to think about staying away.

Grace, thanks 4 ur insight and reminders! Yes started therapy! Thats where i got how thinking from x triggers happening a lot re fear 4 future 4 work! Fear for future mobility! Old school friend triggers! Reminded me of teen script that if i met someone who loved me and wanted to marry me it would mean i was lovable, i thought i had that i never did! My selfworth rubbish! I remember when dad left mum worked lots which she had to for mortgage! She was rarely home, she organised mostly late during week and weekend early shifts, she spent the majority of the time after 2 months of seperation trying to get a man then persuing relationship with stepdad! We didnt matter! I was alone a lot as bro had local friends and job in pizza place, we were 13 and just 15, neither parent gave us time and the little we had was about them!

Three nice things happened yesterday, sent off some ironing excess had kids uniform in was eue back, they didnt answer phone! So dd and me went in eve 2 get missing blouse none in tesco, we asked lady she said that was all they had! she then later found one and found us at till, we were so grateful x then we saw first time in months our cat that had run away because of dog picked him up and brought home! Good things happen!