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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

statley homes thread - dysfunctional families

889 replies

Mummiehunnie · 11/08/2010 16:53

I had a look back and could not find the old thread, for adult children who grew up in unhealthy dysfunctional families, and were abused as a result!

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ItsGraceAgain · 26/09/2010 22:46

.. I was just asking myself: How dare I reply to relationship threads, when I'm so publicly battling a disordered world-view? My answer's pretty much what Anniegetyourgun wrote on the NPD thread. Surrounded by NPD/APD characters, all screaming for input, I did a great job. I have limited experience of ordinary relationships, but am a connoisseur of disordered ones. My life role is/was to be the 'sane representative' in a mad world.

There are loads of articles about how a dysfunctional family needs one member to stay outside the craziness, otherwise the entire group would implode. That person is often the scapegoat and is the one who will seek therapy. In my life, that's me. I'm a conduit between healthy and fucked-up; my parents made me this way. I think and feel as a non-disordered human being but the values I learned, and the life I grew up in, were disordered. I really sympathise with the tendency to identify with star signs! I'm pisces, and for a long time chose to explain my duality this way (never mind that 6 out of the 12 signs represent duality, heh). It is to do with an accident of birth, yes - but that accident was being the first-born, and a girl, to 2 PD parents. They designated me as the 'normal' one, who represents the family to the outside world - and provides a benchmark, by which the family may measure itself as better than normal.

I have to drop this now, it's making me feel utterly miserable. Munmmiehunnie, this is why I still need therapy!!!

Mummiehunnie · 27/09/2010 09:21

Grace, reading your 930pm post of sunday here, I am sorry that the gift thing was relevant to you also x

I have put on more and more and more weight, I am in a lot of pain with endometrosis at the moment, the nerves pain is killing me which I think may be due to weight gain? I can't bend down without feeling like a knife is being inserted into me!

Why the hell am I overeating, knowing that the weight is not helping that and the joint problems I have, it is that why can't I apply myself that you have by the sounds of it, where is that kick me self destruct release thing that I have going on, it is like I understand what and why I am doing stuff, overeating, yet somehow I can't release that crutch/coping mechanism as you seem if I am reading you write struggling with re smoking...

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Mummiehunnie · 27/09/2010 09:24

you ask grace why no one noticed, they were probably two wrapped up in their stuff!

I have had a chat where i do voluntary work, some people are very together after years of therapy, some are untreated rescuers, one rescuer said her sister was a mental health worker and stated that she felt that there were 95% of the population with mental health issues of one sort or another, most were functioning struggling with Anxiety, ocd, eating disorders, addictions etc... so why would you stick out Grace? What is normal?

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Mummiehunnie · 27/09/2010 09:27

I am sorry that in asking you to open up that it has made you feel so miseable Grace, I can hear your pain in your posts, which you have every right to state and feel!

I wonder if someone so together as you, is sitll needing therapy, how the hell I am going to get to where I want to be, not a perfect me (letting go of perfectionism) just a more comfortable, together me!

Do what you need to do Grace, how can you be kind to yourself today?

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ItsGraceAgain · 27/09/2010 10:38

Thank you for your very sweet messages, mh. I understand about the eating - I've just bought some cigarettes after 2 whole days of not smoking! Gah!! One thing at a time, though, hey? On some of the previous threads, it was often discussed how this recovery malarkey is not so much a straight line as a spiral. It keeps feeling like you've worked so hard, only to end up back where you started ... but, having learned a lot on the way round, you're not quite in the same place but higher up iyswim?

For myself, the fact that I'm aware of more problems actually means I've made progress. Before I started my recovery, I was sleepwalking around with loads of dysfunctional behaviours I hadn't even noticed! Other people noticed them, though - eespecially Narcs and other bullies ...

I am so very sorry to hear about your pain. Surely the pain on bending is due to your endometriosis? Horrible for you. Are you getting effective treatment for it? A boss of mine had surgery for endometriosis once - she was very incapacitated after the operation but, once she'd recovered, the problem was fixed for good. I hope yours can be, too.

I wish you wouldn't worry about your comfort eating and your weight. Ime, this is similar to my smoking - in that, the more anxious you feel about it, the worse it gets! My eating disorders got better after I learned to love my body the way it is. Paradoxical, I know, and it didn't happen overnight Wink The book that started me off was Susie Orbach's "Fat is a Feminist Issue". Have you read it?

Mummiehunnie · 27/09/2010 11:17

when i spoke to gynae, they said due to where it was (as a result of c section), the nature of the condition, the fact I had two children, and my underlying condition and the fact an op started it off, it may spread if they open me up again and may cause me more problems where it is, they twice put me into mini menopause, great it all got smaller then grows again and gets sore again... I do wonder if I was smaller if it would get better?

It is interesting that you say you needed to love your body as it was, it is not the looks so much I don't love I don't love my body for letting me down and not functioning properly, I maybe need to explore that more and think on it, not read that book, the good thing about this thread is when you are ready to read the book titles are there, I am not at a point where I can read another psychological/self help type book...

The spiraling description is helpfull and makes sense...

I got a friend request on fb the other day from a friend of my bro's we have been messaging, it was interesting something he came out with (i did not mention my family to him) he had a memory of me and my bro always fighting!

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Mummiehunnie · 27/09/2010 11:20

I have heard people say that the pain of emotions can be held in the body, for example rhumatoid arthritis... I do wonder if the pain in my body and the physical manifestations are to do with repressed emotional pain... I do have a genetic condition, and I wonder if things would be as bad as they are if the emotional pain was dealt with...

also following from that thread about sex and marriage, would it be possible to have the body create endo as a means to avoid sex, a bit out there I know, I got it after two babies were born and ex had a vesectomy...

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Mummiehunnie · 27/09/2010 12:31

I have been thinking about resilience at the moment!

I also wonder how I am going to accept and like me physically and emotionally, when is how I am good enough?

That be perfect thing I had going on, has it really gone... urmmm questions...

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ItsGraceAgain · 27/09/2010 12:34

You need spiritmum for that advice! My reiki teacher believed ALL illnesses are spiritual in origin, but I found her theories harsh & irrational. I do think a lot of symptoms are psychogenic, though - that is, they're real enough but are triggered by psychological issues. I don't know whether endometriosis would be one of those ... it seems a cruel 'punishment' if so. Have you tried giving yourself regular massages over the pelvic area? Dunno if it would help any, but it could possibly relieve the cramps & clotting. It can't do any harm, at least!

I've just remembered about the muscle relaxants I had to relieve my PCOS symptoms (mefenamic acid). Are you getting enough help with that?

Mummiehunnie · 27/09/2010 12:50

No I am not getting enough help with pain relief, actually it is something I have never allowed myself relief from, some sort of sadistic self punishment, feel the physical pain thing going on...

I will now have to bring that up along with other things I have noted on other threads, including, self esteem thread!

How did the phone call to local authority, go?

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ItsGraceAgain · 27/09/2010 19:53

I'm not rushing into the mentoring! Got a few ishoos of my own to sort out first - mentors are supposed to be role models, not self-doubting sad gits Wink

I bought myself a present today! They had DAB radios for £25 in Aldi. Out here in Sticksville, I can only get Radio 2 and Sticksville FM on my old one. I love having music on all the time and now I can! As soon as I wake up! Hurrah! Grin

I never thought a radio could make me so happy!

ItsGraceAgain · 27/09/2010 19:59

I meant to tell you what happened over my smoke-free weekend. Well, it showed in my posts, I know ... I felt overwhelmed with anger & despair. It definitely does mask my feelings. Two days of that was enough for the time being but I'm going to do it more often, now I understand it. With plenty of cake and my copy of Homecoming.

Mummiehunnie · 27/09/2010 23:37

That all makes sense Grace, makes me wonder what i will feel if I don't eat as I did today, tomorrow! What are you angry at, your childhood, yourself, or something else?

I was thinking about perfection, and i think I have been driven by be perfect and if it is not don't bother or ruin it... I need to work on this a bit more for myself!!! I think there is still more that i need to work on to sort the wheat from the chaff on this issue for me!

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ItsGraceAgain · 28/09/2010 00:24

Childhood. The one adult in my early life, who loved me unconditionally, was my gran. She had her own issues, but I didn't find out about those until I was grown up. Her answer to every upset was a sweetie ... and she smoked.

One of the big lessons for Stately Homers (possibly, even, the most important!) is this, mummiehunnie: Good enough IS good enough. Forget perfect; if perfect happens, it's through sheer talent & pure good luck. In the normal, healthy world, good enough is GOOD! Work hard enough, get a good enough result. Make yourself a poster for it :) Make that poster good enough, then put it up in a good enough place ...

ItsGraceAgain · 28/09/2010 00:41

A little business with my mum has just worked its way through to conscious level. When she visited, she brought me a message from a supplier. My payment to them is overdue (I had no funds) and I hadn't updated my contact details, so they rang Mum's house. She carefully took the message (despite the fact that she's too deaf to take ordinary messages) and made a great show of being concerned, as she knows my business depends on this service. I told her I'd just paid them, having received an overdue payment myself. You know what? She made a sulky face. She was disappointed that her message hadn't brought me news of doom, after all.

thisishowifeel · 28/09/2010 08:47

Dear grace, you have had a rough couple of days. I think that perhaps you have stumbled across a method of "dipping your toe in" to the really grim stuff, and then hauling yourself ashore for a rest. This must be a good thing? It puts you in control of how much and how often.

I think that your spiral analogy is bang on.

I have been working on my songwriting with my new music software, which h is showing me how to use, a bit at a time. The thing that has stopped me the most is the weird idea that I'm not allowed. I have really been struggling with my very deep sense of not being allowed to express myself. So yesterday I took a deep breath, and did it anyway. I deleted it all, but the point was that each time I do it, the easier it becomes. Will be doing a bit more today. It's funny, the terror is physical, sick anxious tummy stuff.

I have RA and I am completely convinced that it is linked to all of this stuff. It has improved as my emotional well being has improved. I walked down the stairs normally this morning.

cremeeggs · 28/09/2010 12:42

Hi,

I dip in and out of this thread (haven't been on for a while as sometimes it's just too painful to rake up all those feelings...)

Have been going through an odd experience in counselling where I keep forgetting how i was emotionally abused by my Mum and sexually abused by my Dad. I know I was, but I will suddenly forget the details for a few days - it's as if my mind can't cope any more.

Does anyone else get this? I then start to doubt myself completely and feel horrendously guilty, as if I have made it all up...then other times a memory will come back and will overwhelm me and then I know I didn't imagine it all.

Also I am struggling to accept my counsellor's concern. She really seems to care and says lots of really nice things about me. I feel like walking out when she does that. It's almost unbearable to hear nice things sometimes. I know that sounds really weird - it's not just like a friend saying she likes my new haircut. i can cope with that. It's different somehow.

Sorry that all seems a bit rambly. Am just having an off-day. Probably because I am going to have to see my parents soon and it's making me anxious.

Mummiehunnie · 28/09/2010 12:45

why do you have to see your parents soon?

I kind of get some of what you are saying, the guilt thing for showing up your parents, and almost feel like it can't be true, I imagine that is a form of denial???

As for councellor's concern have you told her how uncomfortable it makes you feel and explored why that may be?

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cremeeggs · 28/09/2010 13:33

Mummie thanks for replying!

I have to see them soon (or rather my Mum and Stepdad - have no contact with Dad) because we still have a relationship of sorts and they visit every 2 months or so. I am not ready to confront my Mumabout the abuse, largely because I know she would completely deny it. I am sure she is a narcissist as much of her behaviour fits with NPD patterns. She would somehow manage to make it all my fault/in my imagination and I would be consumed by guilt. That's the pattern she has set up and even though I can see that now I haven't yet managed to avoid falling into it. So I'm not ready to walk away yet as I haven't worked out how to do so. Deep down I still want my DC to have grandparents, even if they are not very good grandparents, I guess.

I am scared of telling my counsellor how I will feel. I guess it's about vulnerability and being judged. Plus I have managed not to cry so far in our sessions and it's important to me that I don't.

Mummiehunnie · 28/09/2010 14:30

who organised the visit? why can't you postpone?

why are you not wanting to cry and explore that vulnerability right now?

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Mummiehunnie · 28/09/2010 14:36

Be perfect, a drive of mine....

aim for pefection... sometimes achieves it... sometimes does not and has no hope of so does not try... sometimes tries to achieve it and can't achieve it but does not give up try and deludes self that perfection can be achieved... sometimes achieves perfection and messes it up or wants another challenge as bored when perfection is achieved... that is a horrible realisation i have worked out about me!

I made soup, I have a disability that makes it hard to chop the veg in the way that I want them chopped for the soup, in small pieces that are easy to have on the soon, so that you have multiple veg, colors and shapes on the spoon, I have accepted that I can't do that anymore, so i chopped them like a special needs person as my mother would describe as I am that person, and I am going to either have them large and oddly cut or blitz them in the smoothie maker device, which is not what I want, that is however what I need, a homemade, beautufully fresh and good for me soup, to make me healthy!

I am sick and tired of throwing out good food, nearly a bin bag of good food, veg, fruit, yogharts etc... that myself and the children have bypassed to eat rubbish.... they are copying me, i am ruining things for them, I can't go on like this!

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cremeeggs · 28/09/2010 14:41

I agreed to the visit as would have to give a reason for postponing. It is easier to maintain the illusion of a relationship until I feel able to break away, I feel. That way the DC see their grandparents and all "seems" normal.

I can't cry normally - I think this comes from years of being laughed at whenever I cried. Everyone would make me feel like a baby for being "oversensitive".

Just to give you an example, when I was raped as a teenager my Mum asked me how I had managed to get myself into that sort of situation. I cried because all of a sudden she made me feel it was my own fault. Then she told me there was no point crying because it wouldn't change anything and it was very childish, that I was "always crying" (I wasn't) and she was tired of it. Then she told me to get on with my homework and not to get myself into those sorts of situations again. All said in a calm, polite voice. No shouting. So I have spent all these years thinking she was being "nice" because she didn't shout or anything but have since realised from this (and tons of similar examples) that the emotional neglect was recurrent and that I was not allowed to show any emotions or receive any support when I was hurt. Anything bad that happened to me was inevitably my fault.

So it is very hard to cry now because I have learnt to bury those emotions. I can feel the urge to cry coming back a bit in counselling and am afraid once I start I won't be able to stop and the emotions will be overwhelming.

Mummiehunnie · 28/09/2010 14:52

why do you have to give a reason for postponing, and change the subject before they get a chance to ask why?

hugs re crying problem and you feeling it will overwhelm you to feel the pain x x x

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ItsGraceAgain · 28/09/2010 15:04

I felt a lot like that, cremeggs. Telling your counsellor will be a great idea. She'll have other clients with similar fears of becoming overwhelmed, and be able to help you release stuff at a rate you find manageable. I wonder if her compliments irk you because you're more 'real' in counselling, whereas you put up social defences in the outside world? Again, if you can tell her, you might easily find the issue resolves itself with little prompting :)

mh, you need a chopper! My soup is lumpy and I don't care, but if you want pretty soup then I hope you'll get a device to facilitate that. Congrats on the lovely healthy treats!

Congrats on all of your progress, thisis, and thanks for your acute understanding :)

thisishowifeel · 28/09/2010 20:00

Thank you Grace.

Bump back down to earth today. A conversation in the playground, about a department store, of all things, the better branch, being in my home town. I don't live there, but it's do-able if you have all day.

Another Mum was extolling the virtues of this place, and said, "people always go back to where they know".

I said, "I dare not go there in case I meet a member of my family, or worse, my mother".

It has left me feeling desperately sad, alone, and angry that they are STILL limiting MY life. But I couldn't take the risk of ever setting eyes on any of them ever again.

Funny how the smallest thing brings it all flooding back. That and the phrase: "who asked you?" genuinely said in jest, and not even to me, left me sitting in the space between the bed and the wall, looking, begging, hoping, pleading, out of the window for freedom from this, four, five, six years old, rocking and crying.

But now KNOWING why, and what, and what to do about it. I sobbed, and told bluebell how much I loved her, and that she was safe.
H hugged me. He may be promoted to an "d" if this goes on.

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