What more can I say?

[backtothedrawingboard]

I've got a difficult relationship for all sorts of reasons and I've posted on here about some of them. I finally spoke to H two weeks ago and told him that I felt like our relationship was over. I told him that I felt so tired and couldn't take the responsibility of everything anymore. Worst of all, I told him that I wasn't sure that I wanted to carry on and that I thought it might be best if we separated. I tried to convince him that he would have a better relationship with the kids if he lived apart from them.

I hate upsetting people and it was really difficult watching him fall apart but I got through what I needed to say to him. He said that leaving me and the kids was not an option for him, we have no choice but to make it work, didn't I remember my marriage vows etc, etc.

He is now going through a denial. He is trying harder to do more at home and cook dinners etc (he works part time and picks up DS from school - I often don't get home from work until gone 6pm). But he has completely missed the point that our relationship is broken to a point of no return.

He definitely heard what I said but he does not want to discuss anything, says things like "are you still cross with me" and I don't really know what to do next.

It took me such courage to say the things I said and now I am going to have to say them all again.

How can I keep having to hurt him?

Sorry I don't know your back story, so have no idea what led to this.

But sounds like either you are not being very clear, or he is not hearing you. I think counseling is very good at getting both parties to really hear what the other is saying.

Even if you think there's no way back to your marriage, perhaps some couples therapy will help your H understand the reasons why you have reached this point. You have children, so you do need to go through this journey together.

I have to say I feel a little sorry for him. Maybe there are very good reasons why I shouldn't, but he is throwing himself into fixing things isn't he?

I know - I think he is trying really hard but I really don't trust that things will be any different in the long run.

I feel sorry for him as well but I can't make myself feel any differently. I just want him to listen.

Do you no longer love him or do you just need time to stand back, reassess & rebuild things? If it's over then it's over but (not knowing background) it doesn't sound like he feels the same.

I think the problem is that I'm waiting for him to agree with me because I want to be able to agree what happens with our DCs, where we will live, how we will manage the finances etc.

Without him agreeing, I can't see how I can minimise the impact on the DCs and make these arrangements.

I have really tried and I can't bear the thought of a future with him still around.

I really don't know how to deal with this.

Is he abusive? Or is it just that you don't love him any more?

If it's the former (I suspect he might be as I saw your thread on him 'smacking' your DC) he is probably trying to use his old tactics to take control and hoping that you will fall into line and things can go on like normal. He is also probably preying on the fact that you don't like upsetting him by acting like you didn't say what you did.

If I've got it wrong and he isn't abusive then can you try suggesting some sort of counselling so you can talk openly and clearly to get your point across?

I am in a similar situation so I understand your frustration. I have spoken to 'D'P about my unhappiness and how I thought we would be better off living separately. He has responded in a similar way to yours and is now cooking dinner, washing up, doing bathtime, bedtime - all things he would never have dreamt of doing before without me nagging him to death - but most disconcerting is the fact that he is being really nice to me.

If he'd done this about three years ago I might have fallen for it it might have made a difference. But I can see it for the temporary charm offensive that it is and that he is not making any attempt to change fundamentally or accepting any responsibility for his previous actions.

So next I am planning to tell him in no uncertain terms that I want us to split up. Like you, I would rather he had just listened and agreed with me. But if I wait for that I will be waiting forever.

I am terrified about doing this as I also find this sort of confrontation very difficult but I know it is the right answer in my situation. Could you consider talking to him again but just telling him what you want rather than asking him for agreement?

I think I need to just get over the hurdle of telling him "that's it".

I understand the "he is being really nice to me" comment. At the moment, my H cannot walk past me without trying to kiss me or make a nice comment. Keeps asking me if I'm OK. I know this sounds really ungrateful but I don't think it is geniune at all.

If he has been awful in the past then this temporary bout of niceness is not going to last. I don't know your back story either but remember that everyone has the right to leave an unsatisfactory partner and it doesn't make you a bad person to do so.

One of the issues I have is his laziness. It affects so much of our lives - because I hate having to do so much when he does not, because I hate the kids having a role model who sits around rather than get chores done even though he has the time. Even though I told him 3 weeks ago that our relationship was broken; he still spent one afternoon this week lying on the bed watching television whilst I picked up DS from school on my way home from work, went to the shops, sorted all the shopping out when I got home and cooked the dinner whilst supposedly "working from home" as I'd left work earlier than I normally finish.

And yet, he still wants a kiss at the end of the day.

Hi,

I dont know your history, but i am in the exact same boat...i also told my husband 2 weeks ago and he is carrying on like were going to be fine and it was a silly arguement, but i know he heard what i said because he cried etc

i have to do it again and am dreading it, it took like you say so much courage to admit how i was feeling that i have to do it again.

i cant offer any adice but wanted you to know you are not alone!!!!!!

hope it goes ok

Have you name-changed for this? If so, it would be helpful to have some back-story, really.

"At the moment, my H cannot walk past me without trying to kiss me or make a nice comment. Keeps asking me if I'm OK. I know this sounds really ungrateful but I don't think it is geniune at all."

I don't think it's ungrateful and I don't think it's genuine behaviour either - can you even begin to imagine acting like this when your partner has told you that they think your relationship is over and they think you should separate? If you look at it from that point of view seems a bit bizarre doesn't it?!

Can't believe these men, really.

I'm trying to pluck up the courage to have the conversation again properly this weekend. Will let you know if I manage it!

"Look at www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/942473-I-need-to-talk-to-him-but-I-39-m"

I do wonder if his lack of listening to me is his defence mechanism. My problem is, I don't know how to get through to him. I want him to accept what I have said and then work with me to decide what to tell the DCs. They are my biggest concern.

I think you may have to be prepared that he won't accept what you have said. He's probably quite happy with his cushy number - part time job, daytime tv watching, you running around doing everything.

You might have to take control and tell him it's over. You can only hope that he will decide to work with you when he knows it's serious. If he doesn't then you need to be prepared to talk to the DCs on your own.

Okay, let me start by saying that I do, I do know how hard it was for you to say what you did to your H. BTDT, with a stubborn man who refused to accept I was "really leaving" until six months after I moved out.

However, I agree with Malinkey - to move forward, you need to take control and tell him it's over. You've told him you're "not sure you can carry on", that you "think he would have a better relationship with the kids" if he didn't live with you. He's told you "leaving is not an option for me", and AFAIK you didn't challenge this? I can see how, from this, he has taken out the message "I need to do better" rather than "this is over".

This doesn't mean you failed. It's just that you have to deliver an incredibly hard message that he doesn't want to hear. It's going to take more than one time to get him to hear what you're saying.

I think you're being equivocal because you're nice and gentle and kind, and don't want to hurt him. I think you're hoping he will realise you're right, and share your feeling that it's over, and thus you will be able to part with minimal trauma. This is a totally understandable thing to want. However I don't think it's going to happen.

You may have to take more firm steps to make him hear you - including telling friends and family that it is over, and taking active steps to begin the separation.

Sending you good thoughts and wishing you luck.

Solid gold brass writes - "everyone has the right to leave an unsatisfactory partner and it doesn't make you a bad person to do so."

Nice. Comforting even. Your values are refreshingly shallow.

UA: Are you really trying to say that people should not leave partners who are unkind, parasitic, selfish or unsatisfactory in any other way? And that leaving a bad partner/bad relationship makes someone a bad person? What on earth is to be gained by remaining with a partner who mistreats you?

Others have touched on this, but may I just point out your Hs are being really horrible to you? You've delivered the momentous news that you can't face being married to them any longer - and they're doing the equivalent of "Oh dear what a shame never mind, what's for dinner"!

You say they are hearing you but they're not really caring, are they? These forums are chock-a-block with people tearing themselves up because their partners have said they don't them anymore. Yours aren't tearing themselves up, they've just looked for the minimum they need to do to keep you in the house. And being extra-affectionate with a partner who's trying to end the relationship is just creepy, not to mention insensitive: overriding your feelings entirely.

They're doing the age-old trick of treating the marriage as if it were a purchase you want to return. You say "You don't do the shopping"; they start doing the shopping - and that, supposedly, invalidates your complaint. Whereas your real complaint isn't anything to do with the supermarket; your real complaint is "You've ignored me / discounted my feelings / taken the piss for so long that I've stopped loving you."

Instead of trying to itemise your gripes, I recommend the following: "I'm sorry, I don't love you any more. Here is a divorce petition, please sign it."

Grace - I think it is creepy. If I really loved my H and thought everything was ok in our relationship and he told me he was desperately unhappy because of the way I acted and wanted to separate I can't imagine behaving as though nothing had happened. It's actually quite controlling isn't it?

In some ways it reconfirms what I've been feeling in my relationship for some time anyway in that my feelings are just discounted because after all it's all about him.

I am going to have this conversation this weekend.

I too am going through something similar. i have no advice because DH thinks it will all be sorted. i feel like i am feeding him a line because we have a holiday planned, and for the sake of the kds i want to hold it together till then. After that (unless some miracle happens and cupids shoots me his arrow) i will sit down and say its over. He is not a bad person we have really just grown apart and want different things. i am desperate to move closer to my family he thinks im selfish.Yet we have lived by his family for 15 years.

My biggest fear is the children, do i move them to be near my family and unsettle them or am i strong enough to let them choose (knowing DS will want to stay here)

You are not alone !

God yeah. One of the things I told XH in the catalogue of complaints was that he kept ducking and diving when I tried to kiss him, either shrugging me off impatiently or making a joke of it, and I realised I hadn't been kissed for years. So for the next two weeks whenever I stayed still long enough he'd come over for a big wet smooch. It was horrible. Oozed insincerity from every pore. The fact that I no longer fancied him in any way, shape or form didn't help!

He would never accept I was leaving either; although he went through phases of appearing to agree, sometimes telling me how horrible I was and how glad he would be to see the back of me, other times how he thought this was best for everyone and we would still remain friends (note, not he hoped we would).

The answer? I just got on with the divorce. (Sounds easy, but getting on with it under the same roof with his constant mind games and a hefty bout of depression was a little, shall we say, challenging.) In the end he didn't have to agree for it to happen. And as he genuinely does love the DCs, and is also shit scared of confrontation (though physically unafraid of anything he's the biggest emotional coward under the sun), we worked it out fairly reasonably in the end.

after this thread i had the conversation again with my H.....and again he said he knew how i felt but then started talking about how we can work it, i kept telling him its to late, we were meant to work at it last november but nothing changed.....

he has no where to go and doesnt want to move out till our house has gone, its going in about 6 weeks time. but he hasnt thought about what he is going to do then, im trying to say to him he needs to sort out where he is going to stay cos eventually we will sort out him having dd and he will need somewehere for her to stay but he just didnt get it!!!!!!!

he knows im serious but i dont hate him and am worried he hasnt got anywhere to go, on the other hand and i said this to him last time, if the tables were turned and he was telling me he no longer loved me id be doing everything possible to fight for our marriage, he isnt and i think deep down that tells me something!!!!

sorry for the rant but i have had the worse night and needed to offload!!!

Ok, I'm trying very hard to look at this from your husband's point of view.
You say, "I finally spoke to H two weeks ago and told him that I felt like our relationship was over."

At which point, he started "trying harder to do more at home and cook dinners etc (he works part time and picks up DS from school - I often don't get home from work until gone 6pm)."

Now, without any further back story, this reads as I was very unhappy about some aspects of my relationship, so I finally told my partner, and now he's changed his behaviour and keeps enquiring gently how I feel about 'us'. Boo hoo hoo - what a bastard!

To be fair to him, you told him you weren't sure you wanted to carry on and thought it might be best if you separated. This sounds like you are threatening to leave unless the situation changes radically. And so it does: he makes more effort to be of use, and is concerned how you feel. What did you hope he would do, for heaven's sake? I think you are not actually being fair on him.
Either you have expressed your message about splitting rather equivocally in the end ( might be best), after having given him at least one properly expressed ultimatum in the past, or you have given him no serious indication at all that you felt this strongly about your work/life balance that you were considering dumping him, and so he is now shocked and confused when he tries his best to change and you reject his efforts as not meant in all seriousness.

Playing devil's advocate (after all, this is mumsnet ), I'd say you owe the poor bloke at least one chance at mending his ways for good, clearly labelled as such.

he hurt you if he had an affair didn't he? Why do you therefore feel the need to protect him?
However, it was a long time ago but if you are not happy NOW what's the point?

AwesomeWellies - unless I'm mistaken I think BTTDB tried to tell her H that their relationship was over but didn't want to hurt him so tried to do it in as nice a way as possible. Only he heard - or pretended to hear - that she wanted to him to try harder.

I think it's bizarre that if someone's partner tells them that it would be best if they separate that they don't acknowledge this at all.

Backtothedrawingboard - I read your previous thread - what happened about your diagnosis? Do you have lupus? How did that your H react to the situation - was he supportive?

Posh - who had an affair?