Archers thread #170: The scriptwriters have cast a Paul on proceedings! Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like to hear more of Drunk Alistair, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/radioaddicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radioaddicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @OverArmour for the title. I was tempted to try some sort of complex riff on chocolate names, given @PedantScorner's lightbulb moment - Paul's sister is Cara Mack! - and all the nonsense in last night's episode about coffee creams, but I couldn't be bothered, beyond thinking we must all be Cadbury's Fruit and Nutcases for listening at the moment. Let's hope the SWs take a walk along Quality Street or we'll have to put a Bounty on their heads!

And over to you ...

I’ve still got to catch up on yesterday so have skipped the end of the thread, but we used to have a Renault 4. Both the gearstick and the handbrake were in the dash so there was absolute northing between the passenger and driver seats (maybe a small gap).

It was built like a bean can though - I can’t imagine Alice, even if ever the owner of such a whimsical classic, would allow Martha to travel in it on a daily basis.

True. If he finally sees the light and confesses, the police must be looking at adding in a charge of wasting police time, and it adds to the weight of the conspiracy to pervert the course of justice charge that he's already potentially up for.

George's inner incel is still there, isn't it? It's noticeable that, whenever he thinks he's in danger of being found out, it's suddenly become all Emma's fault. It could never be his fault for putting himself and her in this position in the first place.

I’m not sure if that is the incel or the natural response of a child to their mother. He’s very immature

I dropped off the archers threads as I had a break from it but I've caught up now. I do understand Emma and Will being reluctant to shop George but once it gets out that they knew Emma will be destroyed in the community. The only excuse they have is it they use the time to persuade him to turn himself in but it's a bit late for that now as they drove him to the police station to give a pack of lies 🤦🏼‍♀️

I think her only option now to save herself is to shop George and say she tried to talk him out of his plan to lie and persuade him to be honest.

But that will likely destroy her relationship with George, and probably Will and Eddie.

Won't the police assume this cock and bull story was cooked up in collusion with Alice? And question Alice about it?

The only point of it is either to dob Harry in it and/or to get Alice off the hook.

The Grundys have no interest in the former and have a passing interest in the latter, for Chris and Martha's sake.

Alice has a huge interest in the latter and so far as the police know may well have a grudge against Harry.

Well two things that have boggled my mind

1. that Susan didn’t tell Alice about Chris confronting Harry. So unbelievable I lost my suspension of disbelief
2. that the police are really that bothered by the whole thing

1. Why would Susan tell Alice that?

1. The police have to prove their case now, so of course they will be bothered. And George's story must have set hares running.

Because Susan is a motor mouth and Emma is her daughter - I honestly think she would have been on the phone to Emma as soon as Chris was out of earshot

my experience of the police has not been so positive unfortunately!!

edited to say I realise I wrote Alice instead of Emma in my original post

It's quite a light plant and easy to rip up. Can't say I've ever noticed it in significant quantities. Herb Mercury now, we're knee deep in that

Interesting point, @IHaveNeverLivedintheCastle - I wonder if that’s where the SWs are going with this?

I find it quite easy to imagine Susan wouldn’t have mentioned Chris’s confrontation with Harry to Emma. Firstly, Susan’s impulse to gossip is centred mainly on the Other, i.e. non-family. Secondly, Susan will be aware that Emma hates Alice even more than she does herself, and might well not have wanted to listen to the tirade that would ensue about Chris still being on Alice’s side after everything she’s put him through, yadda yadda; I’ve withheld info from family myself for similar reasons. And thirdly, her precious Crystiffur had just made a prize prat of himself.

As for the police needing to prove their case now, I doubt the files had even been looked at after submission to the CPS. If they heard the silly cow was pleading not guilty, they’ll have grinned and thought ‘Good luck with that, luv. You’ll find prison a bit of an eye-opener’. Proved by bloods to be four times over the limit, alone in the car, passed out and in the driving seat. And were this not TA, they’d be right.

I don’t think that’s Susan’s character at all

If Emma wants that scrout George to confess to the police all she has to say isthat if he doesn't she will go to them herself.

She can offer to accompany him.

I cannot believe Will is supporting George in all his ridiculousness - at least Emma had some sense but unless she shops her own son now she is going to be in almighty trouble - strangely I see her in more trouble than Will but I guess she did find out first - not sure Ed it Christufer are going to be that pleased that she withheld info from them either

So we’re looking at Keira potentially being in the position Emma was as a child? Because of a misguided effort to save Martha from the same fate??

SWs are having a ball with this …

I thought that. At least twice over the past few days he has turned very threatening towards her. And noticeably only towards her, not Will who was also present the second time.

Will was right when he said that George had played them. She didn't need to sit around and back him up to Kate though, she was already on her way out of the door by then, she could have just left them to it.

Will has consistently appeased and taken his side though

@BeaLola I cannot believe Will is supporting George in all his ridiculousness

The problem (well, one of the problems) with Will is that he is really quite exceptionally stupid and slow-witted, even by the very high Grundy standards, and this is being emphasised by him talking more and more slowly. He has also acquired a very curious accent (not shared by Ed) so that he seems to be turning into Joe. Joe, but without the low cunning.

I think Will has changed personality quite a lot over the years -from embittered brother who lost his wife to his brother to now being in business with them both - he has lost all of Clarrues backbone and honesty , I get that it's his son who could go to prison but if they had marched him straight to police station and explained everything he may have got suspended sentence only ?

Yeah I don’t like what they’ve done to Will

This isn’t in-keeping with new “post suicide attempt Will” who seemed to be more balanced and logical.

They have made it all far worse. The best thing to do is to go back into the police station immediately, confess and hope for the best.

It wasn’t even a good lie.

George is awful and Will is also being awful,

Will has always been awful, I never bought the "Nic the Redeemer" aspect.

When George moved in with him he did try, and he has worked with Ed and Emma for the new business - who would have foreseen that ten years ago?

BUT the way he’s behaving now is just stupid.

Surely they must realise they are now committing a crime too?