Archers thread #166: Choppy waters in Ambridge! Look out for the red flags and discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd love to be married to Harrison, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Another thread started in great haste, mid-packing! Over to you.

Last night’s script really needed a good edit. The scene in the van with Jason and Freddie could have been covered in half the time. Orders being skimmed is a good SL though- I am sure it has always happened but is more common than ever at the moment.

Scenes involving both Lilian and the Pirate should be avoided at all costs.

I do like an Archer (of the original pub owning branch) having a stake in The Bull, though. I wonder if Lilian will pass her share on to James, or sell it to another branch of the family.

(Other than being employed there and being married to the licensee I’m not completely clear on whether Kenton has acquired any independent stake in the place.)

Lilian's very well acted, but OMG that voice! Jolene and Ken'un just make me want to send for Markie, or whatever his name was, and his band of merry thugs.

I don't mind her voice in general, it has the advantage of being distinctive (it sometimes takes me a while to work out who is talking amongst some of the younger crew: Kirsty & Fallon; Lily & Alice; Freddie, Ben & Josh ... maybe I'm just cloth-eared), but the unique way she pronounces Jolene without the first vowel winds me up.

I love the fact your list indicates the casting people are spot on with voicing Ambridge class stratifications, @Fink!

I've definitely never confused George & Tom or Chelsea & Kate, that's for sure!

I confuse Chelsea and Tracey which makes some sense

I have never confused Tracy and Chelsea, but I have confused Chelsea and Mia. There was a scene between the two of them (at LL when both were doing temp work there, possibly in the build up to the Hunt Ball) when I couldn't tell which was which. It was doing my head in! I tend not to watch TV because I have aphantasia so I can't really tell faces apart very well. Radio should be my haven because SWs generally try to make it easier by either giving the characters distinctive accents or making them use each others' names frequently. But not frequently enough for me!

Harrison and Tracey were talking the other night and it took me ages to realise it wasn’t Chelsea!

The only ones out of those that sound a bit similar are Ben and Josh - they are brothers, after all.
I find Lily and Kate's voices sound more alike than Lily and Alice.
Fallon sounds mummerset but Kirsty sounds like she's from near Liverpool.
Freddie's voice seems quite distinctive.

When George was watching the car teetering before going into the Am and said "oh, no,no,no,no, oh God" he sounded exactly like Ed. Just that shade into whingy self-pity.

I find it very odd that Ed and Will have completely different accents. They sound as if they grew up in different parts of the country.

Changing accents confuse me as well. My old neighbour left Glasgow when he was 14 and moved to Norfolk then London. Over 40+ years later he still has an extremely strong Scottish accent while a colleague of mine moved here (London) from Edinburgh as a twenty something adult and sounds as if he’s from SE England. I think he must make a conscious effort to do that though as his real accent comes out when he’s had a bit to drink.

I don't usually confuse Kate with anyone else, I seem to be able to recognise her voice. It is mainly the younger ones or newer/less frequently heard characters that I get mixed up on. I sometimes confuse Hannah and Stella because I just haven't got used to them. I always confuse Toby and Rex. Very occasionally Oliver and Jim, but I can untangle them within a sentence or two.

I also tend not to pick up on voice tics as much as other listeners. I never heard anything odd in Harry's delivery (may he never return!), or Pip's, but I know a lot of people on here find them very annoying.

Much as I don't like the Alistair and Denise storyline, the vets' surgery is probably the one safe place where I can confidently and easily tell everyone apart. And the dairy/Bridge Farm.

I confused Stella and Kirsty

It's not necessarily conscious. Accent changes with social setting are complicated. Sometimes people want to blend in with their surroundings (and may even find themselves, to their embarrassment, unintentionally imitating the accent of the person they're speaking to), other times they want to emphasise their roots and their difference from the people around them. e.g. a Yorkshire friend at work in London wants to get ahead and be part of the culture of the big city law firm, so his accent is quite muted; but in the pub he wants to be seen as a down to earth Yorkshire lad and not one of these southern softies, so his Leeds accent comes out. It's not that one of them is his 'real' voice and another is 'fake', it's just a form of code switching for different environments.

And a lot of people grew up with more than one dialect and they blend together in different ways.

My parents have different accents and mine is different to theirs. We moved around a lot as a kid and I have always had the same accent but my sister has a chameleon accent

We're similar @Bruisername, except we didn't move around that much until we were young adults/late teens. My parents have different accents from each other and my siblings and I have a different accent from both parents. The siblings' accents are within the same range as each other, but not identical. One is noticeably more RP and another more strongly local. Mine is more influenced by our mother's than the others' are (maybe because I'm the eldest and I had my early years alone with her before the others came along).

Can’t keep up with the speed of the thread so have been contenting myself with hitting the ‘thanks’ button, but have been spurred into action by the sight of two tree surgeons in my mum’s garden donning all their protective and climbing equipment, revving up their chainsaws and preparing to cut the dead wood from a huge oak tree (pictured) in torrential rain. So much more fascinating now I am imagining Emma and Ed tackling a similar job (and earning the best part of £500!) I also wanted to share that DS (21) called me from Berlin where he is studying this year to discuss rescuing a girlfriend who has moved in with a very controlling man. He told her to move all her stuff (especially passports and ID) to his and is helping her book a plane ticket home (apparently boyfriend monitors her phone!) He said «I’ve explained to her the concept of coercive control and that abuse doesn’t have to be physical - it’s just like Rob on The Archers! » DS must have been about 16 when the Knob story was ongoing and only ever appeared to be half listening, but clearly took the message on board. I can’t share this anecdote with anyone in RL as no one else shares my Archers obsession.

Same here but I'm the one with more of a chameleon accent. Northerners think I'm Southern, Southerners think I'm Northern. My sister is (fake) posh South East.

Well done your son @LillianGish ! Obviously well brought up.

Spot on! What a star. Hope the young woman listens to him and acts on his advice sooner rather than later.

Re accents: we moved from Scotland to Leeds when I was 9 and my brother was 6. His accent changed overnight, mine didn't (on principle - I was a stubborn child), my parents' didn't. When they moved back to Scotland nearly 30 years later they fitted right in. Interestingly, my brother had moved back to Scotland many years earlier and had managed to change accents again, but when he goes to Leeds Utd matches his accent switches straight back.

I like to think I still have a Scottish accent but not everybody down here in London picks it up. It gets a lot stronger on the phone to my Mum and when I'm north of the border.

I hope the script writers are currently weeping tears of joy and pride over your son’s active listening, @LillianGish!

Good for your son, @LillianGish ! Hope the poor woman is home safe soon. And bloody well done to the SW for managing the storyline as they did and showing the reality of coercive control.

And the fact that the man got away with it completely in spite of the new law, and that the only thing a woman could do to stop it was attempt to kill him. Excellent message, that one. (Not.)

But sadly realistic. Despite the Act having come into force at the end of 2015 there are still examples of the police not taking coercive control seriously and that's the best part of 10 years later, never mind less than 10 months by the time of Helen's trial (although I think it formed part of Helen's defence?). And in terms of the storyline, Helen didn't report Rob's behaviour to the police so there was nothing to prosecute, and he didn't get away with it in terms of his accusations against Helen not being believed.

I should imagine the last thing Helen needed or wanted was to drag it all back up again in the form of a further prosecution for abusive behaviour.

I had a friend who was abused by her partner and considered pushing for a prosecution. She decided she just couldn't bear to go through it all again and I can understand that. The last thing you want to do is give your abuser another chance to twist the story in their favour, play the victim and paint you as mad fantasist.