Archers thread #160: Ram a lamb a ding dong! To rate the mass wisteria in Ambridge, tap the feedback tablet here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd have given a home to Hilda the Hellcat, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @MerryChristmasToYou, @OverArmour and @LillianGish for the thread title ideas.

This week is a bit better than last week, but the Brad/Adil/Lily stuff is very odd. Coming up to the anniversary of Jennifer's death (22nd January last year). We need a new matriarch - could that be Natasha? I find her quite an interesting character. Sometimes she's awful and then she has moments as last night where she utterly redeems herself.

Over to you!

Anyway, I’m overreacting I know.

You’re not, @OverArmour, I still feel sick. Possibly the nastiest thing I’ve heard on TA across 60 years of listening.

But as long as it’s not based on a spoiler you can discuss any theories, predictions, speculation on this thread. 🔮

Oh that’s good to know @TottersBlanklyIntoBimboCore that I’m not incorrect in thinking just how nasty it was, I was walking my dog and actually just stood still which confused the dog. Worst thing in 60 years is quite something. 60 years is quite something! Wait - do we need to have a longest listener to The Archers on the thread competition with a prize of a pint a day?

The theory I saw was that Jolene might have got involved with money sharks. I thought it might have a ring of truth to it. Trying to remember when she might have dealt with finances separately. But perhaps she wouldn’t have been so keen to call the police if that was the case.

I dont think Mia has MH troubles, I just think she is very rude and thinks she knows whats right and noone seems to pull her on it.

I suspect such a competition would be equally impossible to administer, @OverArmour!

I can’t claim to have been listening consciously in the womb; and I wasn’t taking notes as a toddler. Missed loads during term time at boarding school, and later on when boyfriends and partners found it boring or ‘depressing’. The funny thing is how the mind fills in gaps … On, I think, the very first of this line of threads I confidently recounted a past TA story - only to be greeted with guffaws from other long-standing listeners. I’d completely invented several months of episodes - probably because I missed half of them first time round. So ‘across 60 years’ but definitely not every day for 60 years.

I love that! It’s possible that you did a better job than the scriptwriters! I always heard it at home (40 years ago) when my mum listened but didn’t really start myself until 2017 - the wasted years!

You're not over reacting @OverArmour. I listened at 5am and found it horrific. Really quite disturbing. I'm surprised it hasn't provoked more of a reaction on here.

I thought Jakob was meant to be their great ND/ASD hope… they pushed him as that then stepped back.

Definitely not the way you’d want to start the day

I avoid torture scenes in films and felt like I’d unwittingly listened to one. There isn’t much in The Archers that I’d worry about my kids hearing but that would have been switched off quickly.

It was good acting though, I’ll give them that!

It was pretty horrific. I was glad I was listening later and not in front of my DC at 7pm, the sounds of the dogs were frightening and then Kenton’s choking/wheezing sounds were pretty graphic.

@EBearhug , Shula was acted by someone older than the character. Kenton by someone younger. There's about 20 years' age difference.

@OverArmour , I agree. The ND stuff goes over my head.
I seem to have lots of ND traits but I'm probably just a bit weird.
Everything seems to need a diagnosis these days.

Why does Mia/Brad/Jakob need to be ND. They seem quite normal to me.

I agree, it was a tough listen and all the more shocking - in a rare instance of that oft-used word really applying for once - because genuinely unexpected and not telegraphed in advance (unlike most other storylines these days, which can be seen from space).

I hope Kenton will be okay - yes it was very unexpected which made it more shocking

Perhaps Merial will reappear ?

Me too.

Also why on earth would those people have sett their dogs on a pub ll asking them to move out of his car park? Whatever they were there for surely that just gives them more bother? Also we did n't hear them clearing off, engines etc??

I thought we did hear them driving off?

I can’t imagine what the motive would be either. Seems totally random

what happened to Lynda? Was it the fire? What are the long term consequences for her? I missed all that!

Shula was acted by someone older than the character. Kenton by someone younger. There's about 20 years' age difference.

Ah @ClickyHeels thank you. I never thought they sounded like twins and that partly explains it!

Thank you all for the warnings last night. I usually listen just before bed, but on reading the comments here I waited until this morning. It does sound bad 😬.

Bloody HELL, I was driving whilst listening and almost went into the back of the car in front. Did not see that coming AT ALL.

I like the money sharks theory @OverArmour I definitely think they'll shoe horn an XL Bully SL in too as they are restricted/banned from tomorrow so the timing fits.

Bloody hell! I'm not sure what to make of that. Were they being signalled as travellers with the trailers? I hope not. It's really irresponsible to introduce marginalised groups to a story and play into the most negative stereotypes without any nuance.

My theory is that this is because TA is not character driven. The hilarious plots are rammed in by amending the characters as needed, who then flip-flop between their different sub-characters. This is my own particular hobby horse - Justin is the worst (or should that be best) example of this.
Last night's episode is another example of plot over character. The money-flashing Brummies in the previous episode stuck out sore thumbs - when the two men in longest drinker storyline are silent, a pub table full of random new voices is clearly signalling something. Jolene's swift exit when she saw them, coupled with her rush to phone the police last night suggests she has some connection, but I can't think of any hints that have been dropped previously so whatever it is is coming out of the blue in what I presume is an attempt by the SWs to add some 'drama'.

I think it's time for me to stop listening. My thought last night was that they had jumped the shark.

Kenton’s choking/wheezing sounds were pretty graphic.

I’m imagining much of his face gone.
But those gurgles were likely only the first of a series of horrible noises. We can look forward to Jill hooting and quavering, Jolene emoting in Pirate and, most horrific of all, Ruth’s little, ‘concerned’ voice. Possibly with a side order of glo’al stop-ridden Nursey Ben, either being competent and reassuring with all the family and stating the medically bleedin’ obvious (ex catheter, naturally) OR going completely to pieces to remind us that he is, in fact, Fragile, and that nursing might be too much for him. Ideally, he will take against Bess, because Dog, and clearly one cannot trust Dogs, even for a moment.

Being ND does not equate to being mentally ill.

Jakob still manifests ND traits - remember him compering the show he got together round Christmas? But now he's accepted in Ambridge, though regarded as quirky.

I thought the baddies were casing the joint. If so, they didn't do a very good job - they didn't find out that the publicans live on the premises! I presume the social media call out is what alerted them to the Bull's vulnerability.

Real baddies would have driven off the moment Kenton appeared.

I wondered that when Jolene described them as having trailers but would she have said 'caravans'? I know Travellers refer to them as trailers but most people say caravans. So trailers, as you and I know them might be for transporting livestock possibly dogs or other stuff. Dog fighting has been suggested but they wouldn't have had time to get going as they'd just arrived so, presumably, the dogs would be kept away from each other before they started.

We’ve already done dog fighting haven’t we?

@RegimentalSturgeon oh GOD I hadn't thought of Jill's querulous grief. Arghhhhhhh!

I don't remember that. A pub car park, just after closing time in the middle of a village doesn't seem like the ideal spot for it anyway so I have my doubts but we'll see.