Archers thread #157: How sharper than a serpent’s tooth it is to have a thankless clan! Discuss The Grundys here. Bicker about The Archers as well if you like.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @OverArmour for the idea of making it clear in the title many of us are inveterate bickerers!

Now over to you, as we are about to eat and I won't hear tonight's offering till later ....

Surely no cafes make croissants from scratch? They buy them in from a specialist bakery.

So it was surprising that Fallon was able to produce any type of croissant, with or without kale.

I seem to remember someone who knew about business leases commenting at the time that Fallon could have resisted handing over the shop at the end of the lease but, of course, never so much as googled the issue.

It infuriates me that people in soaps always meekly leave their tenancies/jobs when chucked out and never ever take legal advice. Apart from anything else, they're propagating the view that there is nothing you can do about these things, which is just not true

Or in soaps where they quit and leave the same day

Sorry you had a tough time Ambridge - I’m glad you felt you had the opportunity to do her proud

It infuriates me that people in soaps always meekly leave their tenancies/jobs when chucked out and never ever take legal advice. Apart from anything else, they're propagating the view that there is nothing you can do about these things, which is just not true

Absolutely.

Was last night the worst for a long time? First I was infuriated, then I fell asleep. No idea what happened at the end.

Thank you @Bruisername

Very few religious people in my family though the older generation has alwayswanted traditional CoE church funerals. We rarely know the vicar at all and usually the service is very like Alan's one, that part of the episode seemed true to life to me. Thevicars havebeen uniformly great at meeting up and getting details of the deceaseds' life and character. I find the package of funeral and wake together comforting in a life goes on sort of way.

Oh thank you yes I forgot precious Harrison’s need to bird watch taking priority over Fallon’s long term business. Just hope the divorce of Fallon from the Archers doesn’t take too long! When Tom suggested asking Emma (since he didn’t like Fallon’s answer) last night I was 😯 but minor BOOP for Emma obviously giving the same answer.

Same with Hannah meekly leaving the house for odious George and stupid Will without waiting until she had found somewhere to live...then training her replacement before she had handed in her notice 🤦🏼‍♀️

That drivel with Tom and the cauliflower eclairs was the worst nonsense I've heard on the archers in a long time

I actually didn’t mind the stupid cookery per se, it’s the scenario behind it that fucks me off. And agree that it’s very conservative to show people rolling over to these arbitrary decisions.

I can imagine they either show them rolling over or they show them taking a ridiculous stand by having a sit in or arranging a petition or something and being bolshy (like Mia and the fireworks) rather than just reviewing their contract and legal rights

It infuriates me that people in soaps always meekly leave their tenancies/jobs when chucked out and never ever take legal advice. Apart from anything else, they're propagating the view that there is nothing you can do about these things, which is just not true

Me too. A soap would actually be a really good place to show a storyline about workers having g rights. I realise a storyline about putting in a grievance and going through the process is probably far less dramatic than something chucked out with no notice, but there's plenty opportunity for drama, showing the stress of it and so on. They can be really good at doing issue led storyline to raise awareness and even if they don't do this for work problems, they should have a responsibility to show that workers do have some rights and protections. Mind you, up to 2 years, workers don't have many rights, and 2 years can be a long time in soapland. But they do also have other characters who have done the same work for decades.

@KingsleyBorder , because many don't have any knowledge of Spanish. If you've only heard jalapeños said as halapeenos and empanada said as empanyada you'll think that's how it's said.
There's a tv chef, famous for italian heritage who says 'brushetta'.

@HumanWetWipe a lot of people are very familiar with how tildes work because of “España” though.

Also a lot of you tube cooking videos that use Latin American ingredients are from the US and Americans tend to get it Spanish pronounciation more or less correct.

But you’re right, it’s about modelling what you hear from people you assume know what they are talking about. Don’t get me started on UK TV chefs and “choritzo”!

It’s very hard with foreign words - do you try and pronounce it the correct way and people say you sound like a nob, pronounce it as you read it and people accuse you of being culturally illiterate or pronounce it how you’ve heard it from a chef and then also get called a nob because it’s not correct?

I’ve learnt 2 languages in my time and have the most atrocious accent no matter how hard I try and it has put me off speaking them because I’ve been mocked.

Indeed. There’s a lady who lives near me who talks about her house between Paris and Reims and says both place names with an elaborate french pronunciation, sounding like a total knob. Hard to know where to draw the line.

I too thought it was empanyadas. And choritzo. I speak three languages passably, none of which are Spanish. Hey ho.

spanish is a difficult one as american an european have very different pronunciation - no 'th' sound in costa rica for starters

@KingsleyBorder , jalapeños are usually written as jalapenos in the UK. España is one people know from Y Viva España, I suppose.

@AngryBirdsNoMore , I'd just say 'Paris and Rems' unless speaking to someone in French.

If you've only seen something written down, it's not always easy to know what language something is from. If I saw words like tiramisu, sachertorte and ceviche in print, with no reference to country of origin before I heard them, I probably would have said tirra-meesu, sasher-tort and seveesh.
My online translator says tagliatelle in English is pronounced Tag-lya-tell. Reassuringly, the Italian version is tal-ya-telleh.

Struggling to see the 'th' in 'costa rica'. Is it like the Starbucks' Marc with a C?

The “ny” sound can be made (or omitted) while saying the word in an entirely English or American accent.

Think of it like Fallon suddenly deciding to say “bananya” instead of banana.

I have no issue at all with the vowel sounds being English. It’s nothing to do with expecting people to use authentic foreign accents.

(Also, for info, ñ has the same pronounciation across all the Spanish-speaking world, no Lat Am/Spain variation).

The poster meant that Costa Ricans do not lisp their “c” in words like “gracias”, rather than that there was a potentially lisp-able “c” in the word Costa Rica.

I equally condemn people who WRITE “jalapeno “. They are part of the same problem (chicken or egg I wonder…)But most of the jars get it right

You’re missing the point. To get “empanada” passably correct (to my standard ha ha) all you have to do is read the word exactly as you would read an English word spelled like that.

@KingsleyBorder , fancy that! I'd never have guessed.
It's not easy to type non-standard characters on all devices. I use alt codes, but I have to check what they are. ALT Codes Reference Sheet (usefulshortcuts.com)

You missed my point - there are people on tv who do pronounce it with the y and that is why some other people do - so the third in my list

AIBU to think they've just kind of dropped Rob's storyline? I mean I know they deaded him and helen threw the ring away but the whole thing feels very anticlimax and like they couldn't be arsed any more. For somebody who was pissed they brought him back I'm now pissed that it feels unfinished. Still. Just me?