Archers thread #156: Fireworks in Ambridge! Helen gave Lee a rocket, but Grey Gables is a damp squib. Is the writing on the (church) wall?Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you're irresistibly attracted to George Grundy, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @OverArmour for the title suggestion, which I have tweaked a bit. I was strongly tempted by Less GGP (Grey Gables Peril) More GPP (Guinea Pig Plot), which was a plaintive cry from @PuppyPerson some days ago, but if Poppy has found new homes for the baby guinea pigs that may be the last we hear of them for some time, sadly.

Surely in the life of the next thread we must hear more from or of Rob, or Ron as some on this thread prefer to call him? <taps foot> Will Kirsty snap and tell Helen a few home truths? Will Pat's shotgun finally be brought into play? We can only hope ...

Also, will we ever find out who owns the other 60% of Grey Gables? Why is Adil AWOL (to use the other bit of OverArmour's title idea!)? Why aren't we hearing from Roy? Will GG ever re-open and will Emma get her Big Chance at last?

So many questions! Over to you.

I'm so far behind on the thread I've realised I'm never going to catch up. Struggled to find anything to say about last week tbh and Friday was pure tedium. Sure we all knew the fireworks would be noisy! No reputable person would ever expect Eddie to come up with the thing they actually wanted. Has anyone learnt anything from that Moss guy?

I was terrified of bangers in my childhood. Well, to be strictly honest, up until my mid-thirties. But way back then fireworks were usually bought in a box from the corner shop, and lit by the DF in the back garden for the family, so we had a lot of Fairy Rain, Golden Shower (such an innocent name back then) etc. Strangely, I did like Jumping Jacks.

Our local farm does a Quiet Fireworks event for the children.

It seems Guys are apparently Not In Keeping With Modern Thinking, or something? I suppose because it isn't a good thing to remember burning Catholics. But back in the 50s no-one knew the ins and outs of the Guy Fawkes story. We knew he got caught, and that that was a good thing, but actually the thing that everyone remembered about him was that He tried to blow up the Houses of Parliament. And everyone, in the 50s and 60s, and now, in the 2020s, thought that he kind of had the right idea...

It's so hard to care about Peggy and Jill storming off from St Stephens - we never hear from them anyway. You can't have a row with silent characters (anymore than silent fireworks would work on the radio - I'm sure there's a parallel in here somewhere). I don't object to characters being silenced per se (indeed I'd be happy never to hear Pip speak again), but once silenced they should only play a peripheral role - you can't expect them to carry the plot. Silent Robert is absolutely fine - he can be the modern day equivalent of Mrs P or Freda Fry, but I'm so glad the SWs didn't try to do the same with Jennifer.

The focus is now shifting from Peggy and her ilk, onto what Alan, Harrison, Neil and the PC can do to replace the loss in income.

Reminiscent of Once Upon a Time in the past, when a nation suddenly found itself interested in modern pig farming methods at Hollowtree. If the enterprise was successful, The Farmer's Second Son stood a chance of Marrying the Squire's Daughter.

Fun fact of the day: Grace Archer's catchphrase was "one fried egg or two, Phil?"

I heard this being advertised at the end of the last Archers episode, looks like it’s on Audible etc.

Also - presumably for an official display, there are health and safety regulations. Getting fireworks from Eddie would obviously be off the back of a lorry / complete disaster. So the fact they actually have him supply something like that, regardless of the silent ones, is stupid. I suppose, though Eddie is probably the person most likely to provide silent ones, in that the likelihood would be they probably wouldn’t work at all.

@Fink that heating bill is shocking.

Many, many years ago I used to attend church, sing in the choir etc but I had absolutely no idea that the collection was to keep the church going! I thought it went to charitable events and that the Church of England funded its own churches. I had never thought about where the money came from. That could be a reason why people don't give large amounts??

is Oliver effectively subsidising Ed’s business?

eddie is quite unpleasant - why does Oliver put up with it? How dare they make demands of him

Well, yet again I find myself wanting to boot certain characters to the back of beyond. How bloody dare they.

What’s the history with Oliver housing the Grundys?

BOOP! CHARACTER DRIVEN PLOTS. REALISTIC CONVERSATIONS, JUST LIKE SOME OF THE ONES I HAVE HAD IN MY LONGISH LIFE

(BTW I wasn't SHOUTING just then. I was TALKING LOUDLY. (I Can Also Talk Quite Loudly.))

I snorted at the bit about the Grundys always managing to survive and not needing any advice. They have survived on people feeling sorry for them.

No, they have survived because you can't keep a good Grundy down.
Eddie's brother Alf, OTOH, is another kettle of fish...

But what do they actually have? Other than Oliver’s goodwill?

Yes, sounds like it’s not viable without handouts.

I am sure Alan has some understanding of Peggy, and I bet he hardly took a moment to forgive her, for she knows not what she does

Oh Peggy knows exactly what she's doing.

I miss Roy and Rex and other not obnoxious characters.

Bruisername
is Oliver effectively subsidising Ed’s business?

Yes; he has been from the moment that he gave Ed the cows to start it with. And charged him a peppercorn rent for the land, on the pretext that Ed was doing him a favour by looking after Oliver's cows for him.

OverArmour
What’s the history with Oliver housing the Grundys?

When Joe and Eddie, tenant farmers at Grange Farm, went bankrupt in 2000 after not paying rent for several months, they were evicted by the landlord, who then sold the farmhouse and fifty acres of land to Oliver, whose intention was to be a gentleman farmer. The Grundys were rehoused in Borchester for three months, then moved back to Ambridge into a caravan on BL land and then into a cottage belonging to Jack Woolley.

Ed was a nogoodnik and petty criminal with a drug habit; Oliver picked him out of the gutter and put him onto his feet, employing him to look after Oliver's herd of Guernsey cows. After a while Oliver allowed Ed to have the cows and rented the land to him cheap. After a while he over-extended himself and lost that business, but managed to sell the cows (none of which were his) for a profit which he spent on a tractor. In 2016 he also started to breed Texels on Oliver's land, which he still rented.

Meanwhile Eddie, Clarrie and Joe were living in Keeper's Cottage, for which Jack Woolley charged them £500 a month (starting in 2001) for the three-bedroomed house. After Jack's death on 1st January, 2014, that house was inherited by Hazel Woolley, who didn't evict the Grundys until after the Great Flood Of 2015, during which they were flooded out and went and lived rent-free in Grey Gables for several months. (With their ferrets. How we all laughed.)

Oliver and Caroline, owners of Grey Gables and Grange Farm, went to Tuscany and decided they liked it there, so after a break-in at Grange Farm they asked Ed, who was there every day looking after his sheep, to keep an eye on the place and eventually to house-sit for them (he and Emma had housing problems as well). Then Grey Gables wanted the older Grundys out so they could let the rooms for Christmas and Joe (aged 204 – oh, all right, 94) was going to have to be put in a horrible B&B at the expense of the council, so Oliver said the senior Grundys could live at Grange Farm until they found somewhere. Once there, Joe settled in and started talking all the time about how all he wanted was to die in his real home, and like a sap Oliver allowed them to stay, though after a year or so of them freeloading he and Caroline did start to charge them all rent because they planned to buy a villa in Tuscany and needed the money.

After Caroline's death, the Grundys very kindly allowed Oliver to live in his own house, on sufferance. In fact they positively insisted on him coming to them for Christmas that year even though he didn't want to, and managed to make that be him now being in their debt.

Confused? You will be....

What a load of users.

Indeed. It's why I don't much like them, though I make an exception for Clarrie, who is merely ineffectual though well-meaning, rather than actively malign.

Thank you, thank you, that’s amazing! It sounds about what I would have expected. I think the only bit I actually knew about as a listener was the very last bit about Oliver visiting them for Christmas somewhat under duress. But didn’t know the full history before that.

i’d like to think that after that spectacular display of entitlement that Oliver might actually be able to proceed without feeling guilty. But actually I’m guessing that he will feel bad and find some way to not actually go through with it. It seems like everybody expects assistance from Oliver and gives him a hard time when he can’t do it.

Hopefully Oliver will tell them all to sod off and sell the whole lot to damara

i’d happily see Eddie on the streets although clarrie could move in with will

I'm faintly surprised no-one has been along to denounce Oliver as a filthy landlord, ousting his tenants when his finances require it. Other than the Grundys, that is.

At least he put them right with some asperity when they got on their high horse(s) about it.

Where is Oliver living now - didn't he have a suite in Grey Gables? Did he stay there throughout the refurb?

I can't wait to hear Emmur having a go at Oliver about his greedy thieving landlord ways. <sarcasm> That's surely coming soon.

Oh, I expect we have that delight to come.

They really are the biggest bunch of free-loading ingrates (with the possible exception of Clarrie - pending her reaction). They’ve been absolutely feather-bedded by Oliver and they expect to carry on doing it at his expense forever.