Archers thread #149: This is not a drill, it’s a plot device. Here’s hoping for Stella-r rows in Ambridge. Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you think George Grundy's bantz make him a great laugh and totally harmless to women, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks for title suggestions - @FallonsNewCoat started us off with Drilling down OR What’s the drill?: So many jobs hanging in the balance - what’s planned for Adam, Stella, Freddie and horrible George?, @OverArmour's suggestion was ‘Drilling down on less than Stella-r performances and who will be a pig in muck’ and @TeenDivided contributed the laserdrill focussed Lets drill into plot holes and hope George gets his comeuppance. I went for a bit of all of that. The phrase at the back of my head, which I am very pleased to have tracked down, was from one of my favourite film franchises where the character Conklin says in Jason Bourne's memory This is not a drill, soldier. We clear on that? This is a live project. You are go. Training is over. Training is over. Well, that's us, troops. Training is over, discussing The Archers is a live project, and it's our job to drill down into all aspects of what we hear.

On the last thread, people were discussing how unrealistic the portrayal of mental health problems is on TA. I wholeheartedly agree, but I suppose they don't feel they can tackle long-running slow burn storylines that often. They made a great effort with Jack Woolley's Alzheimer's. Other than that, I don't recall anybody having a recurring illness that's been portrayed realistically (and actually that goes for physical conditions as well). Most things clear up and are hardly mentioned again. Sticking just to mental illness, Pat had depression after John died, Mike Tucker had a bad bout of depression, so did Elizabeth. Helen's ED may or may not be about to re-appear, but nobody's mentioning it. Ben's rapid-onset depresssion recently led to a psychotic episode but now he's fine, not least because he got prompt, skilled and appropriate treatment on the NHS, unlike most of the UK. This is one area where I feel they shouldn't even attempt it if they can't do it in a way that reflects the reality of what most of us experience, for ourselves and our loved ones.

Anyway, with that off my chest - over to you!

Freddie was incredibly rude to Vince. A simple “thanks but I don’t think that’s the right role for me” would have sufficed rather than laughing in Vince’s face and mocking the job offer. Horrible snob. I hope his DJ ‘career’ ends in abject failure.

I agree Freddie was unconscionably rude. Presumably the wheels of dramatic irony have been set into motion by all this and he will, in time, rue the day he was so sneering.

I think Vince was kind and Freddie incredibly rude - Bince has done very well for himself starting from scratch and perhaps the Abbatoir etc isn't LL but Vince had done pretty ok - I'm not sure I see Freddie as Fat boy Slim or Mark Ronson

But Elizabeth has another child - cue Lily to take over ???

I find Justin quite odious and I do not like hearing his voice.

My skin crawls every time Justin speaks.

Freddie was unspeakably rude to Vince who made a very kind offer. Did you catch Freddie’s ‘you started with nothing and turned out alright’ comment? He’s just another over entitled posh boy who’s going to think anything good happening to him is down to his hard graft and genius, and anything bad is everyone else’s fault. Start with nothing indeed! I’ve always liked Freddie and felt sorry for him, but no more!

I don't think Vince was being kind - he's a nasty piece of work. He's trying to get some control over Freddie and curry favour with Elizabeth. Good for Freddie for not falling for it.

Being kind … I didn’t feel Freddie laughed out of snobbery, more because despite having grown up amongst a wider family for whom farming is life, he himself has never shown the slightest interest in livestock, so it would be a bit of an odd job to fall into.

If it had been Ben, I’d have assumed the laughter meant he was destined to inherit / take over the abattoir business (once reunited with Beth) - but it’s hard to see that in Freddie’s future.

Unlike others here I’m praying the DJ-ing is a huge success - either giving him the confidence to take on his inheritance with aplomb, or meaning he can turn his back on it for good, leaving Lily to take over.

I'd love to see the SWs covering the ins and outs of the Midlands / Ibitha club scene.....

I'm more with you, @CountryCousin. F was rude but not out of snobbery.

*scene(s). I doubt there is one homogenous Brum-Ayianappa (sp??) "scene"

I agree with this. What on Earth made him think Freddie wanted to work in the meat industry when he wants to be creative.

The other thing they need to do with Freddie is show us the life changing psychological effects of prison. Not just the negative ones either, iyswim.

He's mainly reverted to whiny rich boy atm.

I agree with this. What on Earth made him think Freddie wanted to work in the meat industry when he wants to be creative.

We all want to be creative, but we need a job.

Perhaps Vince was wrongly crediting Freddie with having some common sense.

I don't know if he still does it, but Keri Davies used to do a lot of DJing alongside his Archers scriptwriting work. He always seemed to feel he was very down with the kids when he moderated the BBC's Archers messageboard (Mustardland) many moons ago.

So is that the origin of Freddie’s DJ enthusiasm, @Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g?

It's not as if DJing is exactly creative, though. It's just using the products of other people's creativity. Freddie just doesn't seem to notice that people who earn a living through their creations do actually put some work into what they are doing.

I don't really understand Freddy's inheritance. Surely he'll inherit anyway one day whatever happens? It's not the case that his father is alive and threatening to disinherit - he is the heir and although the trustees are delaying surely they can't actually change the terms of Nigel's will. Elizabeth has held the fort magnificently - no-one would deny that - but she's just the caretaker manager. I imagine she'd be happy to continue even if Freddy were in charge and he'd be happy for her to stay on. She was the power behind the throne when Nigel was alive - and remember how they all had to kow-tow to Julia back in the day? Why shouldn't Freddy go off to Ibiza for a year and take a bit of time out - his own equivalent of selling swimming pools, having an ice cream van like his dad? Then he can come back, marry Chelsea Horrobin and she can take over.

Perhaps Freddy's dj career will see him turn LL into a huge country rave venue! That would be epic!

My ds is a songwriter. DJs can make decent money. I can't see that he has the connections- that goes a very long way.

I've always assumed so.

I don’t think that was Vince’s motivation. He doesn’t really need to curry favour with Elizabeth. She made it crystal clear to David during the Ben/Beth debacle that she is firmly Team Vince and will not choose her family over him. I’m not sure he’s a kind man as such but I do think he was trying to be helpful.

I still think Freddie’s derisive laughter came from a place of snobbery. He has never believed Vince is good enough for Elizabeth and that is 100% a class issue.

.... marry Chelsea Horrobin and she can take over

You've read my mind @LillianGish , I've been thinking this for some time.

Exactly this is what I'd like to happen. He's only young and I'd also like him to be a modest success - my cousin did a few years DJing abroad and he's a lot stupider than Freddie. Lily can take her rightful place as the estate manager or whatever it is Elizabeth does now.

Then he can get a bit too old for it and come home and settle down with Chelsea if she'll have him. It would be lovely. Lily and Freddie can work together in a deeply quarrelsome sibling way. Maybe Lily can tell him to fuck off at some point and she could go and get a different career as a glassmaker/recruitment consultant/aerialiste and then they'll have a nice old age back in the LL fold.

I'm so irritated with the Freddie storyline that I'm delurking! It's all over the place.

As discussed here, the trustees who have no trust have shown interest in Freddie twice: when he went to prison and over the damage to the not very valuable painting. It's apparently never occurred to them that a formal grounding in estate management might be a Useful Idea.

Elizabeth vaguely realises that she should be helping to prepare Freddie and vaguely finds him half roles. So he shadows in the Orangery for a bit - largely organising Chelsea's shifts - and is then put in charge of volunteers. Worthwhile a job as this might be, it's hardly a full time post and is only loosely related to estate/ business management.

To deter him from from DJ-ing, Elizabeth decides that she doesn't want Freddie to have time off after all and orders him back to the volunteer rotas, whilst Vince suddenly discovers that he needs a meat management trainee. Freddie, who I've hitherto felt quite sorry for, is ruder than the rudest young man in rudeland to Vince.

Sorry. But this is crap.

Why shouldn't Freddy go off to Ibiza for a year and take a bit of time out - his own equivalent of selling swimming pools, having an ice cream van like his dad

Fine, if he wasn't expecting his mother to continue to work her socks off in order to subsidise it.

Perhaps what irritates me about him is that when he's moaning about not getting what he wants, in addition to sounding quite upper class and entitled, he also has that adolescent crack in his voice that make him sound like Kevin the Teenager. He really is basically saying to them all "It's not fair! I hate you! Hmphhhh!" whilst swinging his arms around like an orangutan.

Fine, if he wasn't expecting his mother to continue to work her socks off in order to subsidise it She loves it! Elizabeth is constantly cooing about how Freddy is so like his father, so like Nigel. She was essentially the boss of Nigel and being the boss of Freddy is just an extension of this. He is like his father, but she’s never encouraged him to be any other way.

How important is the BL contract to Home Farm? I know it was a big deal ages ago but can't Brian just tell Justin to shove it rather than have him dictate who runs the Aldridge's farm?