Archers thread #140: Changing rooms at Brookfield with Leonard Llewellyn-Bowen, or saving souls with St Smugula in the heathen wastelands of the North? Discuss The Archers here!

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you think a stained glass window marking the birth of newborn twins is just what Ambridge needs, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Title composed in haste, making use of @Octothorpe's lovely coinage of Leonard Llewellyn-Bowen and @TheLassWiADelicateAir's terrific description of St. Smugula's mission to the heathen wasteland of far flung Sunderland, both from the last thread

I've abandoned the use of an emoji in the title, having been alerted by another thread recently to the fact that it makes it difficult for people with visual problems to use assistive software.

I won't say much more about The Archers, as I'm still feeling extremely jaundiced about the programme at the moment. Fingers crossed it takes a turn for the better over the next few days. It was good to hear Helen, Lee and Joy again tonight. Less delighted to hear the loathsome George. What a numpty not to recognise pheasant chicks! His Dad would be far from impressed.

Over to you!

Surely it would have been better for Tracy to risk going over things Chelsea already knew, than just not talk about it at all with her? I don’t understand why she’s dancing around her all the time. If she’s going to act like a child, Tracy needs to take charge.

She’s been petrified of Chelsea running off again so has been on eggshells ever since that happened.

I don’t like any of the ways this story can go now - miscarriage, late term abortion, keeping the baby or having it adopted.

oh maybe Leonard can adopt it since he’s become the default Adorably Capable Older Person.

It was ridiculous to keep pushing her for a decision before she’d had any professional counselling or advice. I just can’t get over the fact that no one steered her towards any of the services aimed at young women in exactly her situation. It’s not as if she’s the first teenager ever to get pregnant.

I’m wondering if the SWs would find more drama in revelation or attempted secrecy regarding Ben - that's certainly the way things seem to be going.
I have a certain sympathy with Natasha spilling the beans over spotting Tracy outside the midwife's consulting room. How old is Tracy? Natasha was talking to her immediate family - not announcing it in the shop. This is obviously another way in which news will filter out - the wrongly accused Russ, now the wrongly suspected Trazzer - until the only people still in the dark are the Dopeys.

HideandSeeking I don’t like any of the ways this story can go now - miscarriage, late term abortion, keeping the baby or having it adopted.

Social Services taking the child into care at birth....

(Sorry, I don't know how to quote just part of a post.)

until the only people still in the dark are the Dopeys

It’s rather brilliant that Josh and Ben moving out leaves David and Ruth even more isolated from the village. They rarely go out (apart from the odd pub quiz / bit of bickering with brother) and no one visits them (apart from Lynda, seasonally. And Vince, who’ll now go to the Stables instead).

Although I can imagine one of them, having heard the news from Tony, racing home to spread the word on Tracy’s pregnancy - only for Pip to pipe up with “Oh, but I thought Chelsea …”. Though that wouldn’t get them any further unless Ben had been seeking Pip’s advice for a ‘friend’, too.

Hmm … Poor Baby Brookfield. I’d much rather his/her/their existence could be formally announced in a positive light. Not going to happen, is it?

Still no sympathy from me for Gnasher. There was such salacious glee in her voice when she told the others.

I see Ben hasn't done anything about speaking to Chelsea to see how she is.

Ragepost incoming.

I just feel furious that Tracy + family have now become fixed as the designated scapegoats. Everything that can go wrong has gone, and now will go wrong for them, it seems.

Tracy loses job at Grey Gables (having been praised as v. bright & capable)
Starts to worry about money/managing
Has hooked up with the useless Jazzer, who doesn’t really have much of a clue
Can't find job. Despairs. Brother Gary (?) moves out, taking needed family income with him.
Gets horrible chicken factory job in desperation - seemingly only option
Is inexplicably singled out for awful bullying - in despair
Brad can’t go to residential course as no money (oh, and he gets bullied too, by the vile George)
Chelsea (who was introduced as a decent, sparky kid but quickly regressed to a sulky, whining teen) scratches Gemma's car
Absurd threat of private prosecution against Chelsea - Tracy resigns but pretends to be still working
Worse despair
Oliver steps in, if totally accidentally - food bank, offers of help. Job at Bull.
HURRAH! Corner turned?
Oh nononononono. Chelsea pregnant. Runs away. Russ accused. Uproar.
Chelsea back. Refuses all discussion of baby.
Despair all round
Pip - of all people - finally makes headway with Chels
Midwife
OH MUM I'M 17 WEEKS PREGNANT LIKE OMG?!?!?
Baby looms

The single bright spot in that whole litany of despair over months was the job at the Bull, and iirc it was literally a matter of days before Chelsea made her pregnancy confession.

Tracy/her family can’t be allowed nice things, it seems. They have to suffer.

Even at 14 weeks Chelsea has missed the opportunity for the less invasive means of termination. Which Tracey would've known. And would a midwife really ask you to listen to the heart in those circumstances? Perhaps they have to offer.

( - I do think that pregnancy choices should be talked about more so maybe this is not a terrible SL. I have had a termination which as the 'father' drank himself to death turned out not to be a terrible choice. But I appreciate it's sensitive)

Agree with you @Octothorpe - they're the new Grundys except with the Grundys it's clear that Eddie and Ed often make silly decisions that somewhat bring misfortune on themselves.

I think the SW have realised the audience like Tracey and her family and think torturing them will help us keep listening.

Also I think Natasha is a stone cold bitch for spreading gossip about Tracey but I wasn't surprised, because 1) she's always been horrible 2)Helen is a massive snob (think of the way she talks to/about Susan and Clarrie) and so N presumably thought she'd enjoy the chance to gossip over Tracey/Jazzer's "news".

Tracey was born 23 July 1975, so she's just turned 47. Natasha might think she's younger than though, because Tracey's fit and sporty. I imagine Tracey wears a lot of jeans / Tshirt / trainers which make it harder to pin an age on her.

The gossip did arise naturally, out of talk about the cricket team.

Nope I was upset about Gnasher. It was purely for her/their entertainment.

I love gossip (who doesn't) but I hold back as much as possible because it's shitty and you never can know the damage you might do. She was being a superior cow

They really have it in for the Horrobins, don't they!
Chelsea used to have the makings of a successful, sensitive, kind hairstylist but has morphed into a snuffling teenager with zero awareness (with dis-interested college tutors/local police even though she went AWOL necessitating a manhunt/media campaign to find her).
18 months ago Tracey had somehow turned into an organised, successful administrator/receptionist but was unfeasibly unable to get a job in hospitality when the industry is crying out for staff. Oliver/Roy/Adil really would have alerted some contacts in real life.
Brad is an unlikely maths wizard but, again, unable to hold onto a holiday job.

Grrr

This. All of this. It is enraging.

Still no sympathy from me for Gnasher. There was such salacious glee in her voice when she told the others
Would you really not have shared that titbit with your sister-in-law @LillianGish?!?

You’re all clearly far nicer people than I am- I have to admit that in Gnasher’s position I wouldn’t have been able to resist speculating…

I think given that Tracey has a teenage daughter who's recently been behaving erratically I'd probably think like as not it was her Tracey was waiting for, and keep my big mouth shut to the wider family (although would probably discuss with my husband).

I forgot that Brad had lost the temp baling job as well…..

Excellent rageposting, Octothorpe.

Tracy/her family can’t be allowed nice things, it seems. They have to suffer.

The only way this can be given meaning is if, having pulled themselves out of the Slough of Despond, the Horrobins find themselves mysteriously deposited within the Elysian Fields of Brookfield. Or whatever.

(The remains of any religious / mythological upbringing I had are scattered to the four winds - have to cobble together what hope I can muster. If anyone can map Tracy’s travails against the Pilgrim’s Progress I’d be grateful! The Wicket Gate, and the Village of Morality seem apposite - but the March’s miserable Christmas morning put me off Bunyan for life.)

To be fair I didn't known pregnancies were dates before they conceivable could have been conceived until I caught up on sounds this morning and I have two kids! At least that and being poorly in bed has got me back here.

Greetings everyone and thank you for the new thread. Welcome newer posters and keep up the excellent ranting please.

An old friends stepsisters both had babies in their teens and tbh it did them both the world of good. They were neither on a great path but it gave them some down time and responsibility and they both went on to have careers in their 20s when the kids were in school. It doesn't have to be a disaster but it
is definitely limiting Chelsea's potential. Most of the MUA and Stylists I know were working the west end/ TV/ fashion week etc circuits before having kids, so had established contacts and reputation when they went back to work, though I doubt (given TSWAMA) that they would have afforded Chelsea an escape from Ambridge and a fabulous career.

Oh gosh I am poorly. Just posted on the other thread and confused myself

PS I like Ben and think his actor and Ruari's are entirely believable. It's only ever the storylines letting them down.

Poor @suzyscat , hope you feel better soon.

I enjoyed Eddie's mispronunciation of tiramisu.

You're quoting me , not Lilian.

I hope I would do as TheHideAndSeekingHill · Today 11:33

I think given that Tracey has a teenage daughter who's recently been behaving erratically I'd probably think like as not it was her Tracey was waiting for, and keep my big mouth shut to the wider family (although would probably discuss with my husband)

My husband would then tell me to stop gossiping.

Thanks Whopping! Been on the noodle soups and hot cocoa. Trying to brace myself for work later, though the kids energy usually perks me up. Looking forward to crawling back in to bed.

Seriously though, how can you be 2-3 weeks more pregnant than the conception date? Doesn't that throw out all the averages for growth rate/ due date etc? I know due dates an imprecise art but this has really thrown me. Surely Chelsea can't suddenly be more pregnant unless it's a different father.

I had a miscarriage a couple of my months before I became pregnant with DC1, who was 1 and still breastfed when DC2 arrived so there were no last periods to count for me.

My mind is truly blown by this and massive props to the previous poster who guessed she'd be counted as 16-17 weeks. Every day's a school day.

All the growth rate, due date etc. are based off the date of the LMP for everyone, so it doesn't mess it up because every pregnancy is dated the same way. It means that you don't conceive until an average of 2 weeks into the 'pregnancy', but it's the same for everyone. It would only mess up dates if some women's pregnancies were calculated based on the day they had sex and other people's on the first day of their last period, but as everyone is in the same boat it's ok. Even people who have IVF and know the exact date of implantation have their dates calculated the normal way. If the woman wasn't having regular periods before conception they just adjust the dates as though she had been.