🏏Archers thread #136: Howzat! Oliver’s bowled a googly, Kathy’s out, Grey Gables left with nightwatchman. Tracy knocked for six. Is Ambridge on a sticky wicket? Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you are entranced by new character Adil, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/4197199--The-Archers-spoilers-thread-6-Cant-wait-for-7-02pm-Join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Apologies if anybody made a thread title suggestion and I missed it. I decided to mark the start of the cricket season in the hope that things will take a turn for the better for poor Tracy.

It feels like months since the last new thread, which was just after Phoebe departed for Scotland. Has she been mentioned since? I can't recall. Not greatly missed, by me, at any rate. Her fish gifts didn't last long.

I can't shake off the feeling that The Archers is going through a long dull patch. I don't feel greatly engaged by anything that's happening at the moment other than Tracy's plight. Such a good actor, which helps, of course.

What's keeping you listening? Habit? Genuinely enjoying it? Over to you!

(PS In the process of starting this thread, I've discovered that our custom-made Archers emoji has gone. You used to get it by typing . Not any more.)

Alice only went for full custody and Chris insisted she waive all parental decisions for Martha for evermore. If Chris hadn't pulled this stunt none of this would be happening.

So Neil's signed himself for retirement then. Painfully out of character. At least Chris can tell his solicitor he's got full time child care covered.

I like the hunter gatherer metaphor. Chris's pride in how he built his business is misplaced. I have a few friends who've had the benefit of a rent/ mortgage free adulthood and solid financial security without needing to work, and yes they've built brilliant things but often overlook the free time and cash flow that has enabled it.

Of course it's perfectly normal for a couple to support one of them getting qualified/ setting up businesses etc. If one of you has a property of course you'll live in it. It just feels like Chris has forgotten that Alice was the higher earned and supported them for a long time, in addition to providing the housing.

With that, and, I could be wrong, but hasn't she only stopped working (albeit at home farm) since maternity leave? Martha turned 1 recently so not an inconceivable length of mat leave, and they've been broken up for most of it. I feel like if the writers were paying attention that would mean either Chris deserved very little or Alice should be the one to benefit for the settlement.

I don't know anything about divorce which is probably very apparent. Won't they just be awarded shared custody? Or as they both want full custody does it have to be that?

Ugh why do I have so much say about this storyline. I just find it so annoying. More Stella. More Ben. More Leonard and loads of Tracey but with good news please.

How are our veteran cricketers doing?

Baking seems out of character for creepy Constance Harrison, but so is doing a strip tease dressed as a Spice Girl. Who even knows anymore?

I thought Alice was sacked from her job and some sort of role was invented for her at Home Farm.

Thank goodness for Alastair, Denise and Barry. I enjoyed that conversation.

Neil sounded utterly unhinged. It will be hard to row back from that little tantrum.

I don’t think Denise is very happily married. Semi-retired John on his motorbike is either having an affair or Denise is about to. Alistair would surely be a better bet than Barry.

Who was the client with the fruit cake? Presumably she is too highly-qualified for Fallon’s children’s pudding competition.

I like the hunter gatherer metaphor. Chris's pride in how he built his business is misplaced

It was misplaced because his wife and FIL lied to him. They behaved in a patronising manner and the revelation had the potential to damage his self-esteem. He really thought he was doing something and all the time he was being propped up, only to have it revealed in the context of the divorce.

I loved the rat interlude but could have done without the entire scene being conducted through cake and lip smacking. Bleurgh.

Neil's slapdown of Brine will end up being watered down. Was not convinced by Brine's taking the call, not at all like him to back off.

As we've never met Denise's husband will he be expendable via a crash leaving Alastair to comfort her and live happily ever after to Shula's chagrin?

Yes @Roysnewshirt Denise is SO not happily married.

This week I've kept confusing voices. I'be thought Jakob was Alistair and Denise was Stella. I don't think any of them sound similar usually.

Barry or Denise for unsung hero then.

I've never had them, but I do think rats make wonderful pets. I'm hoping the rat chat's purpose was to inform the masses of more sensible pet choices over ill thought through puppy purchases.

Yes Alice was fired, but thanks to daddy didn't have a gap in employment & earning so I don't see the relevance to the divorce. The fact is she's always brought in a stable income and supported Chris when he would have lost the business.

I see your point about Chris's self esteem @echt but I just find Chris's pride very ugly and somewhat misplaced.

The chip on his shoulder seems romantic when @LillianGish writes so beautifully on the custodianship and ownership of the land. But this chapter of it is hard listening.

Also if you're going to roam around getting yourself all worked up like that, you're bound to receive some home truths.

Just how unusual will these unusual deserts be I wonder? Will it be a load of beetroot brownies and sweet potato caramel, I wonder. Signpost those healthy alternatives!

Also I did enjoy Stella, Fallon and Lily being 3 childless adult women talking about parents and the fair the other day. It really rang true and was nice to see representation of women who aren't mothers IYSWIM (although Lily is young and I've no idea how old Stella is.)

So,
Stellistair or Denistair?
Place your bets.

I've had several rats, and I used to take my first one out and about in a handbag, and on my shoulder/down my jumper. She came with me on rail journeys to visit my parents, and I would sometimes let her out of her cage on the train.

Barry would surely have put his rat down his jumper on seeing an approaching dog.

I very much doubt his rat would have survived such a close encounter with a dog. I know from DCat the mighty hunter that she would incapacitate a rat by biting through its ribcage (sorry).

And even if he had survived it is very difficult to anaesthetise such a small animal.

However, I am happy that this fictional rodent seems to have made a good recovery.

I hated listening to the rant they made Neil do

I've lost track on some of these new people, but agree the husband on the motorbike will probably come to a tragic end.

She came with me on rail journeys

TheSummerySilveryPussycat have you any idea how this sounds to someone not fond of rodents? If I had encountered you and the animal on my commute I’m not sure I could have resisted the urge to throw myself out of the moving train, or pulled the alarm switch or simply run through the train screaming.

Of all the problems and difficult encounters one lives with every day, I don’t think I ever considered that I might be brought into an involuntary meeting with a large rodent inside a train on my way to work.

When I was a student, my housemate had a pet rat who she used to loan out to whoever was having an essay crisis that night. He was a lovely little thing and good company during the early hours of the morning. I loved him sitting up on my shoulder or curling up on my lap. Haven’t thought about him for about 20 years. Sadly I can’t remember his name.

What a ridiculous outburst from Neil. Brian was totally correct that it was inappropriate in a workplace where Neil was talking to his employer. And I’m not just saying that because Brian can do no wrong in my eyes. Even if it was a reasonable place to have the conversation did Neil think yelling abuse would convince Brian not to go ahead with pursuing Chris’s affairs? Quite the reverse I would have thought, since Neil more or less admitted that Chris’s accounts are dubious.

I’m moved to wonder again - what was the point of the whole historic pollution and removal from Home Farm story in which the SWs entrapped Brian & Jenny? It has made no difference whatsoever to any other story, apart from dramatically (in both senses) diminishing Ambridge by removing Home Farm house as a nexus of social and working life. Which they haven’t managed to replace.

I know we had high / low contrasts at Grey Gables, but that was a hotel and a workplace, it never offered the same exquisite delineations and manoeuvrings as encounters forged over decades between Aldridges and Tuckers / Horrobins / Grundys / Snells - at the front door / invited into the kitchen / loitering awkwardly by the pool. It’s a crying shame.

I don't think that Alice was ever looking to cut contact. She principally wanted an equal say in decisions about Martha. It was Chris's assumption that of course what he wanted would always triumph that precipitated everything.

I don't recall Alice suggesting shared parenting, pretty certain she said she was looking to be the resident parent. She's a spoilt brat, I've never had any time for her. She's always been Kate without the amusement value.

Denistair blatantly after that fruit cake heavy sighs over the husband on his bike convo

did we like the casual signposting that Denise is black or was it a bit try hard?

So what would Chris have done if, when he couldn't meet the loan repayments, Alice had said 'We could ask my Dad, I'm sure he would help.'

Would he have said 'No, Alice, I'm not being beholden to your stuck up, cheating family, I'd rather lose the forge, the thousands we've shelled out already and my livelihood, and live on your earnings.'

Or perhaps 'I don't want to be beholden to anyone else - I wanted to do this on my own, I'm hurt and embarrassed that I have to ask your father, but I can't lose the forge - it's my livelihood and I've worked so hard to build up the business.'

Either way, Alice obviously thought she was doing the right thing, helping Chris while letting him maintain his pride.

Alice was sacked from her job because she wasn't coping due to her alcoholism. Which Chris didn't realise. I don't really understand how he didn't pick up on her illness for so long.

Does anyone remember the period after Chris' injury when Alice was at his bedside pretty much 24/7 while he was unconscious, left to have a shower and something to eat so it was Emma beside the bed when he woke up. I often wondered if Chris was ever told that Alice was there for days. And of course it was him getting all woeful about Alice's Canadian job offer that made him lose concentration and get kicked in the first place. Alice has given up quite a lot for Chris over the years, I think.

I agree pretty much with everything suzyscat says above.

I looked up the actress (Clare Perkins, apparently) and think she must be a bit tired of the name ‘Denise’!

But, as I said above, I’m convinced she’s been brought to our attention to precipitate jealousy and action on Shula’s part. (I find it highly unlikely that Alistair would, long term, prefer her to an Archer. Prepared to be wrong, but …)

She wanted main care of Martha.

Oh! Forgot to say - I met Alistair’s sister at the weekend …

No, it was misplaced because in his head he did it all himself and he refused to acknowledge Alice's contribution. Realistically, given that in fact he actually was propped up by a handout from Alice, why does it make a difference that it came from her father rather than her employer? It's not as if he claims to have paid her "bonus" back to her. And why does he ignore the fact that it would have been considerably harder to build up the business if he'd had to pay rent or a mortgage on the house - didn't that prop him up also?

I don't recall Alice suggesting shared parenting, pretty certain she said she was looking to be the resident parent. She's a spoilt brat, I've never had any time for her. She's always been Kate without the amusement value.

Yes, she wanted to be the resident parent, but there was no suggestion that Martha wouldn't be spending plenty of time with Chris. It's not as if he was planning to be a SAHD before all this blew up, after all.

Of course the sensible arrangement would be shared residency, but Chris made it pretty clear that he was never going to agree to that.

The concept of Neil steaming all day till he could have a go at Brian is pretty bloody ridiculous. He's not stupid, surely he could work out that Chris wouldn't be in such a panic unless he had something to hide?

It's also ridiculous that Brian would just try to walk away from the discussion without saying anything. It would be much more in character to say that he was happy to have the discussion whenever Neil chose outside work hours, and refuse to take it any further. Not least because giving Neil time to simmer down would probably be a very good strategy.

Well said Neil! He has spent a lifetime keeping a lid on his feelings and biting his tongue where Brian is concerned. Now he's approaching retirement he no longer needs to doff his cap and kow-tow to Brian or anyone else for that matter. Susan may have been delighted when Kristifur married Alice and elevated the Carters into the upper echelons of Ambridge society (as she saw it!) Neil has never thought the Aldridges were better than the Carters and as a self-made man, proud of who he is, decent, hard working and faithful, he is the antithesis of Brian Aldridge. It was good to see him calling the man out - the chemicals he dumped, the lies he told about it and his serial infidelity to Jenny. Let's not forget it was Neil and Susan who spent the first months (year?) of Martha's life getting up in the night to help Chris take care of her after Alice checked out. No wonder he feels strongly about her volte face. I loved his fierce defence of his son (born with a cleft lip remember so Neil was there while Susan struggled to love him) - who like his father before him is hard working, if slightly dull and - despite Neil and Susan's best efforts, building their own home, working hard all their lives - starting the race ten steps behind Alice Aldridge who has had everything in life handed to her on a plate and continues to do so however badly she messes up.

Nobody freaked out at my rat - she was of course in her cage when I got on, and she wasn't out the whole journey. And being female she was quite small. If anyone were freaked out I wouldn't have taken her out.

In fact, several fellow travellers were surprised to find themselves liking her. There were many rat converts during her life

Can't be bothered to write anything about TA, except it's all too shouty and I wish someone would make it stop.