🍾 Archers thread 123: Goodbye & good riddance to 2020 – to Philip too? The Archers is 70 on New Year’s Day – celebrate or vent about it here!

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you wish we heard more from Shula, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3853783--The-Archers-spoilers-thread-5-Cant-wait-for-7-02pm-Join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

So! 2021 beckons. Big anniversary next Friday, 1.1.21 (and to mark that we have episodes Tuesday-Friday next week). What would we like to see happen? I may be in a minority of one, but I'd like a nice gentle character-driven episode. I don't think we'll get that, but I really, really hope they don't kill someone else off, just for the headlines.

[Title edited by MNHQ at OP'S request]

Should say I’d previously assumed that the laptop was used for shady work doings. But can’t have been that if Kirsty had had access to the accounts

Dodgy accounts were on the secret laptop?

Happy Boxing Day and thank-you for the new thread.

I'm a bit confused by Thursday's episode.

Did the second set of books mean that Philip had actually been doing PAYE for the horses (but just not bothered to pay them)? Otherwise, what was the point of the second set of books? He could have furloughed the trio for the past 9 months whilst making them work on a few small jobs.

We've been told on multiple occasions that work has been patchy since Blake blew up Grey Gables. Arguably Philip could say that he has kept his workers accommodated, fed and watered at tremendous cost when they are bringing in hardly any income.

Unless Gavin decides to snitch on his dad I'm not sure that the police have much to go on. Roy visited Blake in hospital, but I am not sure how many other people would be able to describe him (and Roy had verified amnesia/concussion, so could be easily discredited).

I wonder how Alice and Chris are getting on?

Well that was proper satisfying. Hope they follow it through and find the lads and Victoria

@JoeGrundyWasMyRoleModel

Thanks for the new thread Gasp0de

If I may be so bold, with MysticBore's permission, as to make a prediction. I foresee the resolution of the slavery plot line including Lynda giving a permanent home to Blake.

That would be lovely! The 🔮 thoroughly approves.

Just in case anybody missed it yesterday: www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000qjcs With Great Pleasure at Christmas: A festive celebration to mark seventy years of The Archers, with readings, music and anecdotes from members of the cast.

A slightly belated Happy Christmas to one and all and huge thanks to Gaspode for going above and beyond the call of duty with a new thread on Christmas Day. I must confess I found the whole denouement a total anticlimax - I thought Kirsty cottoned on far too quickly (many of us failed to fully take on board what was actually happening even though we’d had antennae twitching and were privy to hints and evidence of dodgy dealing for many months). Kirsty’s speedy assessment and conclusion didn’t tally with someone who’d had the wool pulled over her eyes for so long. The truth was so far removed from what she had been imagining - that he might be having an affair - yet he had no sooner offered his explanation than she was calling the police and leaving it to him to make his own confession. I’m wondering now why it was important to the SWs for them to be married before she learned the truth.

I’m wondering now why it was important to the SWs for them to be married before she learned the truth.

Oh my goodness ... But Philip didn't expect to be prosecuted at any stage, so would be really have ... Is that why he - ?

Nooooooo ... Surely not? Please not. The SWs are rubbish at legal stuff.

Heavens!

Kirsty’s speedy assessment and conclusion didn’t tally with someone who’d had the wool pulled over her eyes for so long

I found that too speedy. I was hoping that it wouldn't require months of torturing Kirsty a la Rob but that was so sudden it seemed unrealistic.

I was wondering what evidence the police actually have. If they have books showing payments and the lads themselves are not able to say otherwise then what actual evidence do the police have?

Kirsty doesn't know Victoria or even the full names of the lads working for Philip. He on the other hand has a card from them saying how great he was. Is that going to be the long story - pulling together actual evidence to make the case?

Gav will have to sing like a canary to wrap this up anytime soon.

I don't think the SWs are up to going through with the 'knowledge trail' for a court case. Even if Philip is daft enough to just have one phone/laptop, the elusive Victoria will be a bit smarter. Gavin doesn't have enough brain cells to help the police/CPS, even if he wanted to.

I predict that Philip will do a runner (though he can't go too far in Covid world).

I worry about my google algorithms after 24 months of researching surrogate births/slave trading/sexual abuse and alcoholism.

What a humdinger of an episode!

I listened to it in bed this morning, in the presence of DH (not usually a listener), who was then full of questions afterwards about the story line.

Phew! thanks for the just-in-time new thread, Gasp0de.

PoulePouletteEternellement
"I’m wondering now why it was important to the SWs for them to be married before she learned the truth."

Oh my goodness ... But Philip didn't expect to be prosecuted at any stage, so would be really have ... Is that why he - ?

I think married women cannot be compelled to give evidence against their husbands, but if they were not allowed to there would be no cases of domestic abuse ever brought to court.

At one time wives could not give evidence against their husbands. That was the whole plot of Brighton Rock. I think that ended in the 60s.

There are exceptions, but on the whole they cannot be compelled, apparently: www.inbrief.co.uk/court-proceedings/witness-at-criminal-trials/

The bit I was looking at says
"The accused’s spouse or civil partner can only be compelled to give evidence against them on the prosecution’s behalf if the offence the accused is being tried for:
"involves an assault or threat of injury to the spouse;
"involves an assault on or threat of injury to an individual under the age of 16;
"is a sexual offence on an individual under the age of 16;
"involves attempting or conspiring to commit or of assisting, instructing, appropriating or encouraging the commission of any of the aforementioned offences.

"If the accused is not being charged in relation to any of the above circumstances, the accused’s spouse or civil partner is only compellable to give evidence on behalf of the accused and not against them."

Not sure Kirsty would need to be compelled would she? She sounded pretty against him the other night and I think would give evidence willingly, such as she knows. I suspect if it gets to court the CPS will have uncovered enough evidence to make Kirsty completed disgusted with her husband. (Unless compulsion has different meaning in law and it means she cannot give evidence against him except in the above circs)

I was wondering whether the plot with Philip/Kirsty/horses would follow a redemption theme?

Just got that sense when he came out to face the police & said "I'm the man you're looking for..."

I think Phillip will blame Gavin. Or at least throw as much as possible his way. I think his MO had been to always paint himself as an honest bloke who’s trying to help/ dogooder. I think he’ll say that he thought they were friends of Gavin and that he thought Gavin was paying them. I think he will say he had no idea as he only saw the cooked books.
Gavin also bought the petrol.
I hope Kirsty and Roy finally get together after this shit show!

Thanks to @MumsnetHQ for editing the title to the right number, and to Asking for suggesting I could ask them. That's much better.

@Madcats

I don't think the SWs are up to going through with the 'knowledge trail' for a court case. Even if Philip is daft enough to just have one phone/laptop, the elusive Victoria will be a bit smarter. Gavin doesn't have enough brain cells to help the police/CPS, even if he wanted to.

I predict that Philip will do a runner (though he can't go too far in Covid world).

I worry about my google algorithms after 24 months of researching surrogate births/slave trading/sexual abuse and alcoholism.

I have to say that for once , the SW have done a pretty good job with this storyline.

What remains to be seen is how realistic and investigation , charge & conviction is.

I work as an investigator on a dedicated modern slavery team. Identifying victims is far from the hardest part. Achieving a successful prosecution with traumatised, coerced victims who will forever live in fear of reprisals (both real and imagined) is by far the hardest part.

One thing they have got completely spot on though. The nationality of the slaves. Whilst labour exploitation of Eastern European's is hugely prevalent- by far the greatest number of victims are indigenous British males. Usually homeless, vulnerable with substance abuse problems and/or learning difficulties .

They usually do research storyline like this very well and it's all really good until the last bit, where it's clearly the end of that storyline and it gets wrapped up very quickly.

Welcome to the threads, @Trickyboy ! Are you an Archers fan or did you come by to offer your expertise? It's great to have someone with specialist knowledge chip in.

Is Phillip at all repentant and willing to change for Kirsty's sake? Will he simply sit down with the police and lay it all out honestly?

Yes, to the regulars here, it's been a long time since I posted , but I caught most of the film this morning and thought it worth popping by. As an aside, this thread will see someone make the

120,000th post

since these threads started nearly 8 years ago.

GoodbyePorpoiseSpit
I think Phillip will blame Gavin. Or at least throw as much as possible his way.

Philip made a good start in that direction when he told Kirsty that it began because Gavin saw one of his ex-apprentices on the streets and begged him to take the lad back -- only he couldn't afford to, so he got whichever of them it was to work for board and lodging but no pay until things got better.

I did not believe that for one solitary instant (if it were true how would he know Victoria?) but as a way to tell Kirsty he wqas not doing something awful and anyway it was Gavin's idea, full marks Philip, she might have given you a bit of credit there.

Hello again DadDadDad! Happy St John the Evangelist's Day, and a Merry New Year!

Less unusually, people whose partner has been unfaithful often seem to cite the lack of honesty as much worse than the actual infidelity, because it leaves them doubting everything. It leaves them doubting their own memories, their own understanding of the world. It's devastating.

And there's the added s[ice pf being made a fool of -which Kirsty will be feeling in spades/

AS PP said, the fact that she has been doing the fake bookkeeping is going to see her implicated.

And so recently demonstrating her partnership with Philip by marrying him isn't going to help her either.