🧚‍♀️ Archers thread #120: Magic time. Dialogue! Good Fairy Lilian made Lynda’s wish come true. Will Phil vanish in a puff of smoke? Join the Magic Circle in Alice’s shed, where time is never called!

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you think we should hear more about the Naughty Milkman, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3853783--The-Archers-spoilers-thread-5-Cant-wait-for-7-02pm-Join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @Roysnewshirt for the excellent title suggestion, which I tweaked a bit.

I wonder how much dialogue we're going to get in the coming weeks. They're back to normal recording, I believe, albeit socially distanced. Also, when will we get our Friday and Sunday episodes back? I know I'm not the only regular to miss TA a lot more on Friday than on Sunday. The Sunday episode is still an incomer, of course, having only been introduced some 20 years ago, of course.

(My parents retired to a village and some features of Ambridge life are very familiar from their experience, the 'incomer' label being one.)

Which university???

Felpersham?

Is Alice on MN?!

I'll confess to not having listened much during the moanalogues, but did Ben ever decide which university to go to? I had a feeling that he might have applied to somewhere currently in lockdown. Presumably he is at Felpersham (though I'll forgive his underachieving because I like his character).

I'm still not sure when Alice realised that she was pregnant and why she wouldn't have been read the "riot act" by A&E.

It did seem to be Felpersham Uni. I don't suppose it matters while everything is virtual, but he should escape!

I thought Newcastle had been an option, in which case staying in Ambridge makes sense!

I've not listened this week as the aeriel on my tv has malfunctioned and my radio is over 100 miles away. I usually switch to channel (9) 704 after Wheeler Dealers on Quest.

not because I thought Jill wouldn't have many years left. I had a great aunt who greeted any present with "ooh - that will see me out".

I'm still not sure when Alice realised that she was pregnant and why she wouldn't have been read the "riot act" by A&E. She probably was. Pity we weren't there to hear it.

Jill expected Ben to go into university and talk to one of his tutors, so I'd say it must be Felpersham.

At which pillar of academic excellence people are liable to exclaim, "Oh God, not another bloody Archer," I should think.

Why was Chris at Alice's booking in appt and answering the questions for her?
Every midwife I dealt with was very clear about booking in appts being with the mother and any lurking fathers had to wait outside precisely because women are often less inclined to share worries or risks if the father is there. Is this really different now?

Bit harder to exclude the father when the appointment is online, at home. The midwife can't exert any authority over the space.

She can't force him out but I recall being told when arranging appts that the booking in was for the woman and men were welcome at some of the subsequent appts if they wished. She could have asked him to let her chat to Alice for a bit first/later after all it is the session where midwives look for early warning signs of abuse/control and ask a lot of personal questions.

I just wondered if this has become normal and how it sits with confidentiality and reliable information.

I was last pregnant in 2006 (sadly miscarried) and the midwife came to my home for the booking in appointment. DH was at work, but I don't remember if they'd asked me if he would be there, when I booked the appointment.

I wish the MW had asked to speak to Alice on her own. Chris was really making me angry, answering the questions, and dismissing what the midwife was saying. Again, he was also not listening to Alice when she said she didn't want to even have the occasional drink. You'd have thought after all his longing to have a family, he'd not want even the tiniest risk to this baby.

I hope Alice leaves him, I'd certainly tell her to LTB if she came on AIBU.

I'm pretty sure Ben decided on Felpersham in the end.

I remember a monologue where Ben was swithering between offers. If there was a definite decision announced I must have missed it.

It's weird that they've given Chris this strange tic - that I never noticed in the previous nine years of their marriage; getting angry if anyone says anything to Alice that he doesn't like. But (sort of) pretending he's being fiercely protective towards her. Wasn't he threatening the hospital with dire consequences for "frightening" her, a couple of weeks ago? And now the midwife. And a few months ago squaring up to ... Adam? Harrison? - I forget - but someone who voiced an opinion he didn't want "moi wife" exposed to. It's not an attractive trait.

Chris is a nitwit. There are so many red flags around Alice it's like the Village Fete, but he can't see anything.

Ben must be at Felpersham, but I don't remember anybody ever mentioning the decision process. It makes total sense, though. The university experience will be nothing like normal this year, anywhere. Ben could have deferred for a year and worked on the farm, if they could find the money to pay him, I suppose, but nobody knows what things will be like next year. Ben appears to have made the decision to go to Felphersham and not bother about living away from home this year, as almost everything is online anyway. He'll save a lot of money and be less socially isolated than many students stuck in a flat or hall with a group of near-strangers in quarantine.

Hasnt Chris always behaved like that with Alice, I feel as if I can remember it happening on a few occasions but I may be dreaming. Or I may be letting my dislike of chris influence me.

Motoko, I'm sorry to hear that.

It's not far off 30 years since I was having antenatal appointments . I don't think my husband came to a single one. As far as I can recall, that wasn't unusual at all back then. He did come to the 20 week scan, which was the first one in those days, and he was there for the births (and we went to NCT classes together). Fortunately it was before the days when partners were allowed to stay on postnatal wards. I'd have been fine with having him there but would have hated having other people's partners there all the time while I was dealing with all the post-birth messy stuff and trying to get going with breastfeeding. I found the postnatal ward uncomfortable enough - noisy, overheated, none of the comforts of home.

I've got ahead of myself here, though. If Alice makes it to the end of this pregnancy I'll eat my hat. I think she's either going to have a termination and tell Chris it was a miscarriage, or she will miscarry.

Chris was really making me angry, answering the questions, and dismissing what the midwife was saying

Me too and its that kind of taking over the appointment which was why midwives (in my day!) didn't want partners at the first appts.

It's not far off 30 years since I was having antenatal appointments shock. I don't think my husband came to a single one

That is how I remember it. Fathers came to the 18/20 week scan which for most women was the first scan.

The woman is the patient not the man. Does Chris also expect to attend his wife's appointments for smear tests, piles, contraceptive advice or earache? I just cannot see how its a good thing to have men routinely taking over women's antenatal appts other than to stop women making effective use of their midwife.

Hasnt Chris always behaved like that with Alice, I feel as if I can remember it happening on a few occasions but I may be dreaming. Or I may be letting my dislike of chris influence me.

He has but much in the same way that Will and Ed are casually misogynistic - they just take it for granted that the women in their lives will do the "wife work" and bend their lives around the mens wishes. If anything I had thought Chris was less bad in this respect.

However he is at best a self centred idiot at the moment and the "taking care of" is definitely a bit red flaggy. However after Helen I would think they would steer clear of that storyline for a while.

Jill expected Ben to go into university and talk to one of his tutors, so I'd say it must be Felpersham

I assumed that too. Alice and Phoebe both went to real universities, not sure why the Dopeys have to go to Felpersham tech, especially if doing a generic subject rather than agriculture.

@C8H10N4O2

She can't force him out but I recall being told when arranging appts that the booking in was for the woman and men were welcome at some of the subsequent appts if they wished. She could have asked him to let her chat to Alice for a bit first/later after all it is the session where midwives look for early warning signs of abuse/control and ask a lot of personal questions.

I just wondered if this has become normal and how it sits with confidentiality and reliable information.

The problem with that is that she presumably couldn't necessarily be certain that the partner was out of earshot, so she couldn't assume that Alice was free to talk. It must be quite a problem at the moment and I fear that the removal of this safeguard is yet another of the indirect consequences of the virus that people don't think about.

Yes. I've read on MN of a very good scheme where a woman attending an antenatal appointment can put a sticker on her notes in a particular place (or something like that) to indicate she needs to see a midwife on her own. There are posters in the women's toilets explaining this, I think. None of that possible at the moment, of course.

It must be quite a problem at the moment and I fear that the removal of this safeguard is yet another of the indirect consequences of the virus that people don't think about

And another way in which women in particular are negatively affected by the virus.

I haven't caught up on the last week yet but I'm place marking as I lost you

not sure why the Dopeys have to go to Felpersham tech, especially if doing a generic subject rather than agriculture.
Maybe Ben has to go to Felpersham because "Geography & Politics" isn't that generic, it's not offered at many places. The only other local University that I can see doing it is Warwick and Ben doesn't strike me as AAA calibre. There again, Phoebe never struck me as Oxbridge calibre either.