Thread #106: Jim’s in a jam, Peggy’s made a pickle and Lexi is blooming - sounds like the entries are lining up for this year’s flower and produce show, but who will be on the organising committee?

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads and @DadDadDad for being our resident statistician and keeping the ball rolling when Pseudo stepped back a bit.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like to be Susan's best friend or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3439443-keep-it-to-yourself-the-archers-spoilers-thread-4, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to LillianGish for the title of this thread.

Holding episode tonight, I thought - not much progress on any current storyline. I was a touch surprised Natasha wasn't offended by the postnup idea but I suspect she's biding her time.

I reckon ben is more like David and josh is more like Kenton.

Goodness! I’d have said the exact opposite. Josh is calm, capable, single minded with not much imagination or empathy outside his specialist subject. Ben is the wry, free spirited explorer. Though I get the feeling he’s considerably cleverer than his uncle - cleverer than most of them in fact.

5000 But Harold in his 90s and could well have lost the majority of his marbles. DM is 91 and she 'forgets' a number of unpleasant occurences in her youth. Though also remembering that she nearly lost me under bus at age 2 (something she had never told me before now)

But Harold in his 90s and could well have lost the majority of his marbles. DM is 91 and she 'forgets' a number of unpleasant occurences in her youth. My DF was 92 when he died was as sharp as a tack and used to remember and talk about incidents in his youth that he'd never mentioned before. It doesn't always work that way.

The scenario of the abuser blithely turning up in the life of the survivor of the abuse, as though nothing had happened, is not an uncommon one. I have seen cases where the abuse has been disclosed, even prosecuted, and years later the abuser is just carrying on as if nothing happened, turns up in the life of the survivor, and other people enable this (obviously this is most commonly in intra-familial abuse, where the abuser continues to be part of the family and people pretend it all never happened to the extent that the survivor has to endure family gatherings where the abuser is treated completely normally). It is not usually that the abuser has forgotten, or that others have, it is that they have normalised the abuse (or, in some cases, blamed the survivor). Very good of TA to be highlighting the issue of historical CSA and to be doing it so well. (Nice contrast/riposte to something Boris Johnson said the other day about the "wasting" (he didn't use that word but something far coarser) of money on investigating historical abuse).

Waaaaaahh. It was tears at bedtime from me (I listen to the podcast in bed to send me off ...)

How old is Jim?

Of course it doesn't but I look after her in warden assisted flats. I suppose out of 40 or so, there are approx. 8 or 9 residents (including some a lot younger) who have ALL their marbles.

Ref. Josh and Ben, perhaps Josh looses his 'business brain' where his bother is concerned. They're interesting characters.

CaptainMyCaptain the less my octogenarian relative remembers of a conversation ten minutes ago, the more they remember never before mentioned incidents from their own childhood. It’s at once frustrating and weirdly delightful.

Sorry this thread is busy! The above post was to Captain.

First Harold got away with it - and has done for most of his life it seems. So he probably feels pretty invincible.
Someone I know was abused by one of his lecturers and later supervisor at University. Got away from him and then the guy turns up having got a job at the same University. A lot of people knew but nothing was said, it was just painful.

Second, I really wonder if Ben is going to be gay, the conversation with Josh could easily fit that. Maybe Ben is more interested in Tiggy's brother? The Brookfield lot really lack any emotional intelligence (Elizabeth and Jennifer seem far more open by contrast).

Bert pay attention at the back there! Jim's age has been quite a topic of discussion over the last couple of weeks, because it hasn't been mentioned, (that we know of) on TA, and the general consensus is around 80-85.

Yes- I know it has- I was wondering whether any conclusion had been reached. Because I think he’s younger than that- for no good reason whatsoever!

Just caught up ‘I was his favourite’ - textbook. Absolutely. Great acting.

And the talk of Joe. I think he will die in his sleep at Grange Farm as suggested threads and threads ago.

No, no firm conclusion on Jim's age.

Do we know if the Joe actor (can’t remember his name, sorry...) was ill? Did the sws know to be planning his demise? All that talk of the chair seemed a bit ominous...

Well that was traumatic last night. Just at the critical moment my train went into a tunnel and I then I had to wait for it to finish so that I could listen on iplayer!

If Harold was a "young man" at the time I'd assume at least 15/16 so at least 8 yrs older than Jim. If Jim is 85 that would make Harold early 90s. I can't see Jim being 80 if Fiona is older than Alastair - she must be pushing 60 if not more.

90+ yr old who can play the piano all evening and well is quite a novelty.

I agree with PP - I've known of abusers making their victims lives miserable by rocking up to family occasions and acting as if nothing had happened. At least one whose victim I knew took pleasure in that power dynamic.

I was wondering also if this is going to turn into a public information for the support available for older victims who have never been able to talk about their experience but whose lives have been turned upside down.

pasbeaucoup - Ted Kelsey was suffering from ill-health the last time he went to record "The Archers", and he died two months ago now. I believe episodes are recorded 6 weeks ahead of their broadcast, so I should imagine the recent mentions of Joe are foreshadowing his death quite soon.

I’m really impressed TA are featuring a child sexual abuse storyline. Any victims/survivors who are listening may wish to visit
www.truthproject.org.uk

Alistair is 56, assuming his sister is a couple of years older then Jim could be as young as 80.

I didn’t listen until late last night as out with friends - I had a constant stream of texts from my Dad asking if I’d listened yet. Brilliant acting, but I think it is going to be an emotional few months - I really hope Jazzer doesn’t do anything stupid.

Jim can't possibly be under 80, surely, because Alistair is 57 in September. If Fiona's the older sibling I'm even more certain that Jim's well into his 80s.

Having spent a few minutes on Wikipedia and thus having become an expert on National Service , I'd say Jim must have done a two-year stint in one of the armed services, probably before he went to university, so he would only have graduated from his first degree at 23 or 24, depending on the length of his course.

Only if Jim's date of birth is after 1 October 1939 (unlikely, surely, because then he could be 79 at most now and would have been 22 or younger when Alistair was born) could he have avoided National Service altogether - unless he was a conscientious objector, in which case I think we'd have heard him say as much, or worked in an essential industry, viz, farming, coalmining or the merchant navy.

I decided not to listen to this one over breakfast with my dc based on the description on iPlayer. Very moving indeed and good that Jim insisted Jazzer stay as well, that means Alastair has someone to talk to.

I've been struggling to find any actual evidence about ages.

Jim had already retired when he turned up in Ambridge with his broken leg in December 2007, which would mean he must have been at least 65 in that year.

I am fairly sure that Alistair and/or Shula mentioned that this year's was a "significant" birthday.

It can't have been 75 if he was 65 by 2007, so I think it must have been 80, unless it was 85. If Jim is 80 and was 8 when the abuse started, that would have been in 1947; if he is 85 it would have been in 1942.

From the other end: Harold was a "young man" not an "older boy" in Jim's account, and "a role model/father figure". I'd say he must have been 18 or over. Could he have been in the forces/doing war work during the war, perhaps, or just after it? That would make him over 18. Or was he waiting to do his national service and younger than 18? If he was doing a degree or an apprenticeship, his national service would have been deferred until he was 21: I think it generally was for a reason like that, so he could have been between 18 and 21 and not yet have left home.

If Jim was 85 this year, wheel-chair using Harold must be quite an age to be going to a birthday party being given for someone he hasn't seen for decades and who is living a long way away. How did the neighbour who brought him know both him and Jim? I can't believe that Jim and his family never moved house, and neighbours from Jim's childhood would be Jim's age or over, I would have thought. I don't think Jim would have kept in touch with people who knew his abuser: he'd have wanted to forget about it, and they would remind him just by existing.

It all doesn't make sense.

But gosh wasn't John Rowe powerful! Acting his socks off and doing a wonderful job.

Heavens Asking! I feel I should pass on to you the boop I received from D3 - you are far more deserving.

(You should probably go and have a nice lie down now.)

Jim could have taken early retirement, which could knock his age back by 5 years in 2007?