Fast falls the eventide for Joe Grundy, the darkness deepens for Ed - will he be fenced in or is there still time for acts of pennants? Abide with us and discuss The Archers, thread #104!

[GabrielleNelson]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads and @DadDadDad for being our resident statistician and keeping the ball rolling when Pseudo stepped back a bit and more recently when someone forgot they had promised to start the next thread, ahem.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like to be Susan's best friend or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from this thread, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks also to LillianGish for the splendid thread title. As actor Edward Kelsey died last month, we have probably heard Joe Grundy for the last time, or will do very shortly. RIP Mr Kelsey; many thanks for creating a wonderfully vivid character, gnarly toenails and all.

As pointed out on the last thread, we're getting very close now to the 100th birthday of June Spencer, who plays Peggy Woolley. What an achievement! I hope the team manage to squeeze Peggy into that day's episode, come what may.

What I’d like to know - if any farmers amongst us care to share - is whether the portrayal of farming life as a relentless pursuit of The Next Big Thing is accurate or not. (I used to have more involvement with rl farmers and don’t remember such constant turbulence.)

I wondered because I find it hard to sympathise with the Brookfield clan. They seem to piss all their money away chopping and changing their processes and technology every other day - then throwing it all out and starting again. (I’d like a breakdown of the profit generated from the quarter of a million Ruth inherited from her mother.) It’s really hard to tell whether all this upheaval is realistic or simply the result of 97 editors over the course of a week.

whether the portrayal of farming life as a relentless pursuit of The Next Big Thing is accurate or not

This strikes a chord we me too. Whilst the farming side of my lot do try to look ahead and plan for possible new ventures mostly its small adaptations in the short term with long and careful thought before bigger investments (which is pretty much how Adam and Brian approach things, and even how PatnTony approach things in practice).

Not sure what wider experience shows.

(I’d like a breakdown of the profit generated from the quarter of a million Ruth inherited from her mother.)

RuthnDavid didn't just inherited Brookfield, they gained a sizeable inheritance from Ruth's family (although considering Solly was a bog roll king and property owner it was less than I'd expected). And yet not that many years later they are desperate for the 16k(?) outstanding on Kenton's loan.

I appreciate he is grieving but it seems as if Will only accepts help if its on his terms. This is it in a nutshell. I thought Poppy had literally been the death of Joe last night (the problem with the actor already being dead is we are all expecting it so the fact that he was still alive was rather more of a surprise than if he had not been). Will’s childcare requirements last night though were a good illustration that what he really needs is live in help - or at any rate someone he can call on day or night 365 days of the year rather than the more usual fixed hours child minding/wrap around school hours that would be enough for a job with regular hours. The trouble is no one in Ambridge has such childcare (in fact does anyone have any childcare at all outside families doing favours?) so he has no role model. In fact Clarrie’s suggestion was to ask Bev to help - there’s still no suggestion he might have to pay someone to do the job.

And yet not that many years later they are desperate for the 16k(?) outstanding on Kenton's loan. I got the impression it was more a point of principle from Dave than them actually being strapped for cash.

C8 I agree about Emma's attitude to Will IMO it wasn't spiteful, she was exasperated with him, she had made it plain to him on Monday that she could only look after Pops that evening.

I do wish that Ed would get a backbone and tell boring, stupid Emm that if he gets caught doing the 'work' with Tim , not only will they poss. lose the house he could end up in prison.

“In fact Clarrie’s suggestion was to ask Bev to help - there’s still no suggestion he might have to pay someone to do the job“

I don’t think paid live in help would cross Clarrie’s mind- it’s so outside her experience.
Odd that Bev has been so absent. Wouldn’t you be doing all you could for your daughter’s children in her circumstances?

I agree it was primarily a point of principle. Also if the 250k was invested in the new milking parlour for example it isn’t available to pay increases in feed costs.
It was lovely to hear Joe again last night.

the problem with the actor already being dead

Oh...I'd not heard that. now I understand the thread title.
I suppose Joe's SOTMC will have to be somewhat similar to Phil's, perhaps on the eve of their departure from Grange Farm. Although not with The Dream of Gerontius playing.

Belated thanks , asking, for the details of Kenton's misdemeanours.

Jill was ridiculous last night with her mediating between David and Kenton. I was fully expecting her to say "if you don't sort this out then you are both going to bed with no supper".
It would have served her right if the pair of them had turned on her and redirected their anger at her.

Yes Bert It's Will's paranoia, he's frightened of having Bev. remove Poppy. In the circs. I'd be unsure of facing up to Will too.

I don’t think paid live in help would cross Clarrie’s mind- it’s so outside her experience. not to mention outside the experience of anyone in Ambridge, but I think with a job like Will’s he needs more than an ad hoc arrangement. Anyway it looks like lack of childcare is going to precipitate the next dramatic crisis for the Grundies.

“Jill was ridiculous last night with her mediating between David and Kenton. I was fully expecting her to say "if you don't sort this out then you are both going to bed with no supper".”

Mind you, the way they’ve been behaving I’d have been tempted to say that too!

Errol where have you been hiding? !!! The CA talked about it last night.

Belated thanks for 'Aunty Cardboard and Kristiffur' as I've just snorted my cornflakes laughing

I think with a job like Will’s he needs more than an ad hoc arrangement.
A woman wouldn't be thinking how she could fit the DC round the job. She'd find a job that fitted round the DC and have cast iron back-up plans.
Will needs to give up the game-keeping.

Or he needs to arrange game keeping in a way that suits his circumstances. He has sacked his assistant thus ensuring he has no one to call on to swap shifts etc. Also it has been hinted a number of times that some of the work he is doing is unnecessary. There was definitely a conversation with someone recently, possibly Eddie?, and they expressed suprise that Will has thought to carry out a particular extra task and said they hoped Martin Gibson would be impressed.

“Or he needs to arrange game keeping in a way that suits his circumstances.”

I don’t think he can. He needs to be on call. So live in childcare is the only answer.
Extraordinary that nobody in the family noticed that Mia was doing that at 12. I wonder if he even told her he was going out or whether he just left them asleep.

A woman wouldn't be thinking how she could fit the DC round the job. She'd find a job that fitted round the DC and have cast iron back-up plans. Precisely. A large part of Will’s problem is the nature of his job - it is more complicated than just getting Poppy in a breakfast and after school club with possibly someone to pick her up and hang onto her until he gets in from work. His hours are much more irregular than that. His domestic incompetence is another matter, but even if he could transform himself into a domestic god his random working hours would present a problem.

So essentially, to maintain any simulacrum of a family life and household, William will be looking for a third wife pdq?

Are there any likely candidates or will they be fresh blood?

They would have to be fresh blood. Who, knowing his character and his history, would touch Will with a barge pole.

I shall be cross if he does find a third Mrs Grundy. If he can't find the time to look after Poppy then he can't have the time to go looking for a wife either.

Errol where have you been hiding? !!! The CA talked about it last night.

The Outer Hebrides. for the end of April/start of May, then was so behind with TA that I didn't catch up till a massive ironing-and-podcast session at the weekend.

As to the CA - I've mentioned before, it'd be brilliant if those who listen in real time could convey gems and info for the benefit of people using podcasts. please?

I reckon Bev will get wind of what's going on with Will and Poppy and get custody of her. Will then becomes bitter gamekeeper glowering at everyone forever after.

Or, here's a thought for partner #3 (not wife, I think) - Tracy Horrobin. She wouldn't stand for his nonsense.

Someone mentioned her getting some great lines - there's another one I liked but googling to see if it was a new coining I found this, I'm sad to find I probably shouldn't adopt it

Wetter than an otters pocket - 'As used by the deliciously naive BBC Breakfast weather presenter Carol Kirkwood this week. Apparently sent in by a helpful viewer to explain the weather oop north (as opposed to down south!)'

I quite enjoyed Jill treating Kenton and David as little boys last night, given that that was the way they were behaving. It was probably the only approach that would have sorted things out.

Didn't Will sack Pete because he thought he was muscling in a bit too much. I think Pete picked up the slack quite a bit, he may have been doing the overnight checks for the past year! My friend's husband is a gamekeeper. He sleeps on the sofa most nights at the moment because he has to go and check the pheasant chicks regularly throughout the night. And he's in a team of 3/4 keepers. It's a 24/7 job and just not possible with one keeper. If Brian was still chair of BL Will wouldn't have been able to talk him into getting rid of Pete. Martyn Gibson is clueless and only cares about saving money.