The Archers - Freddie is getting OUT: will Russ hop it? Helen is falling DOWN: is Lee still in the frame? Tom is heading UP: will Natasha be the boost his sausage needs? (Thread no. 101

[DadDadDad]

We're still here and still discussing TA (The Archers). We welcome newcomers and old hands, so if you have a question or a point of view, please dive in. No spoilers - if you've seen info on future storylines, there's a separate Radio Addicts thread for that.

I loved all the name changes on the last thread. Don't forget to change back! (If you want to).

Who's going to get Russ out of LL? Freddie? Lily? Elizabeth? Or is it Freddie who will head off?

I haven’t listened yet but will be a shock when Elizabeth realises that Freddie coming home hasn’t cured her depression

I thought his atheism was serious.

Of course it's serious, he's a teenager

Jakob. Fucking hell. I'd like to hear him with a client.

They are pre-moderating comments on that Guardian article. How odd!

“Of course it's serious, he's a teenager ”

That’s not very fair. Teenagers are allowed to have principles.

Ah yes, Jakob. He seems friendly. Not. And no "Thanks for the thought, but I don't eat cake". He's like an android.

I feel for Lily. She pretty much ran LL, as well as looking after Elizabeth, yet all Freddie has to do, is come out of prison, and he gets taken out to bowling, pizza and clothes shopping. And Elizabeth probably wouldn't notice if Lily left.

And what's with Tom insisting he told Jazzer about the rotation changes? I don't think it's that Jazzer didn't remember.

Of course they are, Bert. I'm poking fun, but one of the many refreshing things about teenagers is their principles.

In my experience people often hold their principles a little more lightly as they go through life, although there is plenty of evidence on this thread to suggest that isn't always the case.

I think the christening example is interesting. If you don't believe in god then you might consider taking part in a christening to be of no more consequence than attending a wedding or funeral in a church. It has social meaning beyond the words the vicar says.

The whole Alistair job situation is ridiculous, nobody behaves like Jakob on their first day just as nobody sells their business and becomes an employee without looking into the expectations of the firm they will be working for.

To be fair, Alistair has been self employed for so long (forever?) he probably had no idea about objectives and appraisals and the like. It's not something you'd think to ask about if you weren't used to that kind of system. I can imagine from the conversations that we've heard, that he thought they did have a shared understanding of expectations.

*We actually didn't go to DH's granddaughter's christening because we thought it was totally hypocritical as neither parent or any of the god parents believed in God and it was more about a "look at me"

That makes you sound awfully judgemental and unpleasant. I hope your step family has been more understanding towards you.*

Or maybe it makes them honest in sticking to their principles. I detest baptisms where it's obviously merely a social box to tick before a booze up. Why bother? It's on a par with those who want to marry in church because the church looks nice in the pictures.

I’ve turned down being a godmother twice because of the public promises I would have to make that I couldn’t keep. It made me very sad both times.

Why get het up about the Church welcoming children?

And who knows if the parents or other christening guests might be affected by being in the church or listening to the priest's words. It might lead them to Christ at some point.

The Church is for everyone, not just the sanctimonious.

“Why get het up about the Church welcoming children? “

It can welcome children all it wants- just not the children of non Christian parents! Said children can make their own minds up about joining the club when they are old enough to do it. It was outrageous the way Robin, Toby and Alan bullied Pip into going along with it.

I just looked up the promises, not having been to a christening since I was three, when my fervently atheist dad was becoming godfather to the child of family friends. I must ask him about it.

The promises are quite explicit, aren't they? I still think I might be inclined to interpret them somewhat more metaphorically, if I were asked (hypothetical, as I wasn't christened myself).

The history is interesting though: www.britannica.com/topic/godparent

The important thing about the book Custard, Culverts and Cake: Academics on life in "The Archers" edited by Cara Courage and Nicola Headlam (taken so seriously in the Guardian, the Telegraph and the Daily Mail! though I think the last two did bother to say it is a new book and Zoe Williams didn't as far as I can see) is that it is a spoof. It's made up of papers from last years "Academic Archers Conference", published just in time for this year's in Sheffield, and that's a pretty tongue-in-cheek event full of people who have written "serious" "academic" papers about frankly silly aspects of the programme.

They are as infested in it as anyone here, but -- well, Christine Michael of the Ambridge Observer is giving a paper this year. That's the flavour.

Jakob must be the first ever character in The Archers to profess a dislike of cake. He won’t last long in Ambridge. There must be an Academic Archers paper on the significance and symbolism of cake in The Archers - its baking, consumption and the different types on offer. In rejecting cake, Jakob is surely rejecting all that Ambridge stands for - no wonder he plans to carry on living in Felpersham.

It can welcome children all it wants- just not the children of non Christian parents!

Think Jesus might disagree with you, Bert!

Why get het up about the Church welcoming children?

Is anyone getting "het up". A few posters have said Ben acted properly in declining to be a god parent.

And who knows if the parents or other christening guests might be affected by being in the church or listening to the priest's words. It might lead them to Christ at some point

Well it hasn't happened to me and I'm almost 60. I don't have a problem attending christening, weddings and funerals but it would be utter hypocrisy for me to make baptismal vows as a god parent.

The Church is for everyone, not just the sanctimonious it isn't really if one simply has no faith or religious belief.

Umm and as a Christian I didn't have my children Christened even though we were going to a C of E Church at the time. Because I have theological issues with the practice. I've been to a lot though! (And one DC has been Christened and Confirmed, when they choose to.)

“Think Jesus might disagree with you, Bert!”

I rather think Jesus wouldn’t be at all happy with one of his priests colluding with bullying a parent into taking part in a ceremony that she sfisn’t want to. He was quite hot on hipocricy and whited sepulchres and overt displays of religiosity.

Is anyone getting "het up". A few posters have said Ben acted properly in declining to be a god parent

I was addressing posters discussing RL baptisms - not Archers.

Well it hasn't happened to me and I'm almost 60

Well, it might happen to someone else. They might be filled with the Holy Spirit whilst watching a baby be christened!

“Well, it might happen to someone else. They might be filled with the Holy Spirit whilst watching a baby be christened!”

April Fools have to be done before midday.

The purpose of christianity is to spread the message of Christ as Saviour. Many people come to Christ at a church service. I'm not a believer but it's no April fool prank to suggest that it happens.

Maybe Pip will be filled with the holy spirit and feel called to missionary work a long way away.

Of course it's serious, he's a teenager

I was an atheist at his age. Like all my siblings, having been brought up RC. It's an error to discount view purely on the basis of age.

Like Bertrand I've turned down requests to be a godmother. I don't think in either case the person asking was a hypocrite, but I would have been by agreeing to it.

I’m not discounting his views, just possibly the passion with which they might be held, but apparently I’m the only one who has experienced that phenomenon with teenagers, including my teenage self! I was also an atheist at that age and remain one, but I was brought up with no religion at all.