The Archers #96: Is that a rat I smell or the whiff of Snell? In Chaucer’s famous Tale of Two Torsos, Brian’s ‘still got it’ and Poldark is searching for scything opportunities in Susan’s kitchen.

[NotdeadyetBOING]

Welcome..... I'd concocted a longer title with all sorts of references to bitch stitching and pasta bakes, but was thwarted by the pesky character limit

Do you think Lily was (a) shrewd enough to realise that Lizzie's restaurant explanation was a lie to save face, and (b) empathetic enough not to challenge the explanation as she knows her mother is barely coping?

Probably both Dad she's no fool; hopefully she'll try to get a doctor to have a look at her.

I don't think Lizzie forgetting to book a restaurant is a sign of a breakdown.

Could just be the menopause, no?

Have we had a menopause storyline in the Archers?

Although, combined with her other behaviours, agoraphobia is looking like a possibility.

daddaddad both, I think

Good point about Lizzie developing agoraphobia. It certainly looks that way. I've always had a bit of a soft spot for her, but hating the way she is treating Glen (and Geraldine before him), breakdown or no breakdown.

Natasha is competing with Hannah for the title of most loathsome newcomer.

She needs Doc Locke!

Lily would have done the same thing if it had been Joe Grundy she had bumped into!

I wonder what's going to happen tonight, when she's calmed down?

I think we can safely assume she would not be sleeping
with Joe Grundy had she met him instead of Russ on her return.

Good bit of plotting on part of writers. Elizabeth Archer, you should be ashamed of yourself.

PatNTony are going to have a meltdown if Tom abandons the Christmas tree decs for Natasha, no?

Yes, we have had a menopause story, but I can't for the life of me remember who it involved. There was a silly storyline about a menopause cake made with something that was supposed to be good for the symptoms, and Joe Grundy took a large slice uninvited and there was a hilarious storyline where he was worried he'd somehow acquire ladies' problems or be emasculated or something else equally implausible as a result.

I've been fortunate with the menopause and I wouldn't say it's made my memory any worse or more erratic than it was already, but I know it's a possible symptom. However, I don't think we need to assume that for Elizabeth. The problems she's had with both twins and the business, compounded by never really having got over Nigel, are surely more than enough to explain an anxiety/depression storyline building up.

It could be my memory, but I remembered that Lily had booked the restaurant and thought Elizabeth was phoning up to cancel it so she wouldn't have to go. Lily sounded genuinely delighted and relieved to see Russ, but for Russ it was all about him. He thought Lily was distraught because she'd missed him - the stress of having a brother in jail and a mum having a nervous breakdown seems to have passed him by. It's all about him. Re Natasha and Tom - I thought Natasha sounded wrong-footed when Tom accepted her invitation to Wales, as if that wasn't the plan at all. I wondered if she'd been angling for an invitation to Bridge farm (hence all the sucking up to Pat and Tony). There's something not quite right about her, but I can't put my finger on it.

I agree with LillianGish that Lizzie cancelled the pre-existing booking. Not sure if it's agoraphobia, as other 'symptoms' are being alluded to e.g. poor/lack of decision-making and judgment (filling up virtual shopping baskets but not buying), sleeping, forgetfulness, avoidance. She's in some sort of breakdown, and I'm wondering if this a mental-health storyline, based around anxiety.
On the Russ front, either Lily is going to get quickly fed-up servicing his needs whilst running LL or he'll have to be transformed (doubt that).

Natasha is definitely a bit strange and suspiciously 'forward' with a manipulative undercurrent. I feel like Hannah is possibly being set up as the misunderstood one - actually quite straightforward and truthful, but with a difficult past. My money's on her rumbling Natasha and ending up with Tom.

My money's on [Hannah] rumbling Natasha and ending up with Tom.
This is that it assumes that :
a) Tom is a prize worth winning and
b) listeners care about any of the three of them.

Kirsty sounded wistful.

I agree on personal basis R4, but the SWs are obviously investing in the Tom/Natasha/Hannah dynamic so we're going to get them whether we're interested or not!
I think Kirsty just sounded a bit tentative and slightly 'awks', as you would if your jilter was in the pub with his new gf. I think she's too sensible to continue harbouring feelings for Tom - even if he's got all the single ladies running after him.

Pat'n'Moany talk to their children like they were little children.
Russ is vile. Could Pip run off with him to Personchester and never come back please.

Is it just me or have they changed Russ's voice/actor?

He sounded different, so does that mean he's going to be different? better?

Lily's voice makes my skin crawl - she's so simpering. Also I find it hard to believe that Deck The Hall is a seven day a week operation - I'd imagine it would just be going on at weekends and maybe on Friday evening. It's in the middle of the countryside isn't it? Is there really enough footfall to make it pay for the whole of December?

Lily also has her mother's selective memory, accepting Russ's praise for her management of LL. No mention of of wotsisname, the new manager. See, I can't remember.

Russ and Kenton at Brookfield on Christmas Day? I don't think Lily has thought that one through.

I hadn't considered that Elizabeth might have agoraphobia - thanks to the posters who've suggested it's a possibility. I love these threads for giving me new angles to think about!

Mere words cannot express how much I dislike Hannah, Natasha, Tom, Pip ... (I could go on!).

Ooh yes, there’ll be quite the scene to look forward to with Kenton squaring up to the vile Russ over the turkey and sprouts.

Mere words cannot express how much I dislike Hannah, Natasha, Tom, Pip ... (I could go on!)

Add Lily to that list.

The official summary on the BBC radio iplayer says that Lizzie forgot to book the birthday meal. So she didn't cancel it.

Add me to the list of those waiting to see Kenton decking Russ over the Christmas table! Meanwhile Jill watches as Pip unwraps little Rosie''s Christmas present from Grandad Fairbrother - a silver mug engraved with Rosie Ruth Grace on it - Jill faints into the Christmas pudding just as Kenton hits Russ over the head with the brandy bottle and Bess runs away with a leg of turkey!

I can't wait, MadGardener

It also lasts a long time.

I'm a bit behind the times but if you're using St Delia of Norfolk's recipe for mincemeat it does indeed last ages, I've recently used the remains of last Christmas' stock! The alcohol is stirred in once it's cold so stays potent, I quite like using cherry brandy rather that normal brandy.

St Delia actually lives in Suffolk, but fortunately she has always had the sense to support the right football team