50 ways to leave your lover. Get on the bus Gus, give a knife to your wife, Rob. How not to write helpful storylines masterclass from The Archers.

[PseudoBadger]

Poor poor Henry

They could. But realistically she could still have told him she was leaving, while one might suggest that leaving should be done while he was out, I don't think she genuinely thought she was in danger. He had slapped her once but there had never been life-threatening violence before. It's possible to be emotionally abusive, scary even, without it ever becoming physical to the point of being in danger, and at such times it would be perfectly reasonable for Helen to think that she would in fact have the conversation where she told Rob that it was over. And at that point a realistic outcome would have been for him to have become more violent, and then remorseful. Or even violent meaning she left and then remorseful after the event. Her stabbing him to death was pure sensationalism, but having said that there has been a lot of pressure to end this storyline now as many listeners have had enough.

ColdTeaAgain if there was a possibility of Rob not being dead the programme would have ended on a cliffhanger surely? With the papers doing the "is he, isn't he," headlines to get listeners to tune in again tonight to find out one way or the other.

At the risk of outing myself, I am a slight soap insider. I assume The Archers is like the TV soaps in that they will have researched this storyline and spoken to charities like WA from the start. I've heard about storylines being changed on the advice of charities.

With every respect, Kathy, that's not news. SOC and others have been banging on for months about how they've been talking to charities to keep this SL authentic.

BUT saying all that, it's not a public service, it's entertainment. If that happens to raise awareness of whatever issue (which it has, let's be honest - everyone's talking about it).

But it was a golden opportunity to follow it through responsibly by showing how Helen could be empowered to leave without putting herself and Henry in danger. As has been pointed out, the proportion of abused women who end up stabbing or otherwise seriously injuring their partners is tiny: it would be so much more entertaining and satisfying for her to have walked out with Henry and to have had the scene where she told Knob from a position of safety precisely why. I'm with SmallLegs, I wanted "the moment when the abuser rails in fury when he realises actually she can leave, he doesn't own her or his kids and actually the courts etc. don't take his side."

I hope ( probably in vain!) that SOC & KD listened to WH just now. Some very good emails were read out, summarising objections to last night's episode.

No mention of puddings or custard though

The very fact this SL has been on the Today programme, WH plus lots of newspapers is what the SWs intended and is a good thing for Rl victims, even if we are rather angry.
If this SL had had a less dramatic ending non of these discussion would be taking place and there wouldn't be as much publicity of the help out there....

I accept that last night's episode could well be a realistic example of a naive, abused woman trying to regain some control over her abuser. I accept that she has no prior experience of DV and wouldn't necessarily have known where to turn for help, or what to do about getting out. What I'm struggling with, most of all, is why we've been led to believe that the 'story' will be of any service to women current in similar situations. I can buy it as a fictional drama. I can't accept that it's providing any kind of public service.

Totally agree with Jane Garvey on WH, I would imagine the ratings will be sky high for tonight's episode! I think it's all intentional to make sure everyone hears the real outcome hopeful.

Sadly there would be nowhere near the media attention if she left quietly while Rob was at the shop.

I have not read all the threads on this subject...just a few.
I thought the whole story was excellent, and should be condensed and played to teenage girls as part of PHSE curriculum. The slow tortuous build was brilliant not just for creating nail biting angst amongst listeners but as a relatively true representation of how coercive behaviour and abuse happens....UNTIL LAST NIGHT....oh ffs....how wrong can you get it ????????

firstly Hellins sudden about face worm turning moment has come about in the space of about 2 weeks.....with little more than a nod to true life were women spend years trying to get their heads round the idea they are being abused.
She suddenly went from complete doormat, no self confidence, etc etc to being able to pack to leave, and plan a last supper including tricking him with a tuna bake.

I can see that maybe the SW wanted to bring it to a head, and I think we are supposed to think she went for him to protect Henweee...and as most of us our mothers we might sympathise there..? I know is a man was threatening me I might try anything other than violence but threaten or start physically hurting my children and i would do anything to protect them.

Maybe that is what we are meant to think...it wasn't about killing rob for her sake but because he was about to hit henwee ...

I hoped she would have done the leaving thing with help from womens aid and then gone back and then left again, then gone back....etc etc...as happens in real life !!

bakeoffcake it's been in the news for quite some time now. The very subject of EA on a soap seemed sufficient to keep interest piqued. Now they've ruined it.

R4, surely The Archers is a soap? I don't really understand why it's not. Or why expectations are different

Expectations are different because TA is different. It's an 'everyday tale'. It's not like soaps where there are murders galore, train crashes, aeroplanes falling out of the sky.
If it's not believable then I'm not interested.

The archers has always been character driven and realistic

Tv soaps are plot driven and ridiculous (how many people in Walford have faked their own death?)

I also think it's likely he has survived, otherwise this would weight the Archers too heavy in favour of one plot line for ages, as no character would realistically be able to talk about anything else. I expect a gradual reveal of the culvert issue and incidences of fraud and various other things, and people gradually realising what a shit Knob is, and him going to prison for something relating to something like that, but him effectively being a new Clive, occasionally being a threatening presence in Hellin's life but otherwise absent.

R4 - what is not believable about a slightly unhinged woman ( and i mean anyone would be a bit unhinged by treatment from rob over last 2 yrs ) in a moment of terror protecting her child from the monster she married who is about to hit 10 bells of him ?

I do not like this ending anymore than everyone on this thread but am i the only one who saw it as Hellin protecting Henwwweee

Many women would absolutely would have gone for any bloke whom they thought was about to seriously hurt their child, so her banging him on the head with a frying pan or slashing at him with a knife would have been more realistic in that context. Even more realistically would have been flinging hot food at him and slamming a door in his face and then scarpering with said child.

I thought that was a very interesting discussion on WH - the WA woman made interesting ponts about how victims are not believed and that she hopes the resolution will play out so that Hells will be able to tell her story and be listened to.

As I said last night, am convinced Knob is not dead and, just as babybarrister and her colleagues are frustrated by the way legal stories are presented, I and my Emergency Care colleagues will be gibbering with rage about unrealistic recovery from stab injury that was so severe that the victim was rapidly rendered unconscious (unless they go down head injury route).

Kirsty is clearly going to save the day with a damp paper towel and a call to 999.

BTW! it was Amy, daughter of Alan and erstwhile best friend of Alice, who was a midwife - she famously spotted Hell's blatantly obvious signs of pre-eclampsia - don't think there has ever been a nurse on TA, has there?

Entertainment and dramatic endings could have been achieved without Helen ending up being the one in the wrong. I have listened again, and it defiantly sounds like she stabbed him, paused and said sorry and then continued to stab him over and over once he was no long a threat. She passed the point of self defence. Manslaughter on the grounds of deminished responsibility.

Helen works up to leaving slowly, having gained control over all the money and turned over the PR on Henry, once safe she confronts him, he gets violent, but someone leaps in and saves the day. All his past misdimeners are revealed to the whole village, he is publicly shown up and humiliated and leaves. Which also gives the possibility of him returning the the future etc etc.

And another plot hole- he didn't come back early, he came back late. He apologised for being late.

And it was a tuna bake apparently. Not pasta or a pie!

Oh, and when Henry came back down, we don't know who was holding the knife, but he'd be no help as a witness. He came down, Daddy shouted at him to go upstairs and then Mummy stabbed Daddy repeatedly.

oooh yes boffin.....death by hot custard...now that would have been great !

actaully yes far more realistic would have been Hellin grabbing custard suacpan and flinging it at him , him turning round and grabbign henwee who then would be between them as Rob's human shield...and him telling her that if she ever leaves he will find them and kill henwwweee

Women do kill their partners after years of abuse, and are disproportionately jailed for long times for doing so, but this story line is different. There is clear and immediate danger as far as Helen is concerned and nasty provocation from Rob. Helen would have never escaped from Rob, and she never will. This relationship will always stay with her.

Getting your life back on track is far more difficult than people realise. It's equivalent to the hanging sword of Damocles.

Well of course she was doing it to save Henry. It's the old drama staple 'the goody' only kills in defending an innocent and in most cases will attempt to save the baddy (just to show they are morally superior) but will fail in their heroic attempt. Cliche cliche cliche.

Will her diagnosis of pre natal depression help her?

That's true elendon- so is the solution to encourage women to kill their abusive partner?

That must be who I was thinking of! Thanks Bore

I expect a gradual reveal of the culvert issue and incidences of fraud and various other things, and people gradually realising what a shit Knob is, and him going to prison for something relating to something like that, but him effectively being a new Clive, occasionally being a threatening presence in Hellin's life but otherwise absent.

Oh, I do hope so, BoffinMum - I want him thoroughly exposed.

I also want Maxine Peake to be Hellin's barrister.

That's going to be the next infuriating plot Elendon. Helen and Kirsty tell everyone what Rob was really like. Everyone (except Peggy) believes them. Helen's off the hook and back at Bridge Farm and they all live happily ever after just in time for the short-term-cheap-shot Ed's departure. Next!

R4 - what is not believable about a slightly unhinged woman ( and i mean anyone would be a bit unhinged by treatment from rob over last 2 yrs ) in a moment of terror protecting her child from the monster she married who is about to hit 10 bells of him ?

The unbelievable bit is that she confronted him. She and Henry should have walked out while Rob was at work. Or maybe Helen would have sent Henry away, with the intention of following on. On what planet do you plan a flounce which involves (the long and slow process of) getting a sleeping child out of bed?