Legalities when builders/architects mess up - where do I stand?

[PavlovtheForgetfulCat]

Ok, as always in my life, its long and complicated so i will give you the bare facts and can fill in any details you need as we go along.

Loft conversion. Involves removing wall of small bedroom and putting back a little, moving the door from right to left, and stairs to go in space created (half in, half in space already there). bedroom small, approx 8.5ft x 5ft. To lose around 1.5ft.

Architect/structural engineer did drawings. assured us when he suggested moving the wall for the stairs that it would be big enough for a standard sized single bed. He stipulated in writing that the internal structure was to be altered ensuring it would be large enough for single bed - this was stipulated on the plans, in black and white.

Anyway, builder had some issues with the stairs, including width of stairs being questioned by stair company and needing changing. Builder assured me it would have no inpact on the size of the bedroom, so I let him get on with sorting the stairs.

Stud wall just been put in. The room is really small. It is 6ft, and therefore it is now not big enough to put a single bed in at all. I think I can see where the problem is. The stairs are 800mm wide, should have been 600mm from what I recall, although the architect did not specify width. This has added 200mm to the top and the bottom of the stairs, which in total is 400mm, which is about how much the room is reduced too much by. Does not sound a lot, but its made a difference between a usable single room and a cupboard.

So, I do not at this stage know if its the architect, the builder, the stair company.

How do I proceed? The inspector has just signed the stairs off today, and the stud wall was then put in, while I was at work, so I did not know until I got home. I probably should have measured the room but presumed the builder knew what he was doing .

Pavlov I am so sorry for the nightmare you are going through. When we had the bathroom re-fitted it was a total diaster & the builder walked off the job, which we were happy about as it was cheaper to get somebody in to finish it off. We also had a disaster with the kitchen as the respectable kitchen shop emplyed (unbenown to them) a bloke who was not corgi registered & we had a gas leak! So, I fully empathise with you & your DH sound exactly like us as I am ready to fly off the handle whereas my DH is more diplomatic. I think your DH is being wise in trying to keep things sweet, hoepfully the job will be finished quicker & you can enjoy your lovely new room. I would also get the BI back to sign off the floor.
Oh, & we are looking at a house tonight that needs everything doing to it. Oh dear

The builder has just escorted me over the crap of the loft floor, to this bit that is lower.

Bloody hell, it makes a difference. he said 'I am backing down, I did not think it would make a blind bit of difference, i thought I was doing all this work for bloody nothing, but the difference in those inches is remarkable. My humble apologies, but in my defence it was not shown on the drawings, but this is the right this to do'.

He got a smile from me then. And I thanked him and the boys for changing it and working so hard to do it.

See, even I can back down gracefully!

. Any builder would stay for Fridays of bacon sarnies!

Well done to you and the builder. Just shows - never be ashamed to admit when you're wrong, and to accept an apology! Sounds like your happy ship is back again.

Not quite back again.

We got the architect around. DH said he did not want the builder to know as he was pissed with him. I said honesty is the best policy, lets not have secrets and DH insisted we tell him tomorrow,

So, architect/structural engineer bloke comes around, with the builder in tow! You should have seen the look on DHs face, he was a bit scared!!!!

The architect was in fact very complimentary of the builder in general and said this was a simple misunderstanding on the builder's part and explained his perspective of how it had gone wrong - and this was after the builder left. he said he asked the builder to come as the builder had spoken to him (after a period of not talking) and he felt it best to tell him he was coming. Fine by me as I have always wanted them to meet together.

The builder was very subservient to the architect, and the architect was happy with the changes the builder has made and is continuing to make. So that is good.

However, the builder left without wanting a cuppa, and was too chirpy. He appears, to me, most pissed off!!! So I have had to to do a bit of calming myself..I called him, could not get through so texted him saying I did not invite him as I thought he was going to deck him one, which is why DH did not want him here, and that I wanted him to just confirm his (the architects) misunderstanding had ben cleared up properly, you know blew a bit of smoke up his ass as DH likes to say.

So hopefully tomorrow morning he will be as happy as he was when he first left this evening.

We are getting there, but there is a little tension which I think will take a bit of time. Once he realises we trust him to finish the job (and once I start to trust him I guess!), it will get better.

Thanks so much for letting me sound off on here, it has helped me to calm down, get some perspective, see things from a different point of view etc.

Can't see what happened with the money but if the builder needs to buy a new staircase etc you could offer to pay it to the companies direct and decuct it out of the retainer?

Are they back working today ?

Lesson in church yesterday was about the wise man who built his house on rock, and the foolish man that built his house on sand. The preacher began "Now, the first thing we all think when we hear this story is, why was the man so stupid as to build his house on sand?" I thought to myself "Because he's using Pavlov's builder and he won't admit he's put the house in the wrong place."

ROFL Grendelsmum you just lickled me pink!

Today, the builders came. They did not turn on on saturday as the builder had another job to do (and it was a quick cash job, keep his flow going I think!).

The builder seemed happy enough, said nothing about me getting the structural engineer here. They worked hard, I went to work, DH went out, we came back early enough to see them, there is one more steel structure in the hallway to keep the ceiling up, but the other are gone. Pretty uneventful today. Just how I like it I did hear him back to his normal self, reminding his boys to do it this way not that, and given them lessons in this or that (one is an apprentice).

Not impressed with the hammer drill marks ALL over the ceilings, but I shall deal with that near the end. he said he will fill them, but so many he might need to skim the ceilings. No pleasing some people eh?

So I feel calmer today. I have not exploded at, or about anything today, apart from when DH said he thought the builder was honest enough - i nearly decked him!

Bumping for me, some vital evidence in here to prove my case against the builder!