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Property Dilemma - please help! (Long, sorry)

80 replies

OldHouseDilemma · 28/06/2021 22:30

Oh Wise Property-Loving Mumsnetters, please give me the benefit of your thoughts and experiences.

DH and I, plus 4 kids, live in a 1930s 4 bedroom detached house, which we have recently got permission to extend upstairs. This would give us 5 bedrooms and would therefore extend the length of time we would happily live here, but it still wouldn’t be our “forever house” (although it has a large kitchen diner, the lounge is a bit small, and we would love to have a bigger garden).

We really like where we live - it’s a large village, and we wouldn’t want to leave it. Properties bigger than 4 bedroom very rarely come up here, and our plan was to complete the extension and realise the potential we saw in the house when we bought it 9 years ago. Then eventually leave if something bigger came on the market. I have not been looking at RightMove for the last few years, but DH has.

He saw that a large, v old property has gone up for sale nearby. We have viewed it once, and are planning to view it again, but I am very much in two minds about moving there. Here is my list of pros and cons:

Pros:

  1. Ginormous garden, great for young kids to explore, even has some woodland and a stream. Also great potential for the mythical time in the future when I have free time to do gardening!

  2. Masses of kerb appeal, v pretty property from outside

  3. Bags of character

  4. Potential ability to make money from AirBnb rentals in 2 bed property in grounds

  5. Lots of space inside, kids can all have own bedroom and we can have friends to stay easily

  6. V peaceful setting. On quiet road with neighbours not close enough to be heard in the garden. (Our current neighbours on one side can be noisy. Not really often, i.e. wouldn’t move just for this reason. Neighbours on other side are quiet.)

  7. Seems in good condition, but v dated.

  8. Location in terms of schools etc is really good. Our current position is better, but we would be likely to have to compromise on that anywhere that we might move, especially if we want a bigger garden.

Cons:

  1. Layout slightly unusual and doesn’t “flow” well like a modern house would. It’s a listed building (grade 2) which apparently doesn’t necessarily prevent you creating gaps in internal walls to make it more open plan, but there are fireplaces which would mean ability to change layout somewhat limited.

  2. Our current kitchen has bifold doors at the back and Velux windows, so is very light. Kitchen at property has one pair of French doors at the back and several windows along one side. Lovely, and not actually gloomy, but obviously not as open as many other properties, and it isn’t easy to see the beautiful garden from the kitchen, which seems a shame. I’m pretty sure we wouldn’t be allowed to add more windows/french doors at the back (would obviously match style, etc), but would love to hear if anyone has been allowed to do this with a listed building. The other rooms have lots of windows and are quite light. For me, it’s just that I like kitchens to be super-light!

  3. Obviously being old, it is likely to be cold in winter? Current house has underfloor heating, whereas this one has radiators, and they look old. Could eventually replace heating I guess, but would never have the even heat of underfloor heating (which I love). Possibility of underfloor heating in kitchen, which appears not to have original floor, but rest of house has original floorboards, which we wouldn’t rip up of course.

  4. I feel pathetic saying this as I don’t believe in the supernatural, and yet I suspect I will feel freaked out if I have to get up to the loo in the night, or if I am there at night on my own? Current owners have been there 41 years, so they presumably weren’t spooked by it. Bedrooms upstairs along a long corridor, so I would feel further away from the kids than in our current house. DD (6) is already a bit funny about going upstairs on her own in current house, so I wonder whether she would ever do so in this house.

  5. A lot of work needed to bring it up to date, which may include rewiring, replumbing, new heating system, not to mention new carpets, curtains, etc. Our offer would reflect this, but I don’t want to miss our kids growing up whilst concentrating on it all.

  6. A lot is going on in our lives at the mo (nothing bad, but just v busy), and we really weren’t planning to move yet.

Summary:

Beautiful, characterful house with amazing garden. Mortgage would stretch us a bit but the ability to make money may balance that in a way that other, similarly-priced properties would not offer. I think kids would have great adventures in the garden, so should I overlook slightly odd layout, coldness in winter, lack of huge windows in kitchen and probable spookiness (at least initially, in my own head) for them to be able to enjoy the garden, and for us to perhaps be better off financially in the long run, which obviously benefits them too?

This property would probably not come on the market again for many years. Location is pretty good, whereas other properties that perhaps tick more boxes in terms of internal space, would likely mean moving slightly outside the village, especially if we wanted more garden space. I would feel sad to have to drive into the village centre, instead of being able to walk.

I do recognise that this is a nice dilemma to have and that we are lucky as we are. But I would appreciate your help to help make up my mind. I am worried about moving there and regretting it, vs not moving there and regretting it!

OP posts:
DappledThings · 29/06/2021 17:03

I would go for the new house but your 1) and 2) on your con list aren't cons to me. I hate open plan and actively avoided viewing anything like that and in my limited experience of underfloor heating it is slow to react, a nightmare to get fixed if it breaks down and generally something I would also avoid like the plague.

So if I were you I'd go for it but with the reservations you've listed I don't think it's right for you.

Gonegrey31 · 29/06/2021 17:07

I have successfully modernised a grade 2* listed house with no problems. Just consult the relevant authorities, be open and don’t break rules . The end result is so worth it .

DespairingHomeowner · 29/06/2021 17:21

As many have said, I’d prefer the older house, npbut im not adding anything there…

My 2 pence worth: re being spooked: easily solved by getting some webcams which are v v cheap (I just bought one for £20 so I can monitor upstairs on my house when I am alone downstairs… can display on iPad, phone or one of the new Alexa devices with a screen

MaudBaileysGreenTurban · 29/06/2021 17:28

Sounds like my idea of a dream house - but perhaps not yours? Your pros list is significantly longer than your cons list though so it's clearly tempting!

However, I do agree with previous posters that you have to absolutely love a listed building and be happy to live in it as it is (minor maintenance notwithstanding). You can't really buy a listed building thinking 'well if I can just change X, Y & Z it will be perfect'. You may be able to make changes, but you also may not, so you need to be happy with it 'as seen'.

It does sound like a glorious place to grow up in though... Wink

MaudBaileysGreenTurban · 29/06/2021 17:31

Forgot to say...pleeeease post a link!

Ruddyknackered · 29/06/2021 19:20

Getting permission to make changes to listed properties can be very tricky. Individual conservation officers have far too much sway. Just having an idea that improves the house and is in keeping with the property may not be enough. If you do get permission, they will want to approve all materials. I literally had to give samples of floorboards to replace areas of modern chipboard.

Bunnyfuller · 29/06/2021 19:46

Link please 😊

We moved out of our listed cottage in Feb. They are beautiful, and the location was very rural but we basically did nothing except maintain it. Cosmetic only turned into new boiler, new windows and damp we never could get rid of. Everything is more expensive than you ever imagine, and the saving grace for winter was the log burner!

As much as we loved living there, it just got too much for us.

bilbodog · 29/06/2021 20:01

Sounds wonderful - please post a link. I think you would need an aga in the kitchen - that will keep you toasty warm!

OldHouseDilemma · 29/06/2021 22:43

Sorry for the delay in replying. I have read this thread several times and you are all making really good points. To answer a few questions/points:

Gardening - is mostly lawn, trees and shrubs rather than flower beds etc, so should be more of a mowing and hedge-trimming type of maintenance, than more fiddly stuff.

The main draw is the garden for the kids. I feel I should be able to compromise on the internal issues because they won't care about those but would love the garden.

It is encouraging to hear that some MNetters have extended/altered their Grade II listed homes, but I take on board that we must like it enough as it is, in case changes are not possible. I would love to have a conservation architect/adviser come round at the time of our survey, but not sure how feasible this is? I now realise that absolutely everything will be included in the listing.

Knowing that council tax, insurance, heating etc will be increased and not being able to know precisely how much by, is really difficult for decision making.

It is interesting that several posters have said open plan is less good with older kids. Will definitely bear this in mind.

We viewed it again today, and I felt really positive about it whilst there, but now feel torn again. I actually love our current house, but we will outgrow it.

During the viewing, there was a random noise from upstairs after we had just walked downstairs, but some of the doors have automatic closing devices, and we think it was just one of those that we hadn't shut fully! Not sure re cameras as suggested upthread - what if I saw something!

We don't have bags of money. We wouldn't be without spare cash, but we are not totally loaded!

The kitchen isn't poky - is a kitchen diner. My issues with it are not enough windows at back, looking out onto garden (plenty at side, looking into an unattractive side yard), and a long way round to the lounge/sitting room, where kids would presumably hang out.

I do really like the period features, e.g. fireplaces, but lumped it all in with "bags of character"!

There is an Aga in the kitchen. Are these expensive to run?

OP posts:
OldHouseDilemma · 29/06/2021 22:44

Oh, and I'm really sorry for not posting a link. I fear it would be outing. I know that is annoying though!

OP posts:
Verbena87 · 29/06/2021 23:20

I think go for it if it feels good. Our previous house was 1752 and I felt so safe there - you could sort of feel there’d been a lot of human lives layered up in the space, but it felt as if people had been happy there and as if the house was happy with us in it.

OldHouseDilemma · 29/06/2021 23:34

That's a nice way to think of it. All those families potentially growing up there.

OP posts:
LemonSwan · 29/06/2021 23:57

On Location Location Location, they show you a series of houses so you know when you see 'the one'.

If you havent been looking at rightmove I am not suprised you dont have this feeling. You are probably imagining your exact house, slightly bigger kitchen diner, with modern everything, underfloor heating and a huge garden and imagining thats in your budget. It may be I dont know but what are the chances of that even existing?

What I am trying to say is your DP has been looking. He probably has a better understanding of what you can get in your budget and this is jumping out to him as 'the one'

BananaHammock23 · 30/06/2021 07:19

@OldHouseDilemma sorry OP missed your reply the other day. The guy we used was a structural surveyor who worked for a local structural engineer and architectural design office - so I guess search something like that! I'm sure if you called a local company and explained your situation they'd be happy to come and have a look! It really helped us and he came up with solutions I would never have considered. Good luck!!

BikeRunSki · 30/06/2021 07:27

I’d say pros outweigh the cons, but I feel that your cons are somewhat tenuous and that’s you’re scraping the barrel for them because your heart is not really in it.

Pomtastic · 30/06/2021 07:33

It sounds amazing!

Just a word of caution that a property with a separate dwelling in the garden, and/or a stream in the garden, might be almost impossible to mortgage, or get home insurance for (we found similar when we tried to buy a house with an annex in the garden - all sorts of issues with mortgage, insurance, double council tax etc).

It could be worth checking with a mortgage broker first - they could advise on the likelihood of a mortgage going through?

AdaThorne · 30/06/2021 07:39

I was going to say go for it anyway but then you said Aga! 😍

We bought a house (non listed which I know is slightly different) with similar additional space. At the time we thought it was ‘nice to have’ but actually we have realised it’s a massive benefit. Currently my parents are in ill-health and my dad is acting as my mum’s carer a lot. They stay here for one week of the month so I can help out, they can see the kids (but have space away from them when the noise is too much!) and dad can get some respite. We host other people regularly which is lovely and we’ve got one eye not just on an Airbnb type thing when the kids are much older but the kids using it to host their friends as teenagers in a safe place where we’re close by but not being disturbed by them. Hell, we probably won’t be in a position to give the kids much by way of equity for a long old time if at all to help on the housing ladder but it could even be used for them to live their and save for their own deposits.

If it were me I’d definitely do my homework about what was possible with the new house, but if there was any way it’d work I’d absolutely go for it.

FuglyHouse · 30/06/2021 10:13

When you consider the financial situation, don't forget to take into account any tax implications if you use the annexe for AirBnB.

It sounds wonderful, but I'd be concerned that potentially it's a huge time sink (even "simple" gardens require quite a lot of maintenance if they're huge) as well as a money pit. You need to weigh up if you have the energy and motivation as well as the money to make it what you want.

SalaciousCrumble · 30/06/2021 11:39

@Verbena87

I think go for it if it feels good. Our previous house was 1752 and I felt so safe there - you could sort of feel there’d been a lot of human lives layered up in the space, but it felt as if people had been happy there and as if the house was happy with us in it.
I really agree with this. I always feel like this house is another member of the family - it protects us and is a safe place. It must have seen families through wars, death, famine and pandemics over the last 400 years, children will have been born here, loved ones will have died, but the house has sheltered them all and I find that very comforting. Sometimes when I make food for my family in the kitchen I like to think of the echoes of all the women who have lovingly made food for their children over the centuries (or I'm in a rush and just shouting at the kids as I throw pasta at them!)

I don't know if you can see your house that way but I'm never freaked out here and I do tend to have an over-active imagination.

Waitingfirgodot · 30/06/2021 15:35

We live in a fairly similar sounding house - although not listed. I do think that to live in an old house this needs doing up it helps to love it so it doesn't feel like such a burden! It would be hard to live in if I was constantly craving something more modern. Ours is cold in winter, but we just wear lots of jumpers and argue over the chair next to the aga! The aga costs a fortune to run, but is wonderful. Our children love living here and love having a big garden - we have a lot of pets! Children's parties are easy - we just send them off to play hide and seek. I think it's very much a lifestyle choice to live somewhere like this - you just need to decide if it's the lifestyle you want!

SunshineCake · 30/06/2021 15:40

I would not extend current house and snap up new house ASAP.

Mintine · 30/06/2021 17:30

Wow the new house sounds so lovely, I would go for it, if I could afford it, but it does sound like my perfect house.
It’s a very difficult decision

longtompot · 30/06/2021 18:15

Can you do a screenshot of the floorplan @OldHouseDilemma ? People might be able to suggest ways you could get the flow you are after.
Personally house two sounds idyllic. We'd love a stream at the end of our garden. I get what you mean re spooky houses, but our house was built in 1935 and it has an element of something there although they appear friendly. I have stayed in beamed and creaky uneven floored houses and I didn't sleep, but I generally don't sleep well in different places (it was just one night) so it might have been that couple with wine and an active imagination.
Maybe book a viewing on a dull day to see how it feels when it's not so bright.

SaltySeaAir · 30/06/2021 18:28

How long has it been on the market for? If your house isn't even advertised yet are they likely to accept your offer?

It sounds beautiful 😍

FuckYouCorona · 30/06/2021 20:43

Why do you keep ignoring the PP who question how this is going to work when your house isn't even on the market yet? Were you honest with the vendors about your situation & asked if they are prepared to wait, indefinitely for a buyer whose house that hasn't been valued, let alone on the market or sale agreed? How can you even make an offer when you have no idea what you'll get for your own house?

You mentioned about your offer reflecting work needing doing. Chances are this has been factored in already & the house would cost £££ more if the updating were not necessary. The only way a vendor is likely to agree to this would be with a full asking price offer. Sorry to burst your bubble, but you seem to be getting carried away over something that is really a non-starter!

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