Vendor’s tenants refusing to leave

[Plancina]

Just posting for a rant/wild hope of any advice. We have been in process of buying a really lovely house that we totally fell in love with and have laid over £1000 for survey fees, solicitor fees and a survey. It was marketed as no chain but has a private tenant in it who was supposed to move out on the 5th July. The tenant is now refusing to leave - they own their own home but it is having work done on it and they aren’t willing to move into alternative rental accommodation until their home is finished. They are ignoring all requests from their landlord to leave and insisting they will stay there until their house is ready, they won’t give a timeline for this.
Our lease is up in two months and we’d have to commit to a 6 month lease at least to stay here. We are so upset and annoyed - can’t believe how selfish these people are being. The vendor is also annoyed as they don’t want to lose the sale and they had promised their son a portion of the proceeds to buy his first home and now he is going to lose that house also.
Our solicitor says it could take a year to evict them.

it’s a totally different scenario for the OP - she will have to pay thousands in extra rent if these tenants refuse to move whereas they’re not losing any money - they’ve been offered the cost of the move, and they’re paying rent anyway in the current house and will be until their house is ready

OP will be forking out anyway, unless I’ve missed something and she’s buying without a mortgage. They don’t want to move twice nor does OP. They’re all in the same boat.

@Plancina

Our landlord says minimum 6 month lease - will cost us £7000+ The landlord hasn’t even issued them with the S21 yet because of the COVID ban on evictions. Our solicitor says the courts are backlogged because of the ban and we’d be looking at a minimum of 8-9 months with no certainty, and probably more like a year.

The vendor and the Covid situation is the problem not your tennants. I was a housing officer for a long time and the advice we were told to give was, wait until the sec 21 is served AT LEAST. (Usually wait until after court) to leave.

They’re not selfish they just don’t have anywhere else to go and shouldn’t have to deal with the shit of fees and eviction

Well it’s a bit different paying your own mortgage than paying private rent @alsohuman as one is paying off the principal and is an investment and one is money entirely to someone else.
It shouldn’t be possible for people to refuse to relinquish someone else’s property simply because it doesn’t suit them. It is selfish and dishonourable.

@Pobblebonk
@Alsohuman
But OP is complaining because she wants to avoid the hassle of moving. In fact, she is now proposing to stay beyond the end of her current tenancy for that reason. Why is that fine for her, but not for the tenant?

I believe the OP is complaining primarily because the house she wanted to buy, and had spent money on (doing surveys etc), is now not available - as the tenants refuse to leave and her solicitor advises it could take the LL up to a year to pursue them through the courts. They won't/can't indicate when they are prepared to leave. Waiting a year would mean the OP spends a further €14,000 on rent. (Her landlord was asking for €7,000 for 6 months - even though she should be able to continue renting by the month as she has been advised.) That is very disappointing for the OP when she thought the sale was ready to go through. To be fair, I think the OP's issue should be with the landlord/solicitor and not the landlord's tenants, but I think the tenants in this case have behaved very badly nonetheless.

[quote LizzieAnt]@Pobblebonk
@Alsohuman
But OP is complaining because she wants to avoid the hassle of moving. In fact, she is now proposing to stay beyond the end of her current tenancy for that reason. Why is that fine for her, but not for the tenant?

I believe the OP is complaining primarily because the house she wanted to buy, and had spent money on (doing surveys etc), is now not available - as the tenants refuse to leave and her solicitor advises it could take the LL up to a year to pursue them through the courts. They won't/can't indicate when they are prepared to leave. Waiting a year would mean the OP spends a further €14,000 on rent. (Her landlord was asking for €7,000 for 6 months - even though she should be able to continue renting by the month as she has been advised.) That is very disappointing for the OP when she thought the sale was ready to go through. To be fair, I think the OP's issue should be with the landlord/solicitor and not the landlord's tenants, but I think the tenants in this case have behaved very badly nonetheless.[/quote]
Frankly it's foolish to start a purchase on a house that has tenants in.

@Boomclaps
The S21 was served several months ago and the tenants have a choice of 5 properties to move to.

[quote LizzieAnt]@Boomclaps
The S21 was served several months ago and the tenants have a choice of 5 properties to move to.[/quote]
What part of they don’t want to move twice do you have such difficulty in understanding? They could have been offered Buckingham Palace, they just don’t want to be uprooted at someone else’s behest. And I don’t blame them in the least.

@CodenameVillanelle It's all well and good to say "Frankly it's foolish to start a purchase on a house that has tenants in." but until I'd read this thread I had no idea it was so hard to get tenants to leave if they don't want to go! Obviously naively, I'd assumed most would go when an agreement ends and it wouldn't be so tricky to evict the minority who don't.

Whenever I've rented, I've left when my agreement ended.

Definitely a life lesson which I hope I remember next time I need to move and purchase a new house. I'd expect LLs to know the law, but I can't think why OP should have known.

I can't think why OP should have known

No reason at all why she should. Her solicitor should have told her before she spent a penny on surveys and legal fees.

Vendor leaves place empty - b*stard for leaving it empty

Vendor rents it out and agrees an end lease date - vendor is greedy/foolish for renting it out

Vendor serves s21 - tenant can sit pretty in someone else's house, screwing up house moves, as that's the way the law works. Magic!!!

[quote LizzieAnt]@Lyralalala
Yes, I agree that if the tenants' situation is more complicated then of course there may be mitigating circumstances. However, I was responding to the facts as they were presented by the OP. As regards the pandemic, yes it may have impacted them, but it may also have impacted the landlord, we just don't know.

I suppose I was surprised that some people on this thread thought that tenants who were presented as "just not wanting the hassle of moving twice" were regarded as completely "blameless" when they were refusing to keep to a previously made agreement, ignoring the S21 issued months previously, and refusing even to indicate when they would be prepared to leave.[/quote]
They haven't ignored the S21. The S21 is a notice that the LL will go to court for removal.

[quote Shinesweetfreedom]@LangClegsInSpace
Would you believe me if I told you Bells is actually a landlord.[/quote]
I would

So often on here I see posts from other LL's that make me totally understand why tenants never truly trust me

@Butterer

Legally they have done nothing wrong.

Morally they have, though.

They've agreed to something and broken the agreement, causing a large amount of financial loss and stress to multiple people.

I'm amazed at the people on here who are empathising with the tenants.

What they have done is selfish in the extreme. What about keeping to your word instead, after they agreed with the landlord they'd move out on X date? That would be the honourable thing to do.

I think if you have done what the tenants have done, you're a first class scumbag.

@Codenamevillanelle

Frankly it's foolish to start a purchase on a house that has tenants in.
Clearly it is, and the OP has found this out the hard way, as people can't always be trusted.

I'm curious though, do you absolve the tenants in this case of all responsibility to keep to their original agreement? Do you think it's fine to stay in somebody's house for as long as it suits you, even if the house is no longer available to rent and you have been served notice in the correct manner? I know it's legal until the courts catch up with you, but, quite frankly, if everyone behaved like these tenants have, society would be worse off. I don't understand why you seem determined to condemn everyone's behavior except the tenants'. My point is that, though the OP's issue should, of course, be with the LL and her solicitor, these tenants have behaved selfishly and with a lack of respect for everyone else involved.

[quote LizzieAnt]@Codenamevillanelle

Frankly it's foolish to start a purchase on a house that has tenants in.
Clearly it is, and the OP has found this out the hard way, as people can't always be trusted.

I'm curious though, do you absolve the tenants in this case of all responsibility to keep to their original agreement? Do you think it's fine to stay in somebody's house for as long as it suits you, even if the house is no longer available to rent and you have been served notice in the correct manner? I know it's legal until the courts catch up with you, but, quite frankly, if everyone behaved like these tenants have, society would be worse off. I don't understand why you seem determined to condemn everyone's behavior except the tenants'. My point is that, though the OP's issue should, of course, be with the LL and her solicitor, these tenants have behaved selfishly and with a lack of respect for everyone else involved.[/quote]
^ this

@wildone84

I'm amazed at the people on here who are empathising with the tenants.

What they have done is selfish in the extreme. What about keeping to your word instead, after they agreed with the landlord they'd move out on X date? That would be the honourable thing to do.

I think if you have done what the tenants have done, you're a first class scumbag.

Fortunately, what you think couldn’t matter less.

@Alsohuman
What part of they don’t want to move twice do you have such difficulty in understanding?

I have no difficulty at all in understanding that they don't want to move. The correct thing to do doesn't always (or even often) correspond to what one wants or what's easiest though. They agreed to move out, now it doesn't suit and they don't seem to care how their behaviour affects anybody else.

After plenty of knowledgeable posters explaining UK tenancy law to the utterly utterly clueless, the idiotic comments still keep on coming...

It's funny how landlords are usually the demonised ones on here, yet this time because it affects a buyer it's the tenant that's in the wrong

Normally a LL who happily took the money from a tenant for months on end who then decided to sell from under them and issue a S21 at the start of a global pandemic would be the lowest of the low

Amusing how thing sway depending on small details

@upsidedownwavylegs - Bit of a strange comment to make because we can say the same for you... Your opinion matters not a jot either. After all, we're all internet strangers.

[quote LizzieAnt]@Alsohuman
What part of they don’t want to move twice do you have such difficulty in understanding?

I have no difficulty at all in understanding that they don't want to move. The correct thing to do doesn't always (or even often) correspond to what one wants or what's easiest though. They agreed to move out, now it doesn't suit and they don't seem to care how their behaviour affects anybody else.[/quote]
I like to believe in karma. Let's hope that these tenants lose out one day due to someone else's inconsiderate behaviour.

@lyralalala

It's funny how landlords are usually the demonised ones on here, yet this time because it affects a buyer it's the tenant that's in the wrong

Normally a LL who happily took the money from a tenant for months on end who then decided to sell from under them and issue a S21 at the start of a global pandemic would be the lowest of the low

Amusing how thing sway depending on small details

The tenants had AGREED to move out in July though!

Yep, what the tenants did is indefensible and I find it worrying that some people on here are defending it. Shameless.

@RubyTrees
I don't know who you're calling utterly, utterly clueless...I suspect it might be me . If so, I do understand tenancy laws well enough. Just because someone isn't breaking the law, though, doesn't mean they're not behaving in a manner that's very inconsiderate of others. I understand that too.