downsizing - too many questions

[AlmaWhittaker]

We've decided to downsize a little early (kids are just 18, 16, 14) but it's more to do with wanting to move from big house and big garden in the country to the city where we both work. We're in the process of buying a smaller apartment in the city and selling our house.

Lots of reasons to move.

Pro move: We hate our current neighbour,
Con: but obviously we risk having more than one awful neighbour so that seems like a terrible reason.

Pro move: We hate spending every spare moment trying to keep the garden under control. Neither of us likes gardening (anymore, I did go through a phase of growing veg etc but I just don't have the time anymore).
Pro: So, a tiny balcony instead.
??? Oh god, will we regret it?

Pro: We want less house to clean, less diy to do.
Con: Oh god, we're reducing our living space by about a half.

Pro: We want to cut out a lot of driving. This can only be a good thing. We aim to go from 2 cars to one.
Con: can I really live without a car? I work mainly from home and just a day or two where I'd need to get a bus.

Just wondering if anyone has done this with so many doubts? When I tell myself all the reasons we're moving, they make sense, but then I look around our existing spacious house/garden and worry about how to dry clothes/fit all our things in tiny cupboards. Also, ds 18 has already left home (uni) but comes home every 3 or 4 weeks for the weekend and for holidays too. In the new arrangement he'll have to share with ds2 (14) whereas they didn't have to share before. Is that asking for trouble, or pushing ds1 out?

But I'm craving a bit of city fun. The novelty of home delivery food, being able to walk to cinema, bars, restaurants. DS being able to walk to school instead of me driving him is a HUGE plus for both of us. But but but...

Would love some stories of your experiences (I'm afraid everyone else dreams of doing the opposite, of finding a house and a garden for retirement, but we've experienced the sheer work involved in that lifestyle and know we don't want that). We're 54 and 49.

@Ambydex yes 3 bed where both kids have a room with a desk, and ds1 can sleep w ds2 when he's home (hardly child cruelty) other rooms are all small, so a kitchen that doesn't fit a table and a sitting/dining /office... but that's what we want (small). I'm looking forward to having only one bathroom to clean, but am still worried that it'll be awful. I'm saying that we've chosen to do this but we're still allowed to have doubts...
I've lived in apartments before when single or as a couple but never with kids. But teens who lounge in beds or are hooked up to computers don't actually take up that much space.
It's interesting to see how much people treasure the garden, but we really don't, not anymore. And I dread having to do it when we're older. I might well come crawling back to the country in a years time desperate for air but I really see myself in this new life. Don't know why I'm explaining myself really.

@crimsonlake harsh and unrealistic, thanks. I'll help my kids out every way I can and would welcome them back if they need it, not to a slum but to a smallish apartment. I repeat that the kids are totally on board, can't wait to have a life.

Florentina thanks, I'm sure we'll manage storage-wise, it's quite freeing throwing out stuff that you've kept for years and never look at.

Now, is there any point in keeping lovely crystal wine glasses that are impractical? 😊

No of course you don't have to explain yourself... but your OP is all about pros and cons so it's not surprising when people chip in with their pros and cons.

The garden and location thing I completely get.

I think what's tricky here is size is all relative. A 3 bed apartment is rarely a "smallish" apartment really. You're talking about somewhere big enough to accommodate 3 teens (and I agree 2 sharing is fine), desks for 2 plus all their stuff yet you're talking about having nowhere to dry the laundry and making weekly trips to the launderette. It's like it's big and tiny at the same time - and it is, because you're comparing to a big house. My parents are convinced our house is tiny because it's half the size of theirs, but to us it's a good size.

I live in a flat, with excellent storage (a separate utility room in fact), have a good washer / dryer, love my balcony, never hear my neighbours, think my service charge is excellent value for money for the upkeep of the communal gardens / internal cleaning / 24 hr concierge. I love it. Good luck op!

Keep the crystal glasses though - you can never have too many glasses 🍷🥂🍸

A gardener surely can't cost any more than the fees and taxes incurred in moving.

@Persea good to hear storage is possible. Your set up sound perfect.

Whoever said I did ask for pros and cons is right. Just I'm so sure I don't want a garden and half the replies are about that.

But thanks to all nonetheless I'm so thrilled to be starting a new phase in life and everyone else is on board too, but there are just a few niggles to iron out.

Great to get rid of the garden, the stairs, the outside maintenance, window cleaning, roof, guttering etc etc. Much better to pay someone else to have the responsibility of all that. To have less to clean and be central sounds perfect. We fully intend to go into an apartment when my little house is too much.

@AlmaWhittaker well done you for doing what you want. It sounds like you’ve thought long and hard before making this choice.
I can see some things will be challenging but it sounds like you will be able to have a more interesting life.
Lots of people live in flats in cities and get by just fine. I realise you have children but in my experience teenagers can be quite low key and don’t have the same impact as young children.
I completely get where you are coming from and intend to do a similar thing, in my case if I could, I would swap current house for a flat in a city and a small cottage size property to escape to, unfortunately our budget won’t run to that so we will have to make a harder choice.
My priority would be having enough room for a large dining table as we always sit as a family for meals, some outside space, it wouldn’t have to be a garden but I need to be able to get outside without having to leave my home, and a reasonable view, I once lived opposite an ugly block of flats and it was rather depressing looking at them every day and of course good storage!

I will warn you about having a smaller place.

It will never look tidy with 4/5 people living in it unless you get rid of virtually everything.

You will be constantly cleaning and tidying.

I personally would go for a 3 bed terrace with a small garden and get in a gardener and/or redesign it as a proper outside “room”

Great idea but I think it could become a bit claustrophobic if you don’t have that extra space.

At least with a terrace you could go up into the lift space even just as a chill out room for the children

That way s an interesting point of view. Can you explain why it will never look tidy?

I would get a flat with a bathroom and a shower room or ensuite or cloakroom. My teens seem to spend hours in the bathroom so a second loo would be really handy. We too are downsizing next June and this is the one thing I really want. Also, declutter, declutter!

Check the service charges on your flat and think about the likelihod of block works. They can be really expensive, my eldest has just been asked to fork out £8k on top of the usual charges for some maintenance works. She has 9 months notice to raise it but it is still a big outlay and the work in the past has been done to a poor standard or value for money.Share of freehold for her next time round.

My friend did this and has no regrets. Herself and DH hated gardening. They now live in an apartment where she has the view of a fab garden but no responsibility for it. Kids love it and easy access to school etc. Also, you can walk etc - they got rid of one car. I think it is a great idea however, could you get an apartment with an extra bedroom or study that you could put a sofa bed in for DS1 when he visits?

think we have about 20 different garden chairs, for example, and our balcony can take one or two!

Have you got the flat already OP? It reads there as if you have, if so, so many comments are redundant and if you say exactly what space you have then we can make tailored suggestions for storage and practicalities.

It will never look tidy with 4/5 people living in it unless you get rid of virtually everything.
😄 What? We are a family of 5 living in a very tidy flat. Living in a house doesn't make you magically tidy! It all depends on your storage space/hoarding tendencies!

@StarJumpsandaHalf Yes, we've put an offer on an apartment so we know what we have to adapt to. It needs a lot of work so we're trying to figure out where e.g. washing machine goes, etc. It's small but has quite a lot of storage, I think, but compared to what we're used to it'll be hard. I didn't really start this thread looking for storage ideas per se, but more for reassurance that it's not going to be terrible. But it's been good to hear both sides (although we've made up our minds on the big picture and won't be persuaded into a terrace/suburbs/small garden).

@Annasgirl Good to hear that it's worked out for your friend. I think the idea of extra bedroom is fine, but I'm trying to look ahead so that we won't have to downsize a second time. Kids will be all gone in a few (3) short years and then we'll have 2 spare bedrooms. So, we thought a tight squeeze for the first year (probably 8 months) will be followed by just 3 of us in a 3-bed until DS moves to uni. At that point, anyone coming home can take whichever of the 2 spare rooms are available.
As for "It will never look tidy with 4/5 people living in it unless you get rid of virtually everything" - I'm hoping to get rid of all the clutter. I've already cleared out tonnes of stuff and feel much better for having done so. We don't need much. DS is particularly tidy already, I have to work on DD.

@Oliversmumsarmy "even just as a chill out room for the children" My children chill out pretty spectacularly in their bedrooms. We'll also be in walking distance of their friends/cinema/library and loads of other places which aren't accessible to use where we currently live (unless someone drives them)

@SapatSea "Check the service charges on your flat and think about the likelihod of block works. They can be really expensive, my eldest has just been asked to fork out £8k on top of the usual charges for some maintenance works" This is one of the reasons we're excited to live in an apartment. Until now we've been forking out for plenty of work over the years, with nobody to share the load. We know to put money aside for these eventualities and will continue to do so.

@Itscoldouthere "if I could, I would swap current house for a flat in a city and a small cottage size property to escape to, unfortunately our budget won’t run to that " There are plenty of houses around us that are owned by people who come for weekends/summer. One of them, a couple, owns a huge house, beautiful views, beautiful garden, swimming pool, gorgeous. The house is empty most of the year but when they're coming, they pay someone to come in and clean (actually they pay her all year) and to buy groceries, clean the pool, and all the rest. They arrive and have a lovely holiday. I think it must cost them an absolute fortune and wonder why you wouldn't just go to a top hotel/rent a villa. But, each to their own.

@AlmaWhittaker oh I know what you mean about those empty country cottages:second homes.
We moved out of London to a large renovation project 6 years ago (doesn’t have lots of land thankfully). Although it’s been interesting and we’ve learnt lots, it hasn’t really worked for us, DH has ended up working back in London and both my DC are going to university in September.
I love my house, but I don’t love the life I have in a village, we miss city life and now that the DC are going I will be here in this large house on my own a lot of the time as I work from home.
We will go back to London, but can only afford a flat now as prices have gone up so much.
In an ideal world we would like a second home to escape to and move to when DH retires in 5/6 years, but our budget won’t stretch, so we will have to make sure we choose a flat carefully, we also have a dog so location will be very important.
Interesting I have a London friend who is in the process of buying a large old country house as a second home, I think she’s mad as she has such a busy work life I can’t imagine she’s going to get there much and she will have to employ a raft of people to help look after it.
I’m currently trying to get rid of stuff, we seem to have acquired so much stuff and I would quite like to get rid of most of it!
Perhaps I’m having a midlife crisis 😂

Op I think it sounds great. People are so addicted to stuff. I wouldn't compromise on the suburbs, where is the fun in that - all or nothing is the way.

I guess with an apartment you can find yourself a bit short of living space as the living space doesn't have to be the same size as the bedrooms that would be above in a house. But you will adapt.

You could always pay for a storage unit if desperate for your poor neglected grown up children :)

@Itscoldouthere I think I'm at around the same midlife crisis stage as you, except I've grown to resent the house/garden so won't miss it (I think). It's hard for you trying to get back into London. Sounds so expensive. Luckily the city we're moving to (not in UK) is small and still very affordable, so we'll end up with some change once we sell our house. We could have gone for a bigger apartment (and then I wouldn't be on here worrying) but the whole point is to cut/reduce/downsize.

@itsboiledeggsagain haha the poor neglected grown up children indeed!

I do think I've lived my life in distinct stages:

• growing up in the country far from friends, only siblings to play with, neither loved nor hated, it was all I knew
• uni in the BIG CITY, loved it
• travel to lots of cities, loved it
• "settled down" in big city, loved it
• then had kids, hated city, needed space
• moved to the country with kids, loved it
• kids are now moving on and I don't want to be abandoned in the country
• soon, small city for retirement? (maybe not the end )

@AlmaWhittaker it’s interesting isn’t it, I lived in London for a long time and thought I was so tired of it, but country life just hasn’t worked for me and I’m so fed up with driving everywhere.
It was a good stage for my DC but they now have their own life to live and won’t miss living here.
I had dreamed of living in a big house and garden but actually I find it all so draining, I could (but don’t) spend my whole life cleaning and even our small (by country standards) garden takes up so much time.
I would actually love to live in a bungalow, I know that sounds naff, but I have friends with the most amazing one so I know we could make it lovely and if planned correctly the flow of rooms can be great, that’s why a good size flat could also work, I have no desire for a pokey terraced house, lateral living has much more appeal.

I actually know a few families who have moved back to the city with teenagers to give them more freedom. I am not in the UK either though.

Small is fine. DD has small modern house with little storage. Problems are stuff like spare coats in the winter, wellies, drying washed clothes as no room for dryer. Do you have a decent space to work where everything can be left out?

I think it won’t ever look tidy unless you really cull down everything and live constantly monitoring everything brought into the flat.

You are in effect trying to move 5 adults into a 3 bed flat

Ds might have gone to uni but he will be home at some point, the same with your other children.

I have 4 people in what is really a 3 person house.

It is always messy, however Dp works away a lot and within a day or 2 of him leaving the house seems to somehow be tidier and neater, the same if Dd works away for any length of time.

All 4 of us for any length of time in the house and we are climbing over stuff.

A house you can have a shed to put excess stuff you need to keep or a loft that can be converted.

We have a 1 bed annexe as well and we are still stuffed with things we use at least weekly

Dd and Ds have a lot of equipment that they need for jobs and hobbies

Should add neighbours have had all their children return to the family home bringing wives and gfs and all their stuff with them.

This sounds like a great idea, you’ll all suddenly have so much more time to do things with less driving to work/ferrying kids around, and less house maintenance etc.

Not sure why people keep suggesting looking at a small 3 bed house, why would the floor space be any bigger? We were in a flat until my ds1 was a toddler, and when we were looking at houses I was struck by how much floor space we had in the apartment. It was much bigger than many houses (which were valued at double the flat’s price) we looked at which had to give up so much space to the stairs. You’ll be fine, especially with the kids being so on board too.