To think a lot of people who agree with VAT on school fees…

[geeenuoe]

Actually don’t truly understand that to most sending their kids to these schools, it is a massive, massive struggle already.

There seems to be a mentality that if you can afford 20k a year then you’re already comfortable so sod it, you should find more cash now for vat … but do people in general not understand that some families re mortgage their homes to pay these fees? Yes there’s mega wealthy people but there’s many, many more who are not.

On the one hand we hear a good education is a luxury so VAT must be applied, then on the other we are told a good education is a right for all. So… why are we taking away that good education from those who already have it? Why is the focus not on sorting out the state sector properly? We all know the vat won’t fix the state sector. It may help in a tiny way in ad hoc circumstances but there’s so so so much more that needs to be done to state schools to make them ever match what the private sector offers.

I simply don’t get this mentality that those making sacrifices must make more when it comes to bloody education. I say this as someone who can’t afford the fees but if I could I absolutely would… and I also acknowledge that I am unwilling to go to some lengths that others will to pay it. I respect the choice of others to make such sacrifices and have no desire to make it harder and more inaccessible for the masses to access it. Similarly, I know plenty of people driving fancy cars and spending loads on holidays… they’ve chosen that over school fees. And those who have spend loads getting into a postcode of a decent state school… should they be paying enhanced tax on their house purchase?

Why do most people think those who pay schools fees are doing so with great ease? Is it basically because they don’t personally know people paying this so accept the media narrative that it’s the mega rich only?

Or is it that the payment of vat on school fees might go towards increasing education budget so that more children will have a great education in publicly funded schools?

Even after months and months of these threads, I still can't get over rich people expecting sympathy from poorer people, because they can only have a couple of holidays a year, because they need to pay for their kids to get a leg up.

I hope Labour get on with implementing this asap.

It hasn't started yet. Plus the number of children enrolling in all schools has dropped due to the declining birthrate.

Realistically it's going to affect very few children.

This

What’s rubbish? It is an entirely accurate post.

I read an economists article recently where he stated that one of the biggest issues we have in the UK is that we tax lower earners too little and higher earners too much however a lot of people believe the reverse to be true making meaningful tax change almost impossible to implement.

Oh my god, not again

I'm sure most parents want their kid to have a good education.

Those children are still incredibly privileged compared to most of the world. They'll be fine.

@Snoopy111 do you really think vat on fees will change state schools? Seriously? They will be the same as ever. Far more policies and changes need to be made to make any difference.

I don’t like the addition of VAT because I think it makes private schools even more the preserve of the wealthy and less accessible to lower income families.

I come from a low income family but won a major academic scholarship to private school at age 11 and also had a government assisted place which topped up the scholarship to 75% of fees. I benefited hugely from that opportunity.

Fees now with VAT combined with the cost of living crisis mean that even paying 25% of the fees is unaffordable for most families.

Well I know personally at least 10 children who couldn't cope at state school due to SEN and are now at private schools (some special, some funded through EHCP, some not).

So for some kids it's not a choice as they can't attend state school.

And given the battle to get an EHCP is incredibly stressful and literally years long, thousands of parents are choosing to scrape fees together so their DC can attend school full stop.

Exactly. Research shows that a child’s attainment levels are directly linked to parenting not whether they went to private school.

I think increased funding for the state sector is one part of a solution which would include many other changes. I don't accept that they have to be the same forever.

@CaptainMyCaptain

ohhh so certain types of education are a luxury! Got it.

What hope is there for ambition and success when really excellent, stellar EDUCATION is deemed a luxury. Good god.

I've just lost 15 mins of my life looking at taxes across Europe. The big stand out is actually employers NI equivalent contributions are really high in some places. I also couldn't really see that low earners pay more. There was a bit of a mid earners paying more trend.

What the parents of private school children buy, apart from small class sizes and better facilities, is a peer group whose parents value education, ensure homework is done, have middle-class ambitions for their children, insist that their children behave well, are well socialised. In short, they buy an environment of work and good behaviour amd ambition. The arrival in state school of more pupils with ambition will, in itself, raise standards and their social and employment goals will be shared with their fellow students. Slowly a whole new world of potential will open up to children who currently see a limited range of possibilities; a new world that they currently see as only for 'rich people'.

Society is happier when there is a smaller gap between rich and poor and social mobility is a reality, so everyone can have hope

OP, if this is a reverse intended to showcase those in favour of private schools being tax exempt as total twats then you're doing quite well.

It's so tone deaf it beggars belief, and as a result it's REALLY hard to dredge up any sympathy or empathy.

Just two holidays a year after scrimping for school fees? Oh, those poor suffering dears.

People who send their kids to private schools care more about education than those who don't...? Fuck off.

State schools suffering because parents aren't as invested as those parents who send their children to state....? Fuck right off again.

God almighty. Hopefully those children who end up going to state schools as a result of the VAT will now be protected from the negative impacts of the insufferable entitlement and stupidity that comes from their parents.

Pay tax to fund state places they don’t use at point of need.

Pay tax on additional income needed to fund fees.

Those 2 factors on their own provide a benefit to the state sector of about 25k per child per year.

Those payments are the equivalent to the income tax paid by a state school parent earning 100k and also ignores all the rest of the income tax paid.

It’s why many countries provide income tax relief for private school parents.

@Emmanuelll part of the reason people choose private is for that reason… so that like minded parents with kids who want to succeed will mix with their own kids. As someone said upthread… apparently now such parents are expected to influence’ the state sector kids?!

Why would more people using state schools mean larger class sizes? It would mean more classes, the class sizes are limited.

but we also have a baby bust- there are already plans in place for mothballing several primary schools in London due to falling numbers in this year’s reception intake and smaller numbers of children in the next two years coming through.

the fall in numbers compared to the numbers in current year 9 (a boom year across the whole of the south east) means that if next year no one across the whole of the south east used private schools, there would still be enough state places available.

But you can access 'good education' as you put it within the state system. You are choosing to partake in a luxury service so should pay VAT on it.

Some people don't even have the option of remortgaging or having fewer holidays to afford private school because there's no money to start with.

I'm on minimum wage so I don't give two figs about what you've 'given up' in order to afford private school. I could NEVER afford private school even if I gave up all my other luxuries like getting my nails done once a month (£33)

Why do you want poor people to feel sorry for you - we don't!!!

Great post.

@missmousemouth i never said state school parents don’t care about education?

someone said private school parents only care about appearing rich. I corrected that poster and explained that no, they care about the education

It’s why many countries provide income tax relief for private school parents.

Do their high earning childfree people get tax relief too for paying into a system they don't use?

Most working class families struggle to afford one decent holiday a year. Get in the real world....!