How on EARTH do you teach the times tables!?

[Boco]

dd is year 2, her homework is learning the 2x tables. Easy, she can say 2, 4, 6, 8 10 etc. But if you say what is 2x8 she looks blank and says 'what do you mean?'.

I can't seem to be able to explain the concept of TIMESing - I've been saying two lots of, which I thought might help, but she's not getting it. I've shown her a number grid, i've drawn two lots of cakes, four lots of two cakes, six lots two cakes etc - i've written them all down and tried just getting her to memorize - finally I've tried collapsing exasperated as she shouts 'I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT!'

How how how how how?

Bloss - thread hijack alert, but please tell me how to work x/7 + 3x/8 out?? I am not being funny - have taught all my children tables by rote (as I was taught) but one is a maths/further maths wizz kid, two are average, and the fourth is just starting out. I have two degrees but just don't understand anything about what you just posted and it's annoying me

I haven't read all of this, so apologies if I duplicate something someone else has says.

I remember having this conversation with my dad (who was a secondary school maths teacher) when my eldest ds was in Year 2. He pointed out to me that maths is akin to a foreign language - which did explain for me why some children (and adults) have more trouble than others with maths. I really have to work at maths whereas it comes naturally to my dh.

My dad suggested writing out the question part of the times table on one piece of card and the answer on another, for all of a particular set - ie 1 x 7 on one piece, and =7 on another, and so on, then mixing them up and playing games with them - how fast can you match them all up correctly, pelmanism etc.

I used to have to write out my times tables in a grid at the end of maths lessons in primary school, if I had finished my work. Because I usually did finish my work early, I ended up writing them out lots of times, and the repetition did stick them in my memory, though not in the 4 times 7 equals 28 format - I will go through the table to find the one I want - ie 7, 14, 21, 28.

blueskyandsunshine - the reason your dh doesn't understand the quadratic formula is because it never will have been explained to him, which is precisely my point... education system is flawed!

sal, do you have to do this

x/7 = 8x/56
3x/8 = 21x/56

x/7 + 3x/8 = 8x/56 + 21x/56 = 29x/56

of course it's been explained to him trumpet -- he just doesn't understand it!

What has been explained to him? How to use it, or how it was derived initially?

he's asleep, so I'll ask tomorrow, but he was taught by his dad, a maths whizzy whizz, in addition to school, so he might be unusual

I have been taught the derivation-- but I can never remember the formula, I look it up every time

tbd

I remember the formula as I was told I had to know it for GCSE (which I didn't - it was on the exam paper!) But I just had to remember for years that you put some numbers in a magical formula to get some roots out! I asked one of my lecturers at uni where it came from, and it's just rearranging
ax^2+bx+c=0
That would have made so much more sense to me, and I would never have had the problem of having to remember the damn thing to start with! I think everyone would benefit from knowing this, and don't understand why it isn't taught as part of the GCSE.

bluesky - what does the / mean?

Try leaving it for a while- she's only in yr 2, they will repeat it and repeat it and a break can sometimes do marvellous things. I am now paying my 9 yr old to learn hers properly... it is working quite well. Is that bad or good parenting though??

divide by

over

eg 1/2

is a half

so I found the lowest common denominator which is 56

I nearly wet myself at: "Another entertaining evening in the boco house, lining up pennies with my mittens on while shouting 'WHY DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND ME!'"

Thank you!

Message withdrawn

Message withdrawn

I had some horrendous teachers, and some great ones. I don't think the teachers are to blame as much as the education system generally.
I'm really pleased that some children get to see where the quadratic formula comes from... that warms my heart!
I know there are a shortage of maths teachers, but I would hope that any person teaching maths would be capable of completing the square!!!
So I do agree with you on that point, it isn't always the teacher's fault.

Let's say that rote learning is ok. I'm sure that it does come in handy to know your tables... but my argument really is that the understanding needs to come first, otherwise how can you assess if a child does understand, when they can give you the correct answers? It's no good papering over the cracks with something so fundamentally important as multiplication and just hoping that one day it will click. What if it doesn't click? Do you really think a child is going to approach a teacher a few years down the line and say "actually I never understood that whole multiplication malarky"!
This is really a vicious circle. You can argue that knowing your tables is very important and will help with everything that comes afterwards, and hopefully all will fall into place one day.
I will argue that actually there is no need to learn them if you understand the concept (picking them up as I went along worked for me!), and more time and effort should be made at school to make children understand, rather than simply getting the correct answer through any means possible.
So many people think that maths is a waste of time, as they can't use anything but arithmetic in the real world (and you don't even need to use arithmetic in the real world due to calculators and computers!) I just wish that everyone could see how wonderful maths is. I believe that if more emphasis was placed on the ideas behind the formulas and what-have-you, although not necessarily rigorous proofs, then it would be a much more endearing subject.

I loved maths at school and it was one of the few subjects I was good at. I never understood a word any of my teachers said though. I would go home and ask my dad or my elder brother who would explain it and the sun would come out in my head.

I don't know whether I just had particularly bad teachers throughout my school career (doubt it); I think my mind worked in a different way; often some equation would go up on the board, the teacher would say "well I won't explain that bit because it's obvious; I'll show you this part because that's the difficult one". No. Other way round for me almost without exception.

Another example of this. My dad went to some public school or other, boarding since he was 5. His mum wanted him to go to Wellington, but his maths was appalling and he would never get in. One summer holiday he was sent to live with a tutor for coaching. Within 5 minutes of the first lesson, my dad's eyes were opened and he could understand. By the time I was born EVERYONE who knew him, knew he was the one to ask about statistics, logic, mathematics, calculus, the lot (he was also a whizz with languages - why do those go together?) People's minds work in different ways. It is most obvious in maths, but I'm sure it occurs in most, if not all, other subjects too.

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