Is this fraud and what to do.

[froggola]

Please no judgement. DH and I have been living apart for a couple of years but still together. Me and kids will move back into with him in September.
When applying for reception place I put his address as our main residence. I also didn’t say DS goes to nursery. As the nursery he goes to would prove that my house not in the borough is his main residence. I know that is wrong but I made the decision in a moment when filling in the form….Ds got offered a place and now school want a home visit. It’s feeling really stressful. What’s the plan? To go there and fake I already live there? Withdraw the application? It’s making me feel uneasy. I’d appreciate honest advice. I wasn’t intentionally deceitful, but I was. by omitting information and lying about my address. …which will be my address by September. If it makes any difference I’m on the deeds and have owned the house got a decade…

I do know the admission rules for my local authority.

I work in an oversubscribed school and previously worked in one of the most oversubscribed schools in London so I am well aware of application fraud. I also know that teachers are never sent on a home visit to uncover it or ask a single question to investigate it.

There are drop in checks to confirm addresses are long term residential but these are only in cases were addresses can not be confirmed adequately or do not align with council information. Seeing as OP's partner is the named father and has lived there it is unlikely it will be flagged. But even if they did a spot check, which would be unannounced, it likely would have happened by now if it was a very oversubscribed school.

But it is absolute nonsense to suggest a teachers home visit for reception entry is in any way an investigation.

So a check from the school via a home visit as literally stated in the OP 🙄

Spot visits aren’t unannounced.

Home visits are not teachers investigating fraud. Home visits for reception entry children entirely focused on meeting the child and getting to know them. The home visit is not the school checking the admission form is accurate.

The visits to confirm address that you are actually referring to, can be and usually are unannounced when there is suspected fraud.

Is it really that deep? I just can’t comprehend why you care that I’ve called anyone a Karen, my post was even reported and deleted 😅 like really.. this whole thread is just bonkers
and so minor the mind boggles as to how anyone cares.

If you don’t care, why are you posting?

But the child isn't living in the area at the moment. OP's family situation may change between now and start of school. When you do the application, it's not based on where you think you might live, but where you actually live.

If you're suggesting you think I reported it, then you are wrong. I didn't even know it had gone until you said. I don't see the point in reporting anything unless it is truly offensive, which your post was not. Rude, yes, but not offensive.

You're right, it really isn't deep. But if you're going to throw around petty insults (because, let's face it, accusing someone of being a 'Karen' is hardly intended as a compliment) instead of actually challenging anyone you disagree with, you should expect to be pulled up it. It may not be the worst insult in the word, but it's clearly being used to play down those with the opposite opinion, as if they're just making a fuss for no reason. You can't shut people down that easily, expecting them to just accept your insults.

Apparently you don't care, and yet here you are still posting...

Ok 😳

This. You’ve done it now so stop handwringing over it and just do the visit. I personally wouldn’t have any moral issues with this as it’s a house you already own, and will be moving back into in September with the children when they start school. And their dad lives there currently. It’s not like you are completely making up an address altogether. It’s just that you weren’t living there at the time the application had to be in. I know they have to gave their rules but it’s a technicality really.

1. the post doesn’t say teacher it says school.
2. if the teacher is doing the visit like you said for the purposes you said of course they will report if the child clearly doesn’t live there.
3. that’s the entire purpose where you work.

Just move there now ....and hope
Yes it was wrong but u less you're going to admit it then moving now this week is the only way .

Why don't you do yourself a favour and simply Google 'school home visit' to find out what the generally accepted understanding of a school home visit it is and it's purpose.

Yes I am sure if they teacher went and found out that they weren't living there they would alert the school office but OP can decline the visit or just be there for the visit. But the teacher will absolutely not be asking the child any questions about their address.

I think that OP isn’t so much worried about probing address questions but about DS chatting away saying “Katy at nursery showed me how to draw a dog” and the teacher not having a note of nursery attendance, and then that leading to follow up questions to OP on which nursery and why is it in the next town over.

It probably isn’t very likely but OP is aware that she did not fill out the application with full transparency and is worried things will unravel.

So she could either take a chance it will be ok, decline the home visit or take steps now to move in before the home visit - possibly with her or her DH being in the rental with the older one until the end of term. This would reduce but not eliminate the risk of “unravelling”

I think the word 'fraud' is getting everyone very het up. The question is simply, did the address used on the application meet the LA's rules? The answer is, in some LAs yes - in some LAs no. As to what the OP should do, that's her call - she could have the home visit and hope for the best, she could decline the home visit, she could contact the LA for advice etc. But the first thing she should probably do is to look up the rules for her specific LA and check whether she's actually broken the rules or not, as she may be worrying unnecessarily.

If she has broken the rules, then it will depend on how hot her LA is on investigating and applying them. It's not clear, for example, whether she's already provided her address evidence, and whether that's been accepted. Insufficient address evidence is often the first thing that alerts a school or LA to a possible fraud, though sometimes it's another parent dobbing somebody in.

Home visits are just for the teacher to get to know the child they can also be declined they're not mandatory, they aren't the stasi 🤣

And how do you know they didn't genuinely live in the studio flat? Rent is expensive in this economy people do what they have to do

Well said @twizzlet

And how do you know they didn't genuinely live in the studio flat? Rent is expensive in this economy people do what they have to do

Because such an anomaly would have triggered additional checks. If the family passed those, fine.

The reason for some of the harsh responses you've had is that in some areas with very oversubscribed schools, some very sharp elbowed (and financially flush) parents choose to rent/ buy a house (often at great expense) in the catchment purely for the purpose of getting their child into the school. They do not live there or intend to live there and are hence denying a local child from attending the school. Some parents live separately for a few years purely to secure a place in an oversubscribed school (I've heard of one dad with 3 children supposedly permanently living in a 1 bedroom studio - in reality dad rented and "lived" in the 1 bedroom studio and mum and children lived in their main house a few miles away). I know of some children whose parents have claimed they live permanently with relatives in order to get into an oversubscribed school.

Most areas where this occurs have admission teams that are hot on it. Hence why some ask for GP surgery addresses/ bills ect.

As it seems from what you say, you do intend to live at the property come September and dad already lives there I don't imagine you will get flagged up. Or if you do, the fact you will be living there will be taken into account.

Totally agree.

Fraud, when used to describe such a situation, is a word which is naturally going to get people's back up, as it's so often associated with criminal activity or financial gain (neither of which are applicable here). I can see, based on that, why so many are thinking "how the hell is this fraud?".

Fraud - wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain

While many may not see much wrong with the OP's actions, under that definition many LAs would class this as fraud.

Agree - inaccurate application or misleading application might be a better “layman” description than fraud.

ETA though of course the OP using fraud in her title made other posters use it too!

Does your DS (still? Not sure if he has ever lived there) have a bedroom at his dad's? Presumably he has contact and overnights?
I think you did the wrong thing in lying, but from where you are now, I would probably accept the visit, have dad do it but be there as well. And plan an accelerated gradual move - eg weekends when older DC doesn't have school, or just younger DS staying there a few more nights.

Would it really? When my eldest started reception we lived in a studio flat no one batted an eyelid. But then again the teacher did the home visits at each child's nursery because the whole purpose of the visits is for the teacher and child to get to know each other not to make sure the school admin is correct 😂

You wouldn’t necessarily know about the checks 🤷‍♀️ and if you had been renting that flat for some time and you weren’t near a massively popular school, it would raise few flags

But yes, if a family of four starts renting a studio flat near a very popular school 2 months before the deadline, and the year after a different family does the same, and again, and again, the address will be flagged.

And the home visit probably would have been at this child’s nursery, except OP omitted it from the form so as not to give away he was at nursery near her rental rather than near the application address

The person saying that DID work in that area of work.