7+ 2024/25

[Caps0218]

I haven't seen another thread similar to previous years, so thought it would be beneficial to start one as exams are now 1 month away.
I think SHHS, UCS, KCJS and WUS are all in October.

Also - Curious to see if number of applicants are down this year, with Labour's VAT raid.

Tbh whilst I’m not in the 7+ game now, I think often people just go for a name or a through run to 18 (me included!). We’ve gone for through preps where class size is 18 in one and 24 in another. I personally think 24 is too much, particularly without TAs. But, the amount of tuition I understand still happens maybe makes this less of a concern. We don’t tutor and we won’t but we can’t control the current prep parents! X

We come from a big state school with a class of 28. Having a smaller class is nice, but it really comes down to how well the teachers teach and how much care they give each student.

All valid points, but one of the draws (there are many) of an independent school is the small class sizes. Personally 18 vs 25 is huge
City's fees after VAT are the highest after WUS.
They also don't have the facilities of many schools.

Hi @Tiredmumofthreekids how has the 7+ journey been for you so far?

Do you think the ongoing tutoring is to avoid being managed out just before GCSEs? I wonder how common this kind of ‘management’ is in the most competitive 3 boys schools…

Or do you think the excess tutoring is just for the glory of ‘coasting’ through (a top tier) school or being head of the pack? I suppose some kids coming through 7+ are so accustomed to being top of the class that to be anything else would be tough.

I can only say for us and the tutoring up to year 6 - definitely the latter, almost like an addiction to making sure their children remain “top”, even though the schools are top 10-15 anyway. It’s like they can’t cope with their children having a chance of not being “top” - literally mental!
At ours kids aren’t managed out for gcses so it wouldn’t be for this…..

Hey all. We are in the fortunate position to choose between WUS and SPJ. Feels like splitting hairs on choosing which one.
Does anyone know if there is further external tutoring at the 11+ stage at WUS as there is no automatic transfer to the senior school? SPJ kids all go on to SPS so perhaps that's less of a concern there.
Thanks!

Congratulations to your DC on receiving offers from two excellent schools.

Don’t be concerned if your child is in WUS. I’ve heard from current WUS parents that almost all students successfully transition to the senior school without any issues. This is also reflected on the 11+ destinations on their website.

Whilst no explicit exams at 11+, I am sure that SPJS has its own way to retire underperforming students at the end of junior school.

Congrats! I can only say that my friend removed her son from WUS (having many family members having been and also being very pro-academics) as she felt the external tutoring and pressure from other parents and teachers both before and after the 11+ exam to be too much….she said whilst nearly all do progress, it isn’t the “natural” process of just doing your usual work and there’s a lot of talk about it and tutoring/extra work every holiday etc x

@Choccybuttonsandprosecco Unfortunately this is how it is now, due to type of families at these schools. It was not like this many years ago, it was full of naturally bright kids, now it's full on tutoring.

Indeed. She also did a lot of work daily with her son before the 11+ and all during the holidays and he was doing well already, but such is the pressure to make sure you do well in the exams and she felt if she didn’t he would be behind the others.
Having said that, my daughter is in year 5 and one of the few who isn’t tutored it seems and she seems to be keeping up so fingers crossed!

I believe this is why there’s no benefit in cramming for entrance exams to get into a school.

My son is set to attend SPJ, and all of his friends also going there are sticking with their tutors, which makes us feel pressured to do the same. This time, they want to ensure they are well-prepared for the first impression (!) in September, then to ensure that the boys are on par with the very bright students entering at 11+ and 13+ in the coming years.

A mother I know, whose son is at SP (having started at SPJ) and has another boy at WUS, mentioned that the atmosphere felt more stressful at SPJ. Her perspective was that at WUS, everyone is focused on the internal 11+ exams, and most students pass, so it feels more like a community effort, although annoying, rather than competition. With new 11+ and 13+ entrants coming in, those already there don’t really question their abilities. However, at SPJ, the culture is more about the boys competing against each other without a clear standard like the 11+. So, it feels like an ongoing rivalry.

I think they are the same - 11+ or not.

That being said, I've heard differing views on the cultures of these schools. I think a lot depends on each boy's inherent abilities, parenting approaches, and how they originally gained admission to these schools.

So basically if one goes to WUS or SPJ, it’s tutoring/crazy competition all the way through? What about City, Latymer, KCS, others? Can someone else share their perspective as well if they have older kids at these schools so that newbies like us are duly prepared.

I don't believe anyone is specifically stating that. It seems more accurate to say that in every school, there are parents who choose to tutor or even over-tutor their children for various reasons. The most heavily tutored child I know attends a state school and has the 11+ exam three years from now! My main point is that whether or not there is an internal 11+ formality doesn't seem to affect the level of tutoring in a school.

Thanks for sharing. Which school did they end up moving their son to?

Highgate as it’s co-Ed and worked for her others as well. I would say that I don’t think it’s the same across all of those schools considered “top” but it does seem more linked to cultural beliefs about the importance of academics above all else. From my perspective, I would like my kids to do as well as they can academically whilst also doing all the clubs they like and no extra work, but I would also note that amongst my child’s best friends (and those who aren’t tutored) they are amongst the minority of white British students in the school. I certainly don’t mean this from a racist or divisive perspective - more a reality that the majority of parents in SW private schools now originate from cultures where academia and its focus comes from an early age and therefore this continues throughout school. This would be the focus (and music perhaps). One of my children has friends who are not allowed to choose “non-academic clubs” like dance and have to choose maths, languages etc….

The culture at WUS is sickening. Far too many super tiger mums with outside tuitions to take the 7+ 8+ or 11+ and continue all the way to sixth form. If you have SPJ, you should choose SPJ. But then if you have KCS, you should choose KCS instead. It is all a matter of degree. But if you like co-ed, perhaps Highgate and LUS are even better.

I don’t feel any pressure at KCJS, and I heard of only one boy in my son’s year who keeps seeing his tutor. Junior School is a quite relaxed place and I honestly don’t think that even boys from “more competitive cultural background” have tutors. I’m sure the situation might change when they are moved to Senior school.

@2minutesplease what year is your DS in at KCS? @SWparents is your child at WUS?

@Caps0218 why do you think City and WUS have the highest fees? Surely it’s only a matter of time before others catch up….

It has and does but I’m really wary that I’m only providing one perspective which will reflect their values and kids and of which I only know a snippet so…..

@Choccybuttonsandprosecco you are spot on.
The top 3 schools and City also (as they are the only ones who sponsor visas) have a significant number of British Chinese kids. Further back in the thread there was a discussion about this.
In our pre-prep, the 2 offers from SPJS were to 2 British Chinese kids.
Tutoring will continue for all these kids, it's just the mentality of the parents.
@FutureWestLondonMommy WUS feeds and City, I believe are the highest currently, but others won’t catch up…as they all tend to go up by a similar %. The others have reduced theirs pre VAT, CJS and WUS are passing on full 20.

Some ongoing tutoring probably makes sense in a remedial way to help to keep up if fall behind or struggling in an area. A tutor being helpful is not necessarily guaranteed by the way... they need to relate well to the child and teach the right things!

He’s been at KCJS for a few years already.