Positively surprised about ds school experience in the UK

[Rhombus79]

I am curious to know how others who grew up in another country are finding the British education system.

Ds is in Year 1 at the moment and I am quite surprised how much moaning there is on the parents' WhatsApp group about the teachers, about the curriculum, about the amount of homework, etc. I find it hard to relate to be honest.

To be fair, I can only compare it to my own school experiences growing up in East Germany, where school was quite strict and expectations high. I spent many a Sunday evening crying because I was worried not to be able to keep up.

But I feel ds is getting a very rounded education with lots of rewards to keep him motivated. The teachers and teaching assistants are lovely and very approachable and ds likes them a lot. The school is even offering little workshops for the parents to learn about how they teach phonics or timetables. So far, I have a very happy 6 year old who loves going to school and who made huge strides since starting reception. That might just be our experience and others have some serious gripes with the system as it is. I just feel that a lot of parents at my ds school are undervaluing all the hard work that goes into educating their children and nothing is ever good enough.

What do you think?

nice to hear xx

That’s a great thing to post. Thanks for sharing. How do you think your son’s experience would compare with his peers in Germany nowadays?

I have experienced both East German education and the school system of a united Germany. No recent experiences, I am afraid. Maybe someone else can correct me if anything I state is wrong. My biggest gripe with the German system is the separation into different level schools quite early on. If you are less academically inclined, have a migration background or are classed a trouble maker, you often end up in a Hauptschule where you only get a basic education and it's difficult to improve your lot later on. Everyone else gets either a recommendation for a comprehensive secondary or grammar school. In my opinion they should do away with the Hauptschule and the grammar schools. It hasn't done anyone any favours. I also think pastoral care and individual support is much better in the UK and I also get the impression that more effort is put into making sure that no child is left behind.

I have experienced both East German education and the school system of a united Germany. No recent experiences, I am afraid. Maybe someone else can correct me if anything I state is wrong. My biggest gripe with the German system is the separation into different level schools quite early on. If you are less academically inclined, have a migration background or are classed a trouble maker, you often end up in a Hauptschule where you only get a basic education and it's difficult to improve your lot later on. Everyone else gets either a recommendation for a comprehensive secondary or grammar school. In my opinion they should do away with the Hauptschule and the grammar schools. It hasn't done anyone any favours. I also think pastoral care and individual support is much better in the UK and I also get the impression that more effort is put into making sure that no child is left behind.

Well I’m glad to hear that 21st century Britain is an improvement on 20th century East Germany.

Well most countries have improved considerably I would imagine. But my point is, that sometimes parents don't really appreciate what we have today and still find reason to criticize everyone and everything.

Frankly, I agree with you! I was not raised in this country ( we moved when my DD was in year 6), and I am very happy with the teaching here. I think that teachers are mostly very committed and that the teaching methods are really good.
I am not so keen on the fact that you can drop all scientific subjects in sixth form, but I think that the pastoral care is really excellent.
I only think that there is a major struggle to find math teachers, as most math graduates find well paid jobs in tech.
DD's schools have all been academies.

I only really know the domestic education system but I suspect based on the parent engagement you describe that you're at one of the better schools.

Not every school has a parent cohort that in tune with the school they use and the best schools will always be kept in check by parents (which unfortunately is more negative than positive).

I'm British and have never lived abroad or experienced another country's education system and I agree that parents seem to moan endlessly over the smallest things....feel so sorry for the teachers. My dc both loved primary school and I was very happy with their schools.

I have lived overseas and spent time in schools in several different countries. I think a lot of primary schools in the UK are truly excellent. I am less sure about secondary education.

The WhatsApp groups often have a noisy minority, who on occasion can wind one another up so it seems like there’s a bigger problem than there might be. As the children grow up there’s less moaning and more useful reminders!

I’m glad all is going well.

I'm Australian and I think primary education is pretty similar but I'm dreading secondary. They specialise so ludicrously early, have make or break exams too soon, and going to only three subjects after 16 seems nuts - especially alongside not requiring kids to do some form of maths (including vocational maths) and English until 18.

I'm still absolutely gobsmacked that the government fully funds faith schools and lets them favour churchgoers.

Plenty of schools in deprived areas do an amazing job for their pupils.

The extra time we spend safeguarding our vulnerable pupils is taken from the time schools in more advantages areas spend dealing with parental complaints ...

Agree - mine loved primary school teachers. I give credit to the reception teacher especially for her enthusiasm and giving him a great start! If you don't get that it can be hard to turn things around later on.

Some people just love to moan!

My DD's state primary is well thought of by the parents and there's not much moaning on the class chat (or in person const either). The teachers are engaged and committed and there's a nice vibe.

I think primary education is done well in the U.K. However, as a former secondary teacher, I have huge misgivings about secondary education....

To be fair to the other parents they grew up in this system and therefor experienced many of the faults firsthand.

I do think people are unappreciative of what education for all is and should be as a social policy. It’s just something they were made to do for many.

That said I don’t send my kid to school because intelligence is not valued and classism that is enforced here is more subtle than it used to be but very much still an issue.
In the ex mining town I grew up in their were 5 high schools.
4 made factory fodder. None of the kids were encouraged to go to Uni or pursue a career
1 made middle managers and they were moulded to follow authority blindly.

None made high fliers… as the careers advisor told the boy in my year who could make any instrument sing… not everyone can be a rock star, someone has to work in the factories.

I was aware of this at 14 as I had moved from a school that made high fliers, where each of us was expected to go to university and make a difference in the world to one that made factory fodder, where each day was crowd control and teachers got bullied out of the school

Primary education in the UK is relatively child-centred and nurturing imo, despite successive governments' efforts to strip the heart out of it and force teachers to teach solely to the test. The real issues lie in secondaries, which are often split between the extremes of pressure cooker environments or alternatively run on punitive lines like prison camps with children afraid to speak and in detention for forgetting a pencil. Then at the other end of the spectrum you have those schools which are essentially anarchic. The focus on the individual child seems to go out the window.

So from what I can gather, primary education is great but our luck might run out once DS starts secondary school?

How good an indicator is a good Ofsted report, would you think?

It tells you something but you have to consider how old it is and you also have to visit the school. Many ‘good’ schools are much better places than ‘outstanding’ ones which frequently are resting on their laurels

Although don't forget that the UK starts at 4, so they start maths and English early. Plus it depends on your child. Two of mine have really benefitted from being able to specialise early and perhaps would not do so well in a system looking for more general skills. There is also the IB which is good for those wanting a more general sixth form education, I think it is good that there is choice in the system.

That's so funny, I was thinking along similar lines recently. I also grew up in Germany, although in the West. I went to primary school in the mid to late 80s in a small town near the French border. My experience of school was quite positive at the time, and I did well there, but compared to my daughter's school it was very basic and learning was much less fun. Almost no trips or events, certainly no assemblies, or after school clubs. DD is is year 1 and her teachers and school staff are great, really couldn't do more for the children.

I'm pretty sure Hauptschule has been phased out but need to look at that again...

.....in detention for forgetting a pencil.

You're a teacher and you've planned your lesson so that in the second half your pupils will be doing a timed paper and pencil exercise to check their understanding of what you've been teaching in the first half, and practice working to a time limit. The exercise is ready on the whiteboard. One third of your pupils are ready with paper and pencils waiting to start. One third are making a performance of turning out their bags looking for their pencils. One third are calling out 'Miss, Miss, I haven't got a pencil.' Meanwhile the time you had set aside for the test is ticking away, and the children who did come prepared and ready to learn are missing out.

What do you do? And the next day when the same thing happens, what do you do? And again the next day?

That's great to hear and all children should have the same experience. I think it varies from school to school, and in different parts of uk. My dc had a not great experience in one primary and now loves her primary and has come on leaps and bounds academically and socially (2 different parts of uk).