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Primary education

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Original poster

Failing the phonics screening

273 replies

Falcon1 · 25/02/2022 16:49

I've just been informed by DD's school (because I asked) that she only got 21 out of 40 in her phonics screening in December. The pass mark was 32. She is Year 2 (the test was delayed due to covid). She's below expectations in reading and writing and really hates/struggles with reading. Her spelling seems to suggest a lack of basic phonic knowledge. For instance, she recently spelt favourite as 'fafrt' and colour as 'coley'. My question is, is this score (and her struggles) indicative of something like dyslexia, or could she just be a bit of a late developer? I've been concerned about her progress since reception but I keep being told not to worry, lockdown has had an impact on their learning, she'll get it eventually etc etc. The school said they categorically do not support dyslexia assessments as the council won't fund them. I listen to her read every day (which is like pulling teeth as she hates it so much) and I read to her a different book at bedtime, and always have done. We have a reading chest subscription, play phonics games and do Reading Eggs (which she also hates). It just doesn't seem to be sinking in.

OP posts:
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MaizeAmaze · 26/02/2022 10:35

If she is 6/7 dont touch toe by toe for a couple of years. It starts from knowing basic phonic sounds, and is about breaking down words. It made a massive difference to my 10 yr old, but it is deadly dull.

Nelliephant1 · 26/02/2022 10:37

Jolly phonics is the best phonics tool out there. It's colourful fun and it really works. I tutored for many years and this was by far and away the best thing going and worked well for people with dyslexia. Good luck.

ancientgran · 26/02/2022 10:51

@Falcon1

Wow, lots of really helpful advice here, thank you all. We're actually getting her eyes tested today and I know they do hearing tests too, so I'll ask.

She has had a dyslexia screen, which came back as unlikely to be dyslexia, but interested to hear from the poster who said their child ended up being diagnosed despite the negative screening.

RedToothBrush - yes, I had heard that about year 2 as well, and according to DD's teacher, there are plenty of children in the class who are also struggling. Our poor kids.

To the poster who suggested one on one work, lockdown was enough to put me off this for life. She point blank refuses to engage in anything she perceives as 'learning' with me now. I think we are both traumatised by the home learning experience! She does have a tutor however and has had for a year, which is why I think she shouldn't be as behind as she is.

I'll look up all the suggestions here - toe by toe I've heard of and it sounds really interesting. Nessy too.

Thank you everyone

One of my GC really struggled with reading and he also got to the stage where he point blank refused to engage. He liked board games and card games so I bought 2 sets of word cards and would play snap, he recognised the shape of the word and if he called snap I'd say the word and he started to know the words, then we played games like laying out 12 cards and seeing how long it would take him to find all the words starting with "t" or whatever.

So in a few months he had a "word bank" as JBen9 describes. I think it makes it easier for them as now in a sentence he could easily recognise 50% or 75% of the words so only had to struggle with some words not all of them. This started to make reading less of a struggle and gave him confidence.

So in year 2 he was well behind by year 4 he was up to speed. He's now in top set of his English GCSE and doing well.

I think some children don't get off to the best start, covid/sickness/eye sight or just not ready yet and they start to fail and they sort of switch off. With my GS the only help he got at school was being taken out of class by a TA, he hated her, he hated what he did with her and he hated being singled out.

Lots of ideas on this thread which is probably a bit confusing but I hope you find what works for your DD. Good luck.

Zaccat1 · 26/02/2022 10:51

Teach your Monster to Read App has worked well in our house alongside school reading books and weekly trips to the library.
Also the CGP books are pretty good, there is actually one specifically designed for the Year 1 Screening Test.

Feenie · 26/02/2022 11:05

if diagnosed then she's be eligible for extra time in SATs

This is not true. It’s often something that dyslexia tutors helpfully tell parents that I then have to gently untell them. Extra time relies on answering 7 questions and applying - and not one question is ‘do they have a dyslexia diagnosis’? I have dyslexic students who qualify and those who don’t. I regularly have dyslexic pupils achieving greater depth from September - they don’t need extra time. Yet tutors continually insist this is the case. It’s very annoying.

For the OP, I’d recommend Dancing Bears - much more interesting than Toe by Toe.

Feenie · 26/02/2022 11:13

Onset and rime, referred to by a op, is NOT a recommended teaching strategy or research based practice:

www.dyslexics.org.uk/balanced-approach-to-word-reading/

I’d strongly recommend the whole of the above website - its creator, Susan Godsland, is an expert and very active on Twitter.
www.dyslexics.org.uk/

Feenie · 26/02/2022 11:13

Referred to by pp (previous poster), not op.

Beetlebum1981 · 26/02/2022 17:11

@Feenie we have dyslexic children at school who qualify for extra time in the year 6 SATs. I teach children with no SEN 'labels' who will also qualify for extra time due to their very slow reading speed.

Feenie · 26/02/2022 17:15

But dyslexic children do not automatically get extra time - that is my point. The extra time depends on the answers given to 7 questions. Some dyslexic children qualify, some don’t.

Choppingonions · 26/02/2022 21:14

Onset and rime, referred to by a op, is NOT a recommended teaching strategy or research based practice:

Parents working with their children is recommended. There are many ways this can help. It's easy, it's a way in, it can be fun. The op needs to build confidence.

drspouse · 26/02/2022 21:23

@Choppingonions

Favourite and colour are both exception words though.
No they aren't...
Feenie · 26/02/2022 22:03

Onset and time was debunked years ago and is actually particularly unhelpful as a strategy for dyslexic children. You need to read the research I linked to.

JBen9 · 26/02/2022 22:42

Sorry I beg to differ with comments about onset and time not being effective. I've used it many times as a side way steps when children have struggled with world building and phonological awareness. It's infact actually built in to my councils p1 literacy program, therefore very much recommended. I would never rely on any 1 individual strategy or resource, it's about tailoring the teaching to meet the needs of the child, so might be lots of trial and error but you will find a way that they will learn.

Feenie · 26/02/2022 23:03

Or you could use evidence based research to inform your teaching. I do realise that Scotland are fairly behind in the Science of reading, but you could find out for yourself.

mathanxiety · 27/02/2022 03:19

I do realise that Scotland are fairly behind in the Science of reading, but you could find out for yourself.

Ah but are they behind with the reading?

inews.co.uk/news/scotland/scottish-pupils-reading-literacy-performance-slip-education-concerns-402103
Scottish pupils no longer have the best level of reading comprehension in the UK and Ireland, according to a major literacy study published on Thursday.

Children in Scotland have slipped behind their peers in Northern Ireland and are now level with England when it comes to reading standards, the research found.

JBen9 · 27/02/2022 03:22

Well through my own practitioner enquiries I've found that many different resources and strategies have been effective, therefore If required I would tailor a support plan to each individual learner, following what works best for them. With that being said, I've witnessed children succeed using onset and time, including those with a dyslexia diagnoses. As I also said in my comment, it's not one rule fits all, therefore it's important to find out which works best for you, that's where you would look into a variety of resources and strategies. I would also agree Scottish curriculum isn't great, but I'm also taking in to account I attended an English school for the first 4 years of my education, where I struggled with phonological awareness. I could see the word better than I heard it, I developed many strategies to help. One of these were onset and rime, although it wasn't directing taught to me, I recognised the letter shape and could identify it was used I. A similar sounding word. This allowed me to develop my listening skills, and eventually ability to here discrete sounds and apply phonic knowledge too

mathanxiety · 27/02/2022 03:51

files.eric.ed.gov/fulltext/ED604429.pdf

PISA 2018

JBen9 · 27/02/2022 04:28

@mathanxiety

files.eric.ed.gov/fulltext/ED604429.pdf

PISA 2018

Thank you, very interesting to read.
Snog · 27/02/2022 05:15

Research auditory processing disorder OP, it may be this going on.

LincolnshireYellowBelly · 27/02/2022 05:49

If you look at www.nessy.com/en-gb/dyslexia-explained/testing-and-screening it can talk you through assessing and screening.
There is a free screener that can be done which will help identify possible traits.
To be honest, favourite and colour are not words that make perfect sense phonetically. In the case of my children, (year 7 and 4), they can be taught to spell for a test but struggle to retain for actual writing in a class situations. My year 7 has greatly improved over time though

ancientgran · 27/02/2022 20:02

@JBen9

Sorry I beg to differ with comments about onset and time not being effective. I've used it many times as a side way steps when children have struggled with world building and phonological awareness. It's infact actually built in to my councils p1 literacy program, therefore very much recommended. I would never rely on any 1 individual strategy or resource, it's about tailoring the teaching to meet the needs of the child, so might be lots of trial and error but you will find a way that they will learn.
I so agree with you about never relying on any 1 individual strategy or resource. When my GS was struggling and synthetic phonics was getting him nowhere the only strategy the school had was more synthetic phonics. I mean if it demonstrably isn't working with a child even after 2 years of 1 to 1 intervention why would anyone imagine it would suddenly work.

Mind you the school would say it did work for him and his friend, I worked with him and a tutor worked with his friend and the school were very happy that "they" had cracked the problem.

Choppingonions · 27/02/2022 21:16

21:24drspouse

Ha. Ask the Americans what they think.

mathanxiety · 28/02/2022 04:43

@ancientgran, I wonder how much of the credit given to synthetic phonics should actually be awarded to parents slogging away night after night, reading to their children, exposing them patiently to page after page of reading while running a finger under the words, and all the other strategies they employ.

Nat6999 · 28/02/2022 05:24

Ds never "got" phonics, he learned to remember the shape of words, we used to have him read words on billboards & shop names when we were out & about & he learned to read that way. He could fluently read words up to maybe 5 letters long before he started school. He only needed to be told what a word said once & he remembered it but ask him to break down a word & he couldn't do it. Try to build him a word bank to build his confidence, put words around the house so he can learn without knowing he is learning, put bed on his bed & labels on things for him to pick up easily, point out words when you are out & about.