Ken Prep Vs Putney High Juniors

[Rainbows18]

We are very lucky , my DD was offered a places in Ken Prep and PHS. My daughter is rather shy and sensitive but extremely curious and loves to be challenged. The fact that PHS is going is all through is very appealing, but I think Ken Prep seems very strong academically and the school is smaller, fwd thinking and creative.
I would very grateful for any advice and thoughts. Thank you.

Which do you live nearer?

A school run crossing the river will add considerable stress, for both of you.

We live in Fulham but we are looking to move so can potentially live in any of these areas depending which school we choose.

Hi Rainbows18, we are in a similar situation. Should we connect offline to discuss the situation further?

I highly recommend Putney High Juniors

Our daughter is thriving in Reception and can continue to grow without the stress of the 11 plus

Of course if you are keen to do the 11 plus then Kensington prep may be for you

Putney offers a great education with co-curricular and very hands on from the management team

Thanks @starmummy77 for the advice and insight into Putney high. It’s a terrific school.

Hi, we are in the same position here… would be great to connect. It’s a very difficult decision… @Rainbows18 @IBCD

Pitney High is one of the best secondaries in London for girls (and in the country) so a guaranteed through place is not yo be sniffed at. I would probably take it if I were you.

Putney obvs

Thanks so much @DilettanteMum: I completely agree it’s a great secondary school and would avoid the 11+ stresses!

@Rainbows18

Thanks so much *@DilettanteMum*: I completely agree it’s a great secondary school and would avoid the 11+ stresses!

I would choose Ken Prep. ( I have DD at neither school btw)

Ken Prep is GDST anyway and they place girls into all the top schools across London and the South East. It's also one of the best girls preps in the whole country, its simply better than Putney for prep.

She'll get in Putney easily if you still want to go at 11+ anyway, they send many many girls there, but they also send girls to St Pauls, to LEH, etc, etc, a roll call for every great school for girls in the country.

You'll have a much better idea what type of school she's suited for later, and you should keep your options open.

People talk about 11+ stresses, but I'm sorry there are preps and there are preps, a child at Ken Prep doesn't struggle to find a great school.

Ken Prep will guide her to the best school for her ability. Don't settle on Putney. If Putney is the best school for herat 11+, Ken Prep will advise and help you get her placed later.

As a parent of kps child who left recently I can assure you there is absolutely no prep that the school does - it’s very much a collection of very ambitious parents that do what they must to get their children into the best schools. The advice about which school is right for your child is a myth ….you suggest the ones you think you should apply to and they'll basically tell you that they are all fine as long as you have a backup option if that is the golden advice people are referring to? There is a very big change atmosphere at the school to what it was a few years ago quite a few people are leaving as they’re not happy with the provision, it’s all kept hush hush but honestly the staff they have lost in the past 12 months is enough to raise alarm bells. I don’t know PHS as well but I believe the head is much more involved and has been great for the junior school. If I were you I’d take Putney high and if you want to try the 11+ you still can it will be no different than what preparation Ken Prep would give your daughter trust me. Feel free to PM me

@Namethattunein1 - thanks for your thoughts this is precisely why I’m finding it difficult to make a decision as I am concerned I am denying her this great opportunity to meet her full potential and have more options at 11+.

@Parker2809 - thanks for your insight and thoughts and interesting to know of these recent changes.

@Parker2809

As a parent of kps child who left recently I can assure you there is absolutely no prep that the school does - it’s very much a collection of very ambitious parents that do what they must to get their children into the best schools. The advice about which school is right for your child is a myth ….you suggest the ones you think you should apply to and they'll basically tell you that they are all fine as long as you have a backup option if that is the golden advice people are referring to? There is a very big change atmosphere at the school to what it was a few years ago quite a few people are leaving as they’re not happy with the provision, it’s all kept hush hush but honestly the staff they have lost in the past 12 months is enough to raise alarm bells. I don’t know PHS as well but I believe the head is much more involved and has been great for the junior school. If I were you I’d take Putney high and if you want to try the 11+ you still can it will be no different than what preparation Ken Prep would give your daughter trust me. Feel free to PM me

Sorry you've had an experience like that Parker2809

I've heard what you say levelled at all the top prep schools- Ken Prep, Pembridge, Bute, Falkner - that its a collection of tiger parents that do what they must to get their DC into the best schools. That change is afoot, staff have left, it's nothing like it used to be. But I note you don't write 'Ken Prep is a bad school', no-one does when they say these things about the other best preps. Also you don't mention your DD ended up at a terrible school. Schools expect a certain type of girl when a Ken Prep applies, and that 'brand' is to certain extent what you buy into , but if you think the teaching quality is low and the care is low, you should state this.

Perhaps some parents expect something 'special' given the status of these preps and are surprised (like any primary school in the land) that so much is expected from the parents - I'm not saying you're one of them, you experienced the school I didn't.

but after all is said and done the facts:

• Ken Prep send girls to the best senior day and boarding school, There's zero chance of that changing any time soon.

• A child at Putney is expected to stay until she's 18, if the parent wishes to try out somewhere new at 11+, they won't get any help from the school anyway. She'll also be leaving all her cohort at Putney, this is HARD at 11 and something parents often overlook.

BUT at Ken Prep the DD cohort will be applying to the top boarding and day schools across London and the South East. Which goes back to my post, giving your DD options at 11.

Lastly the OP is in Fulham, Ken Prep is the local school,

I have two kids at secondary. And I don’t think you can chose the one that will fit her at the age of 4.
Prep school in this area always change and evolve. Teachers come and go. There are always some happy parents and some highly critical parents in any school.
But broadly speaking the ‘academic’ schools (KP, G, FH….) reliably get their girls into top secondaries year after year. That doesn’t change despite all you may hear about teachers turnover, etc.
And Putney High is normally a backup school for the top cohort in the academic schools.

So - by choosing to avoid 11+ you are essentially giving up on giving your daughter a chance to go to SPGS, G&L, LU, etc.
Putney would not prepare her for those.

I would recommend choosing PHS over Ken Prep. We didn't accept PHS junior and went with Ken Prep in year 4 and it was a huge mistake for us anyway.
Daughter did 11 plus last year and was only waitlisted for PHS because she became so stressed out and the support was non existent and she was one of a number of girls who underperformed. We didn't tutor but the school never indicated that she needed extra help and I did ask them many times. I don't think she was ever really taught maths either but instead was given maths challenges and exam papers which was very discouraging.
The Ken Prep results, as are all preps, misleading. Some girls get very few offers or none at all. We only got a few although I accept this may have been down to the ISEB switch. From what I know only about 14 girls got all those offers including SPGS. I was never in the loop with the mothers but I believe many children were tutored to their eyeballs.
If your daughter is capable of the Hammersmith schools and she wants to move, it perhaps just wants a change of school by the time the exams are coming around, you can always tutor her. You will have to anyway at Ken Prep. Or wait for a Ken Prep place further down if you can see she is that sort of child who is willing to be pushed. I wouldn't recommend this school as a happy or healthy environment for a sensitive child no matter bright they are. It's not a very nurturing environment and teaching wasn't inspiring apart from Science. Daughter is now at a state school and reunited with many primary friends and has made a ton of new friends. I am not even sure if Putney would have been right for her but Ken Prep really did some damage to her self confidence and ours in private education.
Best of Luck!

Namethattune I’m really surprised how much of a strong opinion you have of ken prep as someone without a child there or PHS ? I’m not sure anyone would be that confident promoting the school they have no personal knowledge of. The original poster clearly mentions her daughter was shy and sensitive and I stand by my comment that Ken Prep is the wrong school for that type of child especially If that child is bright as the lack of pastoral care and support will do damage to their confidence. It is not a “bad school “ for a robust outgoing and self starter child that needs little Teaching but then neither is any school for a kid that can get on with it. And no I don’t have unrealistic expectations of the school, very basic ones actually and kps has failed on those. I agree with eglantine above - our daughters were in the same year it sounds like and yes the results on the website are very misleading and maths teaching is non existent- we ended up getting a tutor thank god.

OP - I’d take individual super glowing or super negative reviews of any school with caution as every child is different, and circumstances are specific to the particular child.

@eglantine7 I am sorry to hear about your experience. I think coming from state into an academic prep is hard, especially as late as Y4. And covid has hit in the middle of preparations for 11+ - which didn’t help matters. My daughter did 11+ last year as well, so I know how messy it all was last year with introduction of ISEB that schools weren’t familiar with or prepared for.

On specific points - re math challenges and past papers - I strongly disagree. Those are quite useful as teaching tools and are normally used to familiarise and prepare kids.
And interestingly - a friend with a daughter same year as yours in KP kept saying last year that that haven’t done a single past paper in math….
So the same school, very different perspectives. She also was quite critical of the lockdown teaching but her daughter did well in the end. In fact, I don’t really know many parents going through 11+ last year who were happy with online provision in any of the preps in the area.

I’ll also make another point about 11+. I do think, given my experience over the years, that it is possible to pass 11+ without additional tutoring. But it is very difficult to go through 11+ without some parental involvement. If your daughter was struggling with math during the year when she was mostly studying at home - it must have been visible to you as well. And with a little bit of involvement at your end - you a as could have helped her. No school is perfect and things can sometimes fall through the cracks.

ISEB last year was done at the kids own primary schools. Same place where they did their learning, practice and other tests. If your daughter struggled even with that setup - there is nothing any school could have done. As compared to a normal 11+ - with 100+ kids taking paper tests at a large unfamiliar hall - ISEB was a 11+_light.

Most important thing is that your daughter ends up in a school where she is comfortable. And she seems to be in a right place.

Trust me we did all the maths prep with her. And I did a lot of comprehension but she was above average for English in her cohort. Maths was where she had gaps but we covered all with her.
I reiterate the school did not add any value to the 11 plus process whatsoever, not even before the ISEB switch. Really and truly.

@Parker2809

Namethattune I’m really surprised how much of a strong opinion you have of ken prep as someone without a child there or PHS ? I’m not sure anyone would be that confident promoting the school they have no personal knowledge of. The original poster clearly mentions her daughter was shy and sensitive and I stand by my comment that Ken Prep is the wrong school for that type of child especially If that child is bright as the lack of pastoral care and support will do damage to their confidence. It is not a “bad school “ for a robust outgoing and self starter child that needs little Teaching but then neither is any school for a kid that can get on with it. And no I don’t have unrealistic expectations of the school, very basic ones actually and kps has failed on those. I agree with eglantine above - our daughters were in the same year it sounds like and yes the results on the website are very misleading and maths teaching is non existent- we ended up getting a tutor thank god.

@eglantine7

This is very confusing, your DD went to KP when she was Year 4, when the vast majority join in Reception?? And she joined from state primary??

You say she was waitlisted for PHS, yet is now at state school with lots of friends from her primary?

This all sounds very very unusual. And to be frank, I'm not surprised you had a bad time. Ken Prep is not the type of school a girl from state primary school goes to in Year 4, I can't imagine why you would even do it that late.

But I'm glad she is settled and happy in her secondary school now.

@Parker2809

My comments reflect the school, comparing KP to PHS Junior. Anyone can judge that objectively and having no DD at either school one can remain objective- I'm no KP parent defending the school or someone who had an awful experience like you. I didn't love it enough to want to send my DD there, you did.

The OP just has to search KP Mumsnet and see countless threads of happy parents. As @MMmomDD said , there are always horror stories - doesn't matter if its KP or St Pauls or Wycombe Abbey- all of them have kids who came a cropper,

It's a joke to think one can determine what 11+ school is suitable for a 4+ old.

Which is why I would advise any parent to keep their options open. I wouldn't send my DD to an all through school at 4+, I would consider LEH at 7+ or indeed JAPS from the start, but you get my drift, the school would have be exceptional and PHS isn't, it's a great school, but not exceptional.

Talking of exceptional, with Covid, we've all had exceptional years, so like us all going through a pandemic, these are not normal times. My prep only last week has decided to bring in some Covid measures , we're still not out of the woods yet with the disruption. I'm not dismissing your claims, just putting them into context.

I truly am sorry you had a horrible experience, but that's the risk in any school for our kids, doesn't matter what school it is.

Objective - maybe but informed - not. Nothing that I wrote shows we’ve had a “horrendous” experience to be clear just not positive . I have just written to the OP that the school is not nurturing nor supportive or preps in the way that you seem to think it does. This is not an opinion it is a fact supported by many parents who are at the school. I would urge you to speak to Parents at the end of their time at Ken Prep not those in the early years it really will be a very different perspective I assure you. Anyway it’s not my job to convince you I was just hoping to pass on some information to the OP who specifically mentioned characteristics of her daughter I’m very familiar with in my own child and felt it would be useful for her decision but of course that is only hers to make.

I had a "shy and sensitive" DD at KPS a few years below the other ex KPS parents commenting and I think they reflect the mood quite accurately. Even the parents of the "superstars" who get into every school etc know that they had to take things into their own hands. And not all friends from different preps were unhappy with lockdown provision, Falkner for example seems to have done an amazing job.

I agree with @Parker2809 that it is surprising someone with no inside knowedge of the school would defend it so fiercely while questioning ex-parents who actually have insider experience. Of course, as someone else mentions above you always need to take highly criticial comments with a grain of salt in case they come from a minority of unhappy parents, but at least you have been warned that the school won't work for everyone and that your child won't have a huge advantage at 11+ vs PHS.

PHS actually also supports parents who do the 11+ and the curriculum is near identical to KPS, quite a few of the PHS kids do the 11+ at G&L and or SPGS to "upgrade" and those with the respective ability and preparation do so successfully - the school just won't announce it openly.

@Parker2809

Namethattune I’m really surprised how much of a strong opinion you have of ken prep as someone without a child there or PHS ? I’m not sure anyone would be that confident promoting the school they have no personal knowledge of. The original poster clearly mentions her daughter was shy and sensitive and I stand by my comment that Ken Prep is the wrong school for that type of child especially If that child is bright as the lack of pastoral care and support will do damage to their confidence. It is not a “bad school “ for a robust outgoing and self starter child that needs little Teaching but then neither is any school for a kid that can get on with it. And no I don’t have unrealistic expectations of the school, very basic ones actually and kps has failed on those. I agree with eglantine above - our daughters were in the same year it sounds like and yes the results on the website are very misleading and maths teaching is non existent- we ended up getting a tutor thank god.

"strong opinion" ?

It's a prep part of the west London little clique of preps that send girls to top schools. That's not a 'strong opinion' it's a fact.

We didn't attempt to send our DD there, you did, so you obviously had a stronger opinion of the school than I, as did any other parent who sent their DD there.

The OP daughter is 4+, who knows what school will be suitable at 11+, I was simply saying keep your options open. Id tell someone to send their DD to a ANY decent prep not attached to a senior school to keep their options open.

That's it.

Ken Prep is not the type of school a girl from state primary school goes to in Year 4

That's quite a shocking indictment for the school.

The school is selective, and chose that girl. If the pastoral care is so weak that a pupil they have selected ends up so miserable her family feel they have to move her, then that is bad. And is definitely underperformance in comparison to other preps.

Thank you everyone for all your comments and contributions. They have given us a lot to think about and hopefully will make the right decision for our DD.