Serious stuff. 5year old’s disruptive behaviour at school

[Bristolmum9]

He is one of the youngest in his year but that does not excuse his attention seeking behaviour. He now only attends mornings at school’s insistence but is still being very difficult. He is improving at home. We have referred him to a paediatrician and realise there maybe a vary of causal factors. We appreciate that he is a management problem for school.
What help should we expect from school? What can we reasonably ask for.

We've had cuts to every service, speech and language assessments of 4 and 5 year old primary school pupils are now carried out by telephone!

Speech and language assessments here are NHS Speech Therapy services. Not LA services. Yes, they are chronically short staffed and assessments are slow.

I’m not sure schools have to use their own LA Ed Psychs if the funds are devolved. I believe they can purchase any service they want. So if there is only 3 it may not matter if they purchase from another provider.

ActuallyTAs do speech and language tests via a computer program

There is a world class, absolutely free, speech and language clinic at Reading University, where they train students. It's supervised by astonishingly experienced and excellent practitioners. One has identified issues in my son nobody ever had before, and they are so obvious once they were picked up on.

You can email to get on the waiting list. Best thing we ever did. www.reading.ac.uk/Psychology/Clinicsandcentres/pcls-paediatric-clinic.aspx

Sorry, but the suggestion that a TA with a computer programme can identify complex SLT difficulties is pretty insulting to the skilled medical professionals in this field. And I say that as someone who often finds TAs very much more capable of supporting kids with additional needs than teachers, because they have more time and can have more interest, and quite often are sent on more specialist courses. But that doesn't make them medically qualified!

TAs cannot do complex tests for Speech and language delay or recommend what help should be forthcoming. Let alone what educational setting should be provided. Not everyone can get to Reading either!

No, sadly I do appreciate that. It's a long drive for us, but doable. But I wanted to let people know it exists so that it can at least help some.

Green tulips is referring to a screening tool used by many schools https://speechandlanguage.info for early identification. It isn't a substitute for SaLT intervention and I'm sure no one was suggesting it is but it does provide a diagnostic which is useful when making a referral and it's something that therapists often ask for.

I agree. So much of language assessment is about nuances. At DD2's ASD assessment, the (highly specialised in ASD) SALT picked up that DD2 had used the word 'ambushed' 3 times when describing some pictures. You couldn't instruct someone to notice that.

My son aces all the formal language testing. But, as the SALTs commented, "he can't hold a simple reciprocal conversation about a book." He also lacks the ability to sort his ideas into simple narrative form - and he's an avid reader, who was reading to 16 year old level at 9. Spiky profiles are really common with ND children (and adults, come to that) but the basic tests aren't calibrated to identify that. You need professionals to do so.

How many sessions was your child offered please? I understand this is an old thread but hoping you might read my message :)

@Bristolmum9

What a wonderful lot you are! It was so supportive reading all your messages this morning. I will take time to consider the points made. We have a meeting with Head end of next week to consider way forward and I want to go in knowing what options we can ask for. I fully accept that for his classroom teacher he must be a bit of a nightmare. She has a TA in the mornings but not the afternoon and I think he probably gets one to one with her in mornings. He is a bright little boy but hates his reading book that he takes home. I say he is attention seeking because the school is saying that, also that he is emotionally and socially immature. By the way he has also been swearing. He has older brothers. Things at home have not been brilliant and we are doing what we can to change this. I will contact LA re his exclusion but wonder how good it would be for him let alone rest of class if he runs amok in afternoons. I’m surprised that even with rewards and time out in Head’s study when disruptive, these strategies have not made any significant different. The Head says no easy fix. I’m also surprised that he still wants to go to school. We have asked about him repeating Reception year but Head talked against this, friendship groups etc. We have also thought of changing schools but the good schools are full although we could put his name on waiting lists as a back up plan. Resources are so scarce and take so long to access even when what doors to knock on.

I think you’re right to see it from the schools point of view without being defensive. The TAs morning is probably taken up with helping your son (and the teachers time) which leaves very little attention for the other 29 children. I’m surprised parents haven’t complained about the throwing chairs especially.

What’s he like at home?
What behaviour is he seeing at home?
Does he have firm boundaries at home with real consequences for negative behaviour?
Are you turning a blind eye or giving treats to get him to behave so he doesn’t see being badly behaved as a big deal?

Zombie thread! 🙄