Is it ok for a male teacher to say to an 8 yr old ‘only dogs sniff bums’?

[reallyconfusedmostofthetime]

My 8 year old daughter came home and said a boy in her class had chocolate on his face and her male teacher had said to him ‘only dogs sniff peoples bums’. I was horrified, checked with a friend I trust and my sister also once a teacher if I was right to be and emailed the head saying I was concerned that it showed a lack of judgement on the teachers part. The head wasn't concerned and I got a very dismissive reply. Is it ok? Have I got it wrong? Am I being a prude? Is my whole idea of teacherhood wrapped up in Matilda’s relationship with Miss Honey..?.It’s entirely possible...

I'm a bit on the fence however leaning more towards sympathy with this teacher. Only you were there to hear the "bane of my life" comment OP but as others (including teachers) have said this could meant as absolute affection for a child. Without context and only taking the account from children (often not a representation of what actually happened) the pushing into the table may not exactly be that. And until you know what has happened and the context I think it's unfair and dangerous to label this bullying.

And yes this age group love a poo joke. Again you probably need the context and full story before getting outraged.

I also agree with FindAPenny that some gentle "teasing" isn't bullying but can help our kids build resilience.

However I say with splinters in my arse if you have concerns maybe you need to have a chat with the teacher to find out exactly what's been happening and said. Once you have a fuller picture you can better judge what to do next.

Totally fine to say had the child actually been trying to sniff someone's bottom. Otherwise, really not.

Well, I would never have understood sexual innuendo, homophobic joke or otherwise from this comment/joke. It's a stupid poo joke FGS.

Poor guy doesn't revere your precious DD like you like and so you don't like him. Your DD is now snitching as she knows you don't like him.

You say he is a man which is a very odd thing to say.

To write to the head on behalf of someone else is dreadful, to suggest more training etc is appalling, you are doing yourself no favours.

Sending personalised notes 'just for her', hugs, making her fell loved is bloody creepy and look at the precedent it has set!

Disagree about it being impossible to find good teachers mid-year. If a post becomes available that a teacher wishes to apply for then the notice period is usually a half terms notice (8 weeks). I've worked in education a long time and staff leave mid-term all the time- it's not a reflection of their capability- it's about the right job at the right time!

I think he sounds like an idiot. Presumably bane comment was a joke but just sounds off. And pushing kids, even as a 'joke", sets a bad example to other children. Yanbu! This wouldn't fly at my kids school and Yes the teachers do have a sense of humour and plenty of personality!
In my experience, anyone who describes themselves as having a big personality is usually a twat!

Idblow your username almost made me spit my lunch out laughing

I'm finding it hard to get part you wanting the teacher to make your dc feel loved and special. I feel like that desire is clouding this whole thread.

Are you working with the school to solve your dd's (presumed) behaviour OP?
Because I'd be very concerned about mine if she told me her teacher thought she was the band of his life.

Teachers will soon have to communicate with kids using pre-approved scripts so as not to cause offence.

Different teachers have different teaching styles.

Just because he doesn't have the same style as previous teachers does not make him a worse teacher.

If I'd had Miss Honey teaching me in Primary school I would have been bored spitless and had no respect for such an utter wet blanket. I responded far more positively to teachers who could joke around and be silly while still maintaining order and imparting knowledge. For example our Primary Head once did a full assembly on blowing raspberries, and how to maximise length and volume. The entire school sat there and blew raspberries right at him for about 10 minutes, and then he explained how musicians use their diaphragm to breathe more effectively than most people do.

Can you see Miss Honey doing that? Seems unlikely. However that bit of knowledge has stuck with me all my life.

Maybe the joke he told was on the line as to what is/is not appropriate, but to display this level of fearmongering on top of pulling his gender in as though that was even slightly relevant is just sad. Would you think a woman teacher who told a slightly risque joke was "maybe indicating something worse....?

I doubt it.

"Having worked in Education for years, I know perfectly well good teachers are not available mid year! " nonsense good teachers move schools mid year all the time. You don't know whether the teacher has recently moved into the area and wanted a job nearer to their new location or were unhappy in their previous school and were looking for a position in a better school or were actually head hunted because of the skills they can offer.

Personally I'd not make the remark but neither would I be offended.

Surely it's just a bit of a gross poo joke. Not an ideal thing to say but hardly shocking. I wouldn't think twice about it.

I want them to feel loved at school.
This is a bit ott. Appreciated, understood, valued, but loved?

Can you volunteer for a morning ( and go with AN OPEN MIND) to see what he is actually like?

Having worked in Education for years, I know perfectly well good teachers are not available mid year! They are not.

This is horseshit- people relocate with partner's work, people take opportunities that come up mid-year because they are right for them (nearer to home, wanting a change of sector etc). Lots of reasons.

I'm also dubious about Miss Honey. She needed some safeguarding training.

Honestly considering this wasn't even said to your dd. I think you will come across as totally batsh't to the principal. I'd pick my battles so that when something serious does pop , they'll be taken seriously not as bring that parent who complains about every little thing . If you think bring 'that parent ' won't have an impact on your daughter indirectly then you are wrong. I see it all the time where teachers aim to minimize contact with parents who are known to be difficult and as a result their kids don't get picked for anything out of the ordinary eg school plays because they feel the parent will be difficult. I suppose if you are going to be that parent. At least make sure it's something worth fighting for not about a tasteless joke said to another persons child.

Also, some of the pupils who I might have jokingly described as the bane of my life, were also my favourite ones. I would not describe a child as the bane of my life if they really were one of the challenging and irritating (sorry but some of them are) ones!

this ^. I've had this sort of thing said about my dc, in front of them on different occasions, from different teachers / coaches / leaders, because they know my dc have a sense of humour and understand exactly what is meant by it. Of course it isn't meant literally.
The poo comment was possibly a little ill-judged, but completely OTT to "e-mail the head" about it, let alone then contact him again once he has acknowledged your e-mail.
Even if the teacher had said something really wrong, I would expect, and trust the HT to deal with it once raised, not report back in fine detail exactly how the conversation was going to go and how it would feed into appraisal etc.

I'm more concerned about your description of the previous teachers, tbh. Not really appropriate to be going around giving lut lots of hugs to 6 and 7 yr olds.

You are right to challenge him.
I would do the same.

I'm a teacher and wouldn't say it, but I don't think it's complaint worthy. Kids love talking about poo!

It’s a fine line between a teacher with a personality and a creep, I would definitely keep an eye on it I know everyone has different personality’s but a teacher is supposed to be a role model and a professional and making strange comments like that is weird I would definitely keep an eye on his behaviour.

You hear that a teacher has allegedly assaulted a child and THIS is what you get narky about?
🙄

I've reiterated several times all this is being reported to her by a coddled 8 yr old who knows Mummy doesn't like said teacher, how accurate are any of the tales?

Said 8 yr old is not getting her 'usual' level of attention (from a woman ) and doesn't like it.

Used to being 'teachers pet'

I agree with Bookworm.

Given you've already spoken to the head about it so they are aware of the possible issue, I'm not sure why you want to raise this again.

Young kids are not the most reliable reporters of events and your comments about the teacher ("y'know he's nothing like me") give a pretty clear indication of the sort of message your DD is picking up from you.

Possibly a little inappropriate given the age of the child, if it was y6 or secondary then I'd have thought it pretty funny! But 8 may be a bit young for that sort of joke. Not worth getting your knickers in a twist over though.

Also trying to work out the significance of the teacher being male?

Surely the significance of the teacher being male is that men are far,far more likely to be sexual predators than women and the first stage of grooming a child is pushing the boundaries with sexual language to see how the child reacts.

Discussing the differences that DC experience is a great way of getting perspectives into their minds.

I think poo jokes are just as funny as the next person; however, it is close to the knuckle when its targetted at a child that's feeling uncomfortable about that, and a decent teacher will realise theyve totally missed the mark and follow it up with something reasonable.

Telling people what a big personality you have, sounds arrogant, and foisting inappropriate [personalised] jokes on children that obviously haven't appreciated it, plus pushing a child into a desk, is all adding up to a teacher who isn't clear on boundaries.

AFAIK you do lay your hands on children in any way, and I'm not someone who thinks a child who's hurt and is crying shouldn't get an arm round a shoulder or for very young ones sat on a lap for a cuddle. Showing yourself to care is boundaries as is being a boorish teacher who's up himself and pushes his pupils around and make crude pointed jokes at others expense.

It all hinges on the heads boundaries for his teachers. As a new teacher that he's probably recruited he's fairly invested in wanting/needing this to work out.

Have you spoken with other DMs about him? Have you heard any other derogatory remarks/incidents?

Tbh I would be raising it direct with the teacher to gauge their response, and their side of events also. If you have a shy and unsure DD it can feel overwhelming and scarey, and he's needing to moderate ang regulate himself as not all will respond well to his style. He needs to recognise that if it's affecting children's access to learning.

You might find, on speaking directly to him that he's a completely reasonable sort, and sensitive to his pupils reactions. Him saying he's a big personality should be accompanied by an acknowledgment that his style, anybatyle that's strong, is going to rub some up the wrong way, and need insight on his part to be flexive around his learners styles.

If he's continually targeting pupils for crude jokes, pushing individuals into tables and putting his 'big personality' above the needs of his pupils, someone does need to do some moderating for him! Enforce some bounadries and regulation.