repremanded for not believing in god

[Unagray]

Today my son was sternly repremanded for telling his teacher he did not believe in god. He told me he thought it was important she knew and was deeply upset from her reaction! I am utterly furious! What are my rights here? Surely this is unacceptable? I am trying to handle this rationally but I am seething. Added note... school is not C of E... but does have whole school worship.. (national curriculum?)

Presumably if your ds 'hates God' - and by association religion - then you should have withdrawn him from the Nativity play. After all, it's a religious story, or perhaps you weren't aware?

I think it was your fault for allowing him to be sucked into a religious drama. In future I would insist on him being withdrawn from such brainwashing activities.

AppleKatie
I'd just ignore grinch. Sadly they could be very serious as there's always a bunch of 'argh report the teacher! Call ofsted!!' idiots who turn up on school threads. It's like crack to them. I'm starting to realise there's no point engaging because they just sitr shit up for effect and their own agenda.

OP You sound very sensible and reasonable.
If the teacher did tell him off for not believing in God then that is unacceptable.
From the info you've given, however, I would imagine he was told off for interupting, being rude etc and then has come home saying 'i was told off JUST for saying I don't believe in God'.

It's worth having a chat with the teacher about this. Keep being reasonable OP and I'm sure it will get resolved.

“ I absolutely agree that other people’s views should be respected”

I don’t. People should be respected. Their beliefs, not necessarily.

You can’t seriously believe that a bit of bread physically changes into the flesh of a man who died 2000 years ago. Or that God impregnated a woman through some spirit. >> Fine.

You must be stupid to believe such nonsense. >> Not fine.

This isn't going g to be popular but with respect "your babies" have been at the school for three weeks and you appear to have already formed an opinion that the school is forcing religion on them as non believers, it's ok for your son to say he hates god after a nativity because well, he can be crazy and disruptive at times.

I am guessing he was being just that and was shocked that at this school he got told off for his behaviour and is embarrassed and upset that this didn't go down well when he was trying to make new friends and possibly show off a bit.

I would be interested to hear what the teacher has to say.

Winchester if you had read my analogy in full you would have noticed that I said the discussion was about reading promoting empathy etc, not about the mechanics of reading. Not everyone does agree that is the purpose of reading.
You also seem to have assumed the teacher's faith. The teacher could be an atheist too.
This isn't actually about religion. It's about respect, both for other's beliefs and for the teacher.

I did read your analogy in full, thanks. And I still disagree.
And while we may not know the teacher's faith, I think it's extremely unlikely an atheist teacher will talk about 'the importance of belief', value of it maybe. 'Importance' implies, well, importance.

I don't see what's wrong with what he said. He's probably fed up with the weekly RE lessons, the daily collective act of worship, the nativity etc... and getting annoyed, as I am too, that atheism is a taboo subject in Britain in 2018.

Well 2017, that is.

I don't see what's wrong with what he said. He's probably fed up with the weekly RE lessons, the daily collective act of worship, the nativity etc... and getting annoyed, as I am too, that atheism is a taboo subject in Britain in 2018
It has to be 'broadly christian in nature'. So most schools (certainly at secondary) do assemblies on themes that are 'broadly christian' aka awareness if poverty, treating people kindly, raising awareness of inequality but they also tend to be more generally philosophical.
The nativity is part of the christmas tradition. Don't like it thenwithdraw your child. It's a cultural thing in many places rather than a specific act of worship.
RE is not teaching children ti be religious. It is teaching them about religion but don't let that fact get in the way of your victim narrative.

Your post sounds as silly to me as Britain First claiming it's whitr people who are victimised or men claiming 'the odds are stacked against men these days'.

MaisyPop - no idea what you're on about.

Winchester you disagree that not everyone thinks reading promotes empathy despite the numerous studies that discuss both positions? And you disagree that atheists talk about the importance of belief in certain contexts? Gosh, don't Google those studies either then. You may have to admit you're mistaken.

bitlost
You are acting like poor atheiests are somehow marginalised and athiesm is taboo etc.
It just sounds a bit if a silly victim narrative

But we are marginalised. Atheism is not on the curriculum. My daughter was picked on rather viciously for not saying her prayers at school camp recently. A colleague's jaw hit the floor when I mentioned I wasn't baptised. My in laws asked me to baptise my daughter when they know full well DH and I are atheists. The list goes on.

And by the way, I'm not a victim. I'm bloody headstrong.

"It just sounds a bit if a silly victim narrative"

Really? That's usually the preserve if the poor persecuted Christians!

BertrandRussell
I think we are a generally tolerant society on the whole so am skeptical of individuals playing marginalised top trumps.
(I say this as a church goer who deleted some acquaintances from social media for their endless evangelical posting about why christians are oppressed because we don't accept homophobia in polite society)

I also asked my son if atheism was taught in RE....apparently not. We also had a discussion that if it really was 'Religious Education' then why doesn't it cover all aspects of the religion - the good and the bad. Education about religions shouldn't just tell them the stories of that religion and about festivals in my view, in the same way that the subject of history doesn't just cover the good bits of history and english covers grammar and isn't just about reading fun books.

At the outset of RE classes, pupils should have agnosticism and atheism explained to them so they can understand all the views of children and their families in the school, rather than children just being taught that some people believe this stuff, others believe other stuff and we all have to tip-toe around these things without ever questioning them in case we're called disrespectful.

That said, I can't believe in 2017/2018 we are still teaching RE in schools. It should have no place, especially in primary. Think what science and computing they could learn during that time and how useful that would be for their future life.

Absolutely agree! Well said! The more we all discuss this subject the sooner changes will happen. It is utterly ludicrous for us to ‘tip toe’ around a subject which so dramatically affects our world everyday.

Middleaged: you seem to have no idea what is contained in the agreed syllabus for RE in schools. Look at the current one for your LA and you will find lots of good topics in it about understanding the world, other peoples beliefs and the attempt to be academic and personal. It does really attempt to explain religion to non religious people in an evangelical way.

It is not about acts of worship: it is about understanding and tolerance. Whatever a child has been taught by parents at the age of 7, saying you hate God is intolerant and is not acceptable behaviour. The whole idea is to tolerate other positions and for others to tolerate yours. Being outspoken and saying you hate something at age 7 (that others clearly love) isn’t good behaviour.

The RE curriculum is not going away anytime soon. Perhaps tolerance is something we all should learn, relious or non religious. It’s a good trait.

Agreed bubbles.
Our y11s were talking about their mocks after the holidays and they were on about how they have to compare different faith viewpoints to their own personal worldview.

E.g what different branches of christianity and islam believe and how far it is similat/different to theirs.

Atheism isn't taught... because it is not a religion and the subject is RELIGIOUS studies.
At a level when some providers opt to teach 'Philosophy and ethics' a level, there are broader views, philosophies and ethical viewpoints because it's 'philosophy and ethics' not 'religious studies'.

If anything, I think the need for religious studies is increasing to avoid people of all faiths and none getting to the point of only chatting to people like them and dismissing other views whilst claiming that their branch of Christianity/Islam/athiesm etc is somehow a persecuted group and poor them.

I wonder if there are any SACRE's which do define atheism as a religion and include it in their syllabus explicitly - it's obviously controversial to define what a religion is, let alone what atheism is.

Certainly agree that religious studies is necessary, especially as the majority of people without a faith are irreligious now, rather than explicitly atheist.

The topic of atheism should be taught in schools.. It used to be part of the syllabus and has been taken out at some stage under the previous Tory government. As I said above, my DD was rather viciously attacked by two girls for not saying prayers at school camp. I find it sad that there are girls who are so ignorant in her school that they don't know what atheism is. It's not a sign of a modern country, is it?

“I wonder if there are any SACRE's which do define atheism as a religion”

Nobody with a dictionary and a brain can classify atheism as a religion, since it is the absence of faith in a God.

“it's obviously controversial to define what a religion is, let alone what atheism is.”

It’s not. Atheist is someone who listens to God stories and replies “That makes no sense. I dont believe any of it”. Atheism is therefore lack of belief in a God.

“Certainly agree that religious studies is necessary, especially as the majority of people without a faith are irreligious now, rather than explicitly atheist.”

You have conducted polls that show this?

I would be interested to know how you came to the conclusion that most people without religious belief still believe in God.

“At the outset of RE classes, pupils should have agnosticism and atheism explained to them so they can understand all the views of children and their families in the school,”

In my experience, you don’t actually need to explain atheism & agnosticism to children if you hold of religious education until about 8-9, when they start to think critically. That is their natural starting point.

I suspect that is why religious education starts so young, at Sunday School even before kids start formal education. Get into their heads before they can question stuff

... hold off religious education