Failed phonics y1 phonics test & advanced reader

[Robindrama]

( I have another thread here but will post specific question as a separate one) any ideas will be much appreciated.

Ds in y1. Just had a parents evening. End of year prediction: reading above expectation, but will fail phonics test.
Question: how can that be possible?

School reading levels are 1-26, 26 free reader. End of y1 expected level is 17/18. DS is currently on level 20. Excellent reading and advanced comprehension.
Phonics tests results 23/40. Expected to fail the test. I will have a meeting with teachers shortly.

eddiemairswife I'm sure kids will make mistakes in the check, although reading a single word is different to skimming a sentence but to make mistakes more than 20% of the time seems unlikely! (assuming the threshold remains around 32/40)

I am a Specialist Teacher and Assessor, failing the phonics screening test would be an indication that further investigation and assessment may be needed. I would be particularly concerned if the child failed the Year 2 re-take of the screening test after an appropriate phonics based intervention.

After many years in primary education, I now work with secondary aged pupils with dyslexia many of whom are high academic achievers. The true impact of dyslexia often only becomes apparent for some pupils as both the workload and the intellectual demands of the work increase. Many of my pupils read relatively well, but lack fluency - lack of fluency can impact on comprehension. This often only becomes apparent as the read longer and more complex texts - they start off well and then their reading slows and becomes more disjointed as they get further into the text. As they get tired, cognitive resources are then focused on the process of actually reading, rather than on the meaning of the text .

My pupils with dyslexia often continue to have poor spelling. They are also negatively affected by their slow processing speed and by their difficulties with verbal memory (both characteristic features of dyslexia). They often find it difficult to proof read their own work and struggle with aspects like sequencing their work to provide a coherent structure. All of the above matter when taking exams - the new English Language GCSE awards 20% of the marks for spelling, punctuation and grammar and the pupils are required to read 19th century texts which may contain unfamiliar words.

For example an adult wouldn't sound a word out (unless a very long/unfamiliar one); their experience would mean that they recognise the whole word without having to

Student continue to meet new words throughout their education and need strategies to decode and read the word.

To the OP, if you DS does not pass the phonics screening test, but is coping with school, I would not rush out to get a dyslexia assessment, but I would keep it in mind if there are signs that he is not achieving his potential or is struggling in any way.

Sorry that was full of typos.

This happened to my daughter - she was/is a very good reader too. The teacher explained it to me as a pp says the words appear to be nonsense so she made sense of them. She said it was nothing to worry about and I didn't. She is now in year 4 and doing really well and is quite bright.

Feenie- "the method they have been taught" = synthetic phonics, the same as every other child in the cohort. Every child is different, though.

What I don't understand is all these 'bright' children who seem unable to understand the simple instruction that these are names of aliens so they won't be familiar, and to just read the sounds infront of them.

Also, how does a child who insists on reading all words as if they already know them cope with, for example, Oompa-Loompa or other 'made up' words?

I'' sorry to hijack the thread but I just wanted to ask if there are y1 sample phonics tests available online? We live in an area that doesn't do it ( non U.K.) and while DS is an advanced reader I have no idea how he fares in phonics. I know he's in the top phonics group and I'm pretty sure he sounds out unfamiliar words but there is likely some guessing going on as well. I'd be really interested to see how he'd do in the test.

I think at the age of 5 or 6 most children are still getting to grips with reading and naturally want to make sense of what they are reading. Trying to read "alien" words goes against that and can be confusing and therefore leads to them making mistakes in this type of test.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/phonics-screening-check-2016-materials
www.gov.uk/government/publications/phonics-screening-check-2015-materials

The implication from some PPs is that these children fail the phonics test because they have moved on and become good readers.

My DDs school does a mock phonics test each term or half term (I'm not sure which) until they take the real one. I don't know when exactly this starts for all children as they are all at different stages in their reading, but my DD certainly did this in year R and has continued in year 1.

If children did 'move beyond' their early phonics then I'd expect them to have performed well in earlier phonics tests and then start to trail off. If they have never performed well on phonics tests then it doesn't seem to me to be a matter of moving on, but of not having fully mastered phonics. So it should be possible to work out whether there is any validity in the idea of moving beyond phonics as an explanation.

Valeriemalorie I've never met a single Biff or Chip, those are surely completely alien words to 5 or 6 year olds, yet these and dozens of other names are found in learning to read books, the kids do get to grips with them surely. Why would other names be different?

Yes, they get to grips with them but find them probably strange at first.

I'm a layperson, but I volunteer in year 7 to read with children who do not have any SEN but who are behind their reading age. I would say that almost without exception they are "look and guess"ing. They seem to have missed a bit in the learning to read process. And it is usually surprisingly easy to fill in the gap.

But I really don't understand why a child who was already a good reader would not understand that the unfamiliar words were the names of aliens and needed to be read carefully. Does the teacher explain it to them in advance? I presume so. I wonder if there's an element of "oh, I can read proper books, this stuff's easy-peasy"

Thanks sir

I once had a parent go on about how her son was reading the Hobbit and how the phonics test confused him with nonsense words.

Sheer balderdash.

What is the consequence of failing the phonics test? Will they be held back from progressing to year 2? Does it reflect badly on the school?

I always thought phonics was one way to learn to read, but not necessarily the only way. It seems now though that phonics is the only thing being tested to determine a child's ability to read.

I never learned phonics, but I'm confident I can read.

Strix If a child doesn't meet the required standard in the phonics screening they should get phonics intervention in y2.

It reflects badly on the school if most children don't pass as it shows the school is not teaching phonics effectively.

Studies shows that phonics is the most effective strategy (in that that is the way to get the highest % of children to be able to read) and it is better than mixing it with other methods.

Phonics screening isn't a reading test as such. It is more about making sure the child has secure foundations.

I bet/hope you do know your phonics - if I wrote the made up word thropmumple I bet you would be able to read it, by segmenting the sounds and putting them together?

" "the method they have been taught" = synthetic phonics" no Brutus a corruption of phonics with guessing thrown in for good measure (and often some sight words because the teacher doesn't know those common exception words are meant to be decoded early) by teachers who genuinely believe that they are teaching SSP while still spouting utter carp (and you can convert that into another word if you wish).

Feenie- "the method they have been taught" = synthetic phonics, the same as every other child in the cohort.

Then who has taught them to sight read instead of using phonics? They clearly haven't received high quality synthetic phonics teaching since they 'struggle to decode'

Ah, I'm done here. I asked you to stop with the attacks and you didn't. I'm not in the best of moods and can't cope with this anymore.

Sorry, op.

How will the advanced reader who reads the alien word 'strom' as 'storm' read the real placename Stromness, if or when s/he encounters it?

how her son was reading the Hobbit and how the phonics test confused him with nonsense words

So how did he cope with words like 'Smaug'?

Yetti presumably your daughters school provided additional support for any child not achieving the expected score, as they are meant to do, otherwise you. Otherwise you might be reporting a very different story.

I'm afraid my sympathy is reserved for your struggling readers, Brutus. It's really not fair.