School transported children in a pupil's grandmother's car without my permission

[muppetsmum]

My 8 year old daughter had an away match today which I was planning on going to watch, and I got a phone message from school asking me if I was going, and if so would I mind taking my daughter and one or two others as they were short of seats on the minibus. I couldn't go in the end and left a message in reply to this effect. When my daughter came home, she told me that they had indeed been short of room on the bus and had asked some girls to go with parents/family who were going to the match. She volunteered, and, with two others, had made the 45 minute journey driven by one of the girls' grandmothers!!! We know the family, I happen to have met the lady in question and have no personal problem with them, but surely the school isn't allowed to just send kids off with 'unknown' family members, whose personal/medical history/driving ability/car safety are presumably not known to them? I'm normally very laid back about stuff, but surely somebody should have rung me to check I was OK with this? Not knowing anything about this granny's health, I would certainly not have been happy to have a 70+ year old driving 3 giggly, excited girls a significant distance. Am I going mad or is this totally unacceptable?

I think it was very nice of the grandmother to drive them, otherwise they would have missed the match. We sign a form saying it's OK. Would have been gutted if my kids had missed out because no one could be bothered/ were allowed to drive them.

Everybody knows that anyone over the age of 60 is decrepit and completely incapable of making sensible decisions. Hence the "grandmother" with 3 exclamation points.

Ageism is not merely accepted, it appears to be the norm.

You're quite right.
Obviously the school should have either cancelled the match or drawn names out of a hat for who couldn't go.

School wouldn't be getting any complaints about that would they?

This is the Outdoor Advisory Panels National Guidance for Transporting students in a private car . It is good practice however not legislation and you would need to check the schools policy.

What I find odd is that you knew there were not enough seats and they were asking parents I drive children. If you didn't wnat your child in a car with someone you don't or hardly know. That was your chance to say 'please don't allow dd into someone else's car, sorry but I can't do it' . So I don't really see where you are coming from?

I fail to see your issue. If you were going you would have driven other people's kids.

Or is the problem that this woman is elderly? My mum has car pooled for school, however she works there PT and has the relevant insurance. Her age certainly doesn't make a difference.

If the school would have cancelled or stopped some kids going there would be more complaints.

They should have drawn lots and told he rest of the kids if their patents couldn't transport them to match then they couldn't go. Which would have probably meant the match was cancelled. Ho hum!

Would you have given your permission if asked?

Would you have demanded your daughter travel on the bus and some other child be put at risk in the car of this half blind, half deaf, dodery old girl in her Austin Metro with manual windows and a choke (??)?

Also just because someone is younger it does not make them a better driver or their car in better condition.

Obviously it is never a child's fault if they are abducted, but as parents we do everything we can to arm them against this, and teaching them NEVER to get into a car with someone they know and trust, without a parent knowing exactly who they are with, and agreeing it is ok, is the FIRST PRINCIPLE of this.

Yes, of course.

Teacher "Mary, Sally- I know Mary's mum was going to drive you to the match, but she's just rung to say that she's held up at work, so Emily's granny's going to take you with Emily and Jane"

And you seriously expect Mary to say no?

The children weren't told to get in a car, the school asked for volunteers.

I assume that the school normally does have checked volunteers to help with lifts as presumably the team is always too big for the minibus. Are you one of those, OP? Do you know if others couldn't make it on the day?

If they are checked and you give permission to go with a checked volunteer (and I realise you didn't do
this so the school was wrong) then you would have no say in whether the driver was 20 or 70, as long as they had a license and insurance.

How did OP think her DD was going to get there?
She was asked to give a lift and she refused- therefore someone else would be asked.
At that point she should have made it clear that her DD was not to attend.
Would she have refused if asked?
And why on earth has grandmother got 3 exclamation marks after it? I hate this casual ageism.

I am over 60 yrs, my car insurance covers me for that sort of trip and I am CRB checked. I expect this volunteer was similar. I can't see any possible objection unless OP had told the school in writing that her DD can't play in away matches unless her mother has personally vetted the transport.
Did it not occur to OP to ask what would happen when she refused to give a lift?

charis Why place your DCs in the care of other adults if you don't trust the judgement of those adults?

You go out of your way to teach your DCs to disregard the adults whose care you place them in; how scary that must be for them, knowing that they may not be safe, and that they'll get into trouble with you for doing something they are told to do by the adult whose care you place them in.

The grandmother in question might be any age from 40 up.

the GM could have been 30 - what does it matter?

A further example to BertrandRussell

Teacher "Sally, I know Mary's mum was going to pick you up after school today, but she's just rung to say that she's had to take her baby to the doctor's. The baby's fine but she's running late. You and Sally will need to go home with Emily and her granny, and she'll get you and Mary from there"

If you had a breakdown of after school care, would you like your DC to take instruction from the teacher about the new arrangement? Or are no other parents and teachers competent to make adequate arrangements?

I'm assuming that the op had undergone a DBS check has supplied proof of insurance MOT snd her driving licence??
If so she is BVU as she would have been happy to have taken another child to this match and that child's mother could have said exactly the same (without the grandmother !!! comments)
Please tell us OP if you have??

If not

To be fair to OP, she was asked in a message by school to take others - there is no indication she would have agreed..

Did the grandma have spare booster seats for all these extra children?

I find that in general grandmothers are far better at controlling 'giggly, excited girls' - they have had plenty of experience and don't stand for any nonsense! There are lots of younger women on here who seem to have problems with disciplining other people's children. Personally I would have no compunction in stopping the car and refusing to drive on if thought them a danger. Not all 70+ women are doddery and incompetent!

So you let the school down at the last minute? And the school had to make alternative arrangements? As others said, have you been DBS checked?

For those saying that dc shouldn't get into a car without parental approval, surely the school is acting in loco parentis and dc should be able to get into a car after a teacher has asked them to? How likely us it that a school parent us going to abduct a child, Ffs?

In our lower school, parents are asked to transport dc on occasion. School provides car seats. But doesn't ask for DBS or mot certificates...

OP: did you submit your DBS, insurance and MOT documents when you volunteered to drive your DD and one or two others to this fixture?

As you think it's necessary to show competency and roadworthiness, presumably you did, or made a fuss at that point that their system needed to be strengthened.

Or did your concerns arise only because you did not like the sex/age/race/religion (or insert other (protected) characteristic irrelevant to the issue) of another volunteer - essentially someone just like you.

Why would the grandmother not conform to safety rules Someday? Presumably she often transports her grandchildren and is just as likely as OP to have booster seats.

Surely the school would have checked seats, insurance and DBS?
OP makes it sound as if they recruited some strange elderly lady who happened to be passing!