Father admitted to hospice abroad -- not permitted leave during term time

[eka]

Hello all,

My father has just been admitted to hospice, being given days or weeks to live. He's located in Germany. I've asked my daughter's primary school for a leave of absence during term time to go and see him and my family. Idea was to leave 5 days before the term time finishes so that we'd have more time over there. Guess what? Yup, I've not been granted permitted leave during term time, because the situation given is not an exceptional circumstance.

What?? Does my father die twice? Sorry, I'm obviously quite emotional about that. I do know that the headteacher will want me to go and fully understands, but that she can't give me the leave officially. And that's the part I don't understand. So my daughter's end of year report will state 5 days of unauthorised holidays?! It's not a holiday I'm going on -- we're not going to Disneyland, but rather the opposite.

Has anyone else experienced something similar? Or is it just my daughter's school that is that tight in giving a leave for exceptional circumstances? Would love to hear other stories.

Thanks. x

I personally never bow to the HT in these circumstances. My sons absence is never authorized, and I could not care. I know I have family obligations, I send my leave request in, know it will be met with the standard "I am afraid your request for holiday has been turned down. We do wish you a lovely time with your family". Lovely, eh.

There is no point in an appeal, you are wasting your time and brain space. Just go. But dont expect them to authorize it.

I agree that its because you've asked to go at the end of term ,to the school that doesn't come across as very urgent and sorry but I can see their POV . If its that important for you to be with your dad go now ,that said I wouldn't be worried about the school authorising anything - life's too short .

Just go. I have never taken DC out of school and am generally very anti term-time leave, but really just go.

So it will be unauthorised leave, it really doesn't matter.

I'd ring the LEA and speak to someone there. This strikes me as a case of serious pencil-pusheritis. However, the HT probably loses income to her school if children are away and is probably battling with many families to get them to stay.

You may need to supply medical documentation that this is occurring (we did in our case - but through the school. It was in English so that helped.).

I think this is a case where your father's rights as a grandparent need to be considered and your children's rights as grandchildren need to be considered. They may be too young to understand they're saying goodbye - but it will be comforting later (having been in this situation myself at 8 years of age, with one much loved grandfather. It's only now my own father is poorly, that I realise how important it is to the grandpa too!)

People who think waiting to end of term is an issue clearly don't travel often with three kids. It sometimes costs a FORTUNE to go last minute or for a weekend. Last time I looked at going to Ireland last minute for a funeral the price was over a grand. Waiting a few weeksbrought it down by nearly 700 quid.

I just disagree with the whole thing and the granting of such power to schools over important life events.

working, you have just hit the nail on the head in a different way than you think. Because everybody wants to travel a few day before the end of term, most HTs will think people are just trying to save money, so wont believe any one have a real emergency, yet can wait a few weeks to let their their emergency coincide with holidays....

working ,its Germany not the other side of the world ( unless the OP is in Australia) , if I'd had the chance to see my dad before he died sod the logistics and the cost I'd be there ,I wouldn't be waiting 2/3weeks and hoping he hangs on !

I'm afraid I agree - cost is not enough of an argument.

We were asked why couldn't we go for two weeks at Christmas over the longer holiday. I was able to demonstrate that this was likely to result in even more time off school because weather conditions that time of years often results in airports closing/ delays where we're from - which leads to missed connections and returning days later. We then have jetlag to fend off.

I request 4-5 days off depending on jet lag. I returned two very drowsy girls after 4 days off - we arrived 3 p.m. in england and they were at school 9 a.m. the next day. The school were grateful that we showed we didn't want to miss school and that we'd 'followed' procedure and therefore supported their new system.

I think it is worthwhile fighting for the right to have an exceptional circumstance - it does make it possible for other families to do the same in future.

HTH

So sorry op, what a horrible situation to be in.

If you do go to the head again, then I would ask her to define what she defines as exceptional circumstances as she is allowed to grant leave in exceptional circumstances. I bet she would think it was exceptional circumstances if it was her father/grandfather in a hospice in another country.

If the power does rest with her then it might be worth checking with your lea or even your mp beforehand so you you have all the facts with you so that if she tries to bluff you that the lea or whoever is responsible for her saying no, you can show her that actually, she is the one that has the power to say yes or no. And that she is the one that is saying that your father's death is unexceptional. Maybe if you can make it so personal she will realise how bad it is.

Also do make her commit to saying what she thinks exceptional circumstances are - or saying that there is nothing that she thinks is so exceptional that she would grant leave for, then follow up in writing to confirm everything she said.

Because once you have that, you can show that she is being unreasonable in her definition of exceptional. Then when you get back, and if they start going heavy on you, you have got something you can use to argue your case. Because the government obviously does expect there to be times that there are exceptional circumstances and people to take leave otherwise they would have said people can't take their kids out of school even if there are exceptional circumstances.

Good luck and I hope you get to see your dad without too much red tape from school.

the HT probably loses income to her school if children are away

No they don't. The school's income is decided by the number of pupils on the roll on a particular date. The level of absence doesn't enter into it at all.

The head may be worried about the school's Ofsted rating. That can be adversely affected by a high level of absenteeism. But even a poor rating from Ofsted does not have any direct financial consequences.

School cannot authorise the leave. They aren't stopping you from going, go anyway

Yup, another one saying fuck 'em.

I predict a big turnaround in this policy in a year or two's time... when there have been enough shocking stories in the press about this kind of situation arising.

Disgusting.

School cannot authorise the leave

Yes they can. It is the HT who is choosing not to. If the HT does not understand the law on this, then that is a further failing on top of bad attitude.

I am sorry to hear that. I think the school is alwasy tied up by those bureaucratic regulations and has a lot of ticks to do nowadays. I would just let the school know that I am taking her away since when and how long andbut be ready to get a fine from local council.

Don't give it a second thought. Take her out. Can you appeal it later? Really, how daft would the HT look if this went to the press. Let's hope the council has more common sense and empathy.

I don't like people taking their kids out of school for a cheap holiday, but this is a no brainer.

OP if you ended up in court with the threat of the £1,000 fine it would NEVER be a case they could win. Wishing you strength in the weeks ahead.x

Even if the school does not authorise it, as such, you can still take her out... what will actually happen? I took both my kids out of school last year for a 2 week holiday with all my husbands family who were visiting from NZ and Australia.... I never got a letter or anything from the LA.

Yes they can. It is the HT who is choosing not to.

I think that some heads, degenerating to the mentality of the age group they teach, are deliberately over-egging the position in the hope that a mum's army will rise up and overthrow the hated Gove. They are behaving unreasonably in order to, in their mind, force the issue. They still have power to authorise leave for "exceptional" circumstances. If they choose not to, they're choosing not to.

Let's face facts as someone has already pointed out ,if the OP had gone into school on Monday and said I'm taking the children to Germany to see their GP who is dying and we are leaving on Wednesday the HT would have said it was authorised ,that is an exceptional reason . It's not exceptional if you can plan it for 3 weeks and tack it onto your Christmas holiday ,sorry . OP I hope you get to see your dad x

"Just go ... does it matter that your children will have unauthorised absence in the circumstances."

I am an inveterate obeyer of rules, but I would do ^^ as well.

Obviously you will just go - the annoying thing is to be labelled as taking unauthorized leave - it's adding insult to injury.

This whole nonsense about begging for permission to take my own child out makes me so cross I can hardly bear to post any more about it.....

Seriously? A grand? Cost is 'not enough of an issue'? I'm afraid most people DON'T have this money. Last minute flights even to Ireland are regularly in this cost bracket at present. I know because I've been in the position myself though no children at school. Not many people actually have that money at their disposal, it's go for less in a few weeks or not at all.

Either way, I don't believe it should be within a school's power to say yes or No. I disagree vehemently with it and think it leads to inhumane decisions. It may currently be law but imo it is incredibly wrong.