Really annoyed - local primary does not 'do' visits

[drewsmum]

My DS is starting in reception next year and I have started to look around the schools I would like to apply to. All well and good, have 5 schools to see in the next 2weeks.

However, the primary just down the road from us, in catchment area, has responded to email and telephone requests for a visit to look around with "we are so popular that we don't have to promote ourselves so no, you can't visit". The other reason given was they can't do visits because of staffing levels.

I am thoroughly ticked off by this- if all the other schools can accommodate visits why can't this one? And how precisely am I going to compare this school with all the others to be able to rank it? I suppose what they're saying is if you don't rank it 1st then forget it so why would you even want to look around.

WWYD? Ask to speak to head teacher to have questions answered? Hang out by school gates and ask parents what they think of the school? Would LEA or governors be of any help?

Advice appreciated!

They may be undersubscribed in future, it doesn't do to be too complacent. There is no way I would send my DC to a school that I hadn't seen on a normal working day and where the Head was too important busy to see me.

I moved dd mid year so I visited first and was shown round by a boy on an internal exclusion (who absolutely loved the school and knew he deserved the internal exclusion) and then chatted with the headmaster.
When I took dd to visit the headmaster showed us round answering all dd's questions and offered us a weeks trial.
It was because his approach was totally open and transparent that we opted for that school tbh.
I wouldn't have placed dd in a school I hadn't visited.

This sounds like a very useful heads up on the attitude of the school. I would run a mile frankly. I visited two different schools when choosing for DS, on both occasions the head teacher showed us around during the course of a normal morning and devoted a couple of hours to discussing the school, our needs etc. We were bowled over by both. I wouldn't send my child to a school I had never visited.

Is Business Manager just a new term for Bursar?

No

Well it sounds like one to me. Nothing new about these tasks being done by someone other than the head.

School Business Manager Roles
?Prepare budget
?Prepare reports for governors and LA
?Track performance to budget
?Manage some support staff
?Liaise with LA when HR queries arise
Premises management
?Manage contracted-in services/ SLAs
?Insurance
?Update policies
?Part of bursar networks to share best practices
?Lettings
?Before and after school clubs
?Lunchtime management
?Fundraising and grant-writing
?3 year budgeting
?Provide advice on optimising spending
?Ensure standards and compliance
?Manage support staff
?Administer performance management processes for all staff
?Provide expertise on legal issues
?H&S, fire and risk management
?Manage capital projects
?Manage ICT/ MIS systems
?School marketing
?Develop policies
?External agency relationship management
?Manage extended services provision
?Liaise with parents on non-T&L
?Main liaison with other schools on non-T&L matters
?Shared services roles
?Lead multi-year financial planning
?Redesign financial systems
?Negotiate major business partnerships
?Reconfiguration/ optimisation of staffing (across network)
?Design performance management systems
?Dispute resolution
?Talent management strategies
?IT-enablement
?Large-scale project management (e.g. BSF; site reconfiguration)
?Set-up and develop very broad service lines
?Manage multi-agency relationships
?Help realise federations
?Explore/ promote federations SBD

It's a much bigger role as you can see

I wouldn't send my cat to a cattery that wouldn't let me look round! I am quite shocked-all the schools in this area encourage attending their Open Days or making an appointment with the head to look round. They like to show off their schools I think.

Ask to have an appointment with the Head

coccyx The OP will probably find the head doesn't 'do' appointments either.

My Dds now-school was the only one that said 'pop round whenever is convenient'. To be fair, we were shown round by the office lady not the head, but she turned out to have a Dd at the school and was very positive and chatty about it. She was a great ambassador.

My Dd did spend some time in a nursery that would only allow parents visits during nap time

I think that just for devilment I would send the Head a whole list of very detailed questions-I would use the prospectus to make them up so that she couldn't fob me off with the prospectus. I would end with a suggestion that it might be quicker and easier to see me! If she wouldn't reply I would sent it to the governors.

weird, weird, weird. Why wouldn't you be welcoming (or at least courteous) to prospective parents?
Our lovely Head shows parents round himself, even if they just turn up (providing he's free, obv.) And I would say the vast majority of those who he shows round end up sending their kids. I think it;s very rude and....just odd....not to allow parents round.

exotic - am going to do just that, will try calling to book appointment with head and if no joy then will send a letter but can't even get a prospectus for the school as website has been down for 'routine maintenance' for about 3 weeks now ( as long as I have been checking it to find out about open days at least).

Sparkling - love the cattery analogy, I think I looked at 4 kennels before finding one that I would be happy leaving my dog in while away on holidays....!!!

The cattery let you pick up and drop off whenever you like. I dropped by to have a look around without warning. They were lovely!

You have us all intrigued with what will happen next with the school.

Do let us know.

I work in an infant school and we have an open day and we allow parents to come for visits at other times too. It is not that hard to find time to do it and it is not disruptive to teachers and pupils ime.

I would look less favourably on a school that didn't allow prospective parents to come and have a look round.

Oh, and although were I work is not an oustanding school it is over subscribed and we currently have a reasonably large waiting list for the current reception classes - but we still see the importance of open days and parent visits.

I actually prefer seperate visits to open days generally as I want to see the school on a proper working day, not when set up to look at its best. I also took DD with us so that I could see how the staff related to a child too.

I don't see why being oversubscribed & therefore needing to weed out applications is a problem for the school - the LA deals with admissions, the number of applications doesn't affect the school in terms of admin surely. (Unless they manage their own - is it an academy? Even then they would probably still be processed by the LA).

I'm lucky enough to live in an area with oversubscribed outstanding schools, with tiny catchment areas - they all hold Open Days, the heads speak at them all, teachers and parent volunteers show people around, the Yr 6 pupils help out. You get a fantastic feel for each school & therefore can feel very happy about the choice you're making.

No exciting news today, did call office today and ask to make an appointment with the HT; said they would have to look in the diary and took my details, said someone would get back to me. Waiting with bated breath.....

It gets worse. I would have expected a reply today (or is that expecting too much). Let's hope there's a gap in the diary-it doesn't take long to check does it?

Call again tomorrow morning ... and afternoon ... and morning....and afternoon...

Though in all seriousness this school ought to be sinking lower and lower on your list of preferences!

I'm clutching at straws here, but I would definitely say don't judge a school by its receptionist. They can say some daft things but the head and teachers might still be great, and the receptionist might have got the job for being very organised, to the extent that they decided to overlook her tactlessness. However "staffing issues" might mean "since the Ofsted report things have fallen apart".

As for the "Business Manager" though:'Due to the high number of requests for our reception classes, it is not normal practice for us to have Open Days at this early stage. As part of our admission process, successful applicants will be invited to school for an induction.' That's ghastly. sounds like someone with a background in business not education. In fact, sounds like someone who's been thrown out of the business world for poor communication and use of stilted beaurocratic language!

Surely you can make it your mission to track down existing parents and take them out drinking until you get the lowdown?